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ArtCaffe - The Racist Hotel at it Again
masukuma
#61 Posted : Wednesday, October 14, 2015 3:16:35 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
ZZE123 wrote:
masukuma wrote:
kyt wrote:
mnaendanga huko kufanya nini?

coz we can! is that a good enough answer?

Then stop complaining when you are treated like a 2nd Generation citizen

I won't... coz I am not! You may have accepted your place as a 2nd "Generation"/Class citizen...And that is good for you! You may have accepted that your children are faulty because they are black.... You may have accepted the tiny corner you have been apportioned .... I have not!
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
mkenyan
#62 Posted : Wednesday, October 14, 2015 3:23:55 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 4/1/2009
Posts: 1,885
my take, it's hard to know if art cafe is racist as claimed. taking the complaint of the facebook guy who started all these he's a tad full of himself (just check some of the posts he makes on facebook) so may have expected to be treated like a vip and so just throwing a tuntrum. see how he mentions the big state corporation honcho he was with (or whatever big guy he was with).

i go to art cafe frequently (have great lattes) and other coffee houses and have never noticed any racism. one thing i have however noticed is that for the ones i frequent a lot i have gotten to know the service staff a bit (small chats, how's work, how's family, how's your day, you look depressed today etc) which comes normal to a place one frequents. what this means is that i at times even get served before those who arrive ahead of me. if i were white it might be considered racism by those 'skipped'...racism is unfortunately there in kenya but at times i believe we look too hard for it, even where it is not.
Alba
#63 Posted : Wednesday, October 14, 2015 11:57:55 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 12/27/2012
Posts: 2,256
Location: Bandalungwa
Kenyans complaining about racism yet we are among the most tribalistic societies on earth.
Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly

- We insult each other on social media based on tribe
- Turn on each other with pangas
- Hire and promote based on tribe
- Vote based on tribe
- Defend incompetent officials based on tribe
- Defend corruption and land grabbers based on tribe

These are all life and death issues. The restaurant with waiters who do not serve baafrigha is not a life and death issue.

This is a classic case of removing the log in the eye before worrying about the speck in the friends eye.

Or better still its a case of the pot and the kettle.

Kenyans have no leg to stand on when talking about discrimination.
dunkang
#64 Posted : Thursday, October 15, 2015 6:42:55 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 6/2/2011
Posts: 4,824
Location: -1.2107, 36.8831
mkenyan wrote:
......racism is unfortunately there in kenya but at times i believe we look too hard for it, even where it is not.

@Alba, this is what you should know.

"Tribalism is here in Kenya, but, not everything needs to be explained as tribalism"
Receive with simplicity everything that happens to you.” ― Rashi

hardwood
#65 Posted : Thursday, October 15, 2015 7:35:02 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/28/2015
Posts: 9,562
Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
Quote:
rac·ism
ˈrāˌsizəm/
noun

prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on the belief that one's own race is superior.


How is it racism when it is a black waiter discriminating a black customer?
masukuma
#66 Posted : Thursday, October 15, 2015 7:59:46 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
Alba wrote:
Kenyans complaining about racism yet we are among the most tribalistic societies on earth.
Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly

- We insult each other on social media based on tribe
- Turn on each other with pangas
- Hire and promote based on tribe
- Vote based on tribe
- Defend incompetent officials based on tribe
- Defend corruption and land grabbers based on tribe

These are all life and death issues. The restaurant with waiters who do not serve baafrigha is not a life and death issue.

This is a classic case of removing the log in the eye before worrying about the speck in the friends eye.

Or better still its a case of the pot and the kettle.

Kenyans have no leg to stand on when talking about discrimination.

Sometimes you people surprise me - racism and tribalism lower the dignity of a person. The biggest issue here is exactly what I once said
"Individuality and Groupings..." Where you as an individual is being muzzled for the sins of others! Why should I not complain when my personal rights are infringed on? Should you not complain when you show up for a public job interview and you are rejected based on parameters you cannot change? Should you not been complain when you go to a public office and cannot be served based on parameters you cannot change?
Where you get it wrong is when you think private decisions like who to marry or voting are actually supposed to be based on some metric other than what the person making the decision thinks is important.

You need to learn to accept that there are individual decisions such as marriage and voting or who I choose to accomodate in my house that individuals have a right to choose the metric HOWEVER there are decisions of PUBLIC OFFICE and PUBLIC PLACES that the decision maker should not use single variables to discriminate who to give service or who not to.

@hardwood - what is it then?
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
Swenani
#67 Posted : Thursday, October 15, 2015 10:07:44 AM
Rank: User

Joined: 8/15/2013
Posts: 13,237
Location: Vacuum
I'm always treated like a king in amaica restaurant,affordable healthy foods...hakuna junk food huko na racism
If Obiero did it, Who Am I?
Anti_Burglar
#68 Posted : Thursday, October 15, 2015 10:32:56 AM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 9/11/2015
Posts: 1,024
masukuma wrote:
Alba wrote:
Kenyans complaining about racism yet we are among the most tribalistic societies on earth.
Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly

- We insult each other on social media based on tribe
- Turn on each other with pangas
- Hire and promote based on tribe
- Vote based on tribe
- Defend incompetent officials based on tribe
- Defend corruption and land grabbers based on tribe

These are all life and death issues. The restaurant with waiters who do not serve baafrigha is not a life and death issue.

This is a classic case of removing the log in the eye before worrying about the speck in the friends eye.

Or better still its a case of the pot and the kettle.

Kenyans have no leg to stand on when talking about discrimination.

Sometimes you people surprise me - racism and tribalism lower the dignity of a person. The biggest issue here is exactly what I once said
"Individuality and Groupings..." Where you as an individual is being muzzled for the sins of others! Why should I not complain when my personal rights are infringed on? Should you not complain when you show up for a public job interview and you are rejected based on parameters you cannot change? Should you not been complain when you go to a public office and cannot be served based on parameters you cannot change?
Where you get it wrong is when you think private decisions like who to marry or voting are actually supposed to be based on some metric other than what the person making the decision thinks is important.

You need to learn to accept that there are individual decisions such as marriage and voting or who I choose to accomodate in my house that individuals have a right to choose the metric HOWEVER there are decisions of PUBLIC OFFICE and PUBLIC PLACES that the decision maker should not use single variables to discriminate who to give service or who not to.

@hardwood - what is it then?



See, even you recognize these things.
Alba
#69 Posted : Thursday, October 15, 2015 4:18:03 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 12/27/2012
Posts: 2,256
Location: Bandalungwa
masukuma wrote:
[
Sometimes you people surprise me - racism and tribalism lower the dignity of a person. The biggest issue here is exactly what I once said
"Individuality and Groupings..." Where you as an individual is being muzzled for the sins of others! Why should I not complain when my personal rights are infringed on? Should you not complain when you show up for a public job interview and you are rejected based on parameters you cannot change? Should you not been complain when you go to a public office and cannot be served based on parameters you cannot change?


You are blowing this out of proportion. This thread is about mwafrigha waiters who do not want to serve their fellow Baafrigha.

No one's rights are being infringed. if you do not like this restaurant, you can go to a different restaurant.

This has nothing to do with job interviews.
Quote:

Where you get it wrong is when you think private decisions like who to marry or voting are actually supposed to be based on some metric other than what the person making the decision thinks is important.


I never said I have a problem with whom people marry.

I do have a problem with people hacking each other with pangas and calling each other names on facebook.
I have a problem when public figures are hired based on tribal arithmetic. This includes individuals who are in charge of the safety of the public.
I have a problem when public money is wasted on white elephants based on ethnic calculations

Are you suggesting that this behaviour is acceptable?


Quote:
You need to learn to accept that there are individual decisions such as marriage and voting or who I choose to accomodate in my house that individuals have a right to choose the metric HOWEVER there are decisions of PUBLIC OFFICE and PUBLIC PLACES that the decision maker should not use single variables to discriminate who to give service or who not to.


I don't care about marriage so don't try to put words in my mouth.

My point is that if people choose to vote based on ethnic calculations , if people defend corruption on a tribal basis, if people defend incompetent officials on a tribal basis then do not complain if issues like crime, unemployment, safety, or traffic.



hardwood
#70 Posted : Thursday, October 15, 2015 4:56:11 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/28/2015
Posts: 9,562
Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
Impunity wrote:
masukuma wrote:
has anyone every wondered why only Africans were taken as slaves in such large numbers over a period of time? I mean... those places in the americas had people... why were they not enslaved in large numbers? my opinion.... KUNA VITU HAWANGE FANYA!!!

Nyeuthis were enslaved enmasse because they were as tough as the beasts burden...yaani PHUNDA.


http://archive.adl.org/h...acism.html#.Vh-v7eGhddg

C&P

Africans were not originally considered inferior. When Portuguese sailors first explored Africa in the 15th and 16th centuries, they came upon empires and cities as advanced as their own, and they considered Africans to be serious rivals. Over time, though, as African civilizations failed to match the technological advances of Europe, and the major European powers began to plunder the continent and forcibly remove its inhabitants to work as slave laborers in new colonies across the Atlantic, Africans came to be seen as a deficient "species," as "savages." To an important extent, this view was necessary to justify the slave trade at a time when Western culture had begun to promote individual rights and human equality. The willingness of some Africans to sell other Africans to European slave traders also led to claims of savagery, based on the false belief that the "dark people" were all kinsmen, all part of one society - as opposed to many different, sometimes warring nations.
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