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Cytonn Investments
Rank: Member Joined: 11/21/2018 Posts: 564 Location: Britain
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Balaa wrote:Kabird wrote:eco wrote:The growth of Cytonn Investments within the past one year is phenomenal. This is a company to watch for long-term private equity investors like myself. I am on-board! Greed kills companies. Allow me to throw a spanner in the works. I am just done rereading "The Art of War" and "48 Laws of Power" for the umpteenth time. I'm wondering about the possibility that there couldn't be a secret hand in Mr Dande's woes. It's no secret that his style has been perceived as abrasive by some, and most likely he must have stepped on some influential people's toes while rubbing them the wrong way. When feeling slighted, some people will hunt you down until you're toast. (Ref: Law 15 "Crash your enemy totally"; Law 19 "Know who you're dealing with- do not offend the wrong person"; Law 42 "Strike the shepherd and the sheep will scatter") Retribution??? Settling scores??? Getting even??? C'est la vie - it's the unfortunate reality of life. This is a subtle admission of a bubble that has finally burst. On this one, its naive to blame third parties for the current predicament Cytonn finds itself in. Simply put, Cytonn management DID NOT have a proper grasp of the main area of their investment which is the Real Estate development. Real Estate development is more complicated than many people imagine. It's only professionals in that field who properly understand the intricacies involved. @PaulKimani, to his credit, has all along warned Wazuans that Cytonn is a house built on sand. Instead of people taking heed, some opted to hurl insults in his direction and at his person. Cytonn was a scam and this thing was always going to end up in premium tears for the gullible and greedy investors. The elephant in the room was always going to be the unrealistic and hence the unsustainable interest rate promised to investors. The bubble had to burst, and indeed the bubble has ultimately burst.
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Rank: Chief Joined: 1/3/2007 Posts: 18,120 Location: Nairobi
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Balaa wrote:Kabird wrote:eco wrote:The growth of Cytonn Investments within the past one year is phenomenal. This is a company to watch for long-term private equity investors like myself. I am on-board! Greed kills companies. Allow me to throw a spanner in the works. I am just done rereading "The Art of War" and "48 Laws of Power" for the umpteenth time. I'm wondering about the possibility that there couldn't be a secret hand in Mr Dande's woes. It's no secret that his style has been perceived as abrasive by some, and most likely he must have stepped on some influential people's toes while rubbing them the wrong way. When feeling slighted, some people will hunt you down until you're toast. (Ref: Law 15 "Crash your enemy totally"; Law 19 "Know who you're dealing with- do not offend the wrong person"; Law 42 "Strike the shepherd and the sheep will scatter") Retribution??? Settling scores??? Getting even??? C'est la vie - it's the unfortunate reality of life. I am not an investor in Cytonn nor a detractor. I wish them the best. IMHO, Dande & Co were overly ambitious and bit off too much. Too many projects, etc. This is not some "Art of War" thing but a cashflow issue. If they can pay off Thogo et al per the original contracts then all will be back to normal. Bila pesa/cash, they need to sit down and make deals with each investor. Perhaps the best way out remains the investors "buy" an apartment. Some may want cash and not an apartment but mta-do if Cytonn collapses? Look at ARM. One bank (with the smallest loan) took ARM into receivership. Now the firm was broken up and lots of people from staff to unsecured lenders to creditors to shareholders lost. Even the cash from the sale of ARM TZ was grabbed by GoT/TRA! Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 1/20/2011 Posts: 1,820 Location: Nakuru
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VituVingiSana wrote: I am not an investor in Cytonn nor a detractor. I wish them the best.
IMHO, Dande & Co were overly ambitious and bit off too much. Too many projects, etc. This is not some "Art of War" thing but a cashflow issue. If they can pay off Thogo et al per the original contracts then all will be back to normal.
Bila pesa/cash, they need to sit down and make deals with each investor. Perhaps the best way out remains the investors "buy" an apartment. Some may want cash and not an apartment but mta-do if Cytonn collapses?
Look at ARM. One bank (with the smallest loan) took ARM into receivership. Now the firm was broken up and lots of people from staff to unsecured lenders to creditors to shareholders lost. Even the cash from the sale of ARM TZ was grabbed by GoT/TRA! Speaking of ARM, why has CMA not de-listed it from NSE? Dumb money becomes dumb only when it listens to smart money
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 1/10/2015 Posts: 961 Location: Kenya
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Lawyer wants Cytonn, CMA probed over Sh44million fraud https://www.the-star.co....-over-sh44million-fraud/Proverbs 13:11 Dishonest money dwindles away, but whoever gathers money little by little makes it grow.
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Rank: Member Joined: 1/22/2015 Posts: 682
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I live next door to the Alma which is probably Cytonn's largest project to date. This project was moving at express speed in the first few years of construction. Everyday the site was full of workers doing their thing the whole day. There was clearly money in the bank to fund all the activity. Now the progress of the project has become very stop-start. Clearly these guys are not as liquid as before. They're scrounging around for money to plough into the business. At this point you have to wonder what the difference is between this and building on your own. Anyway the silver lining is that, slow as the progress may be, this project is now too far along to fail. They will most likely cross the finish line eventually.
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Rank: Member Joined: 1/19/2016 Posts: 204
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Cytonn invites bids for this 4 acre land in Kilimani. They’ve run out of cash kabisa. Liquidation hearing this month also. https://kenyanbusinessfe...-prime-land-in-kilimani/
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Rank: Member Joined: 1/19/2016 Posts: 204
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Rank: Member Joined: 1/22/2015 Posts: 682
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The figures are off in that article. I don't think Cytonn's high yield product ever had more than 100m AUM. People were suspicious of that thing.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/7/2012 Posts: 11,908
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paulkimani wrote:[quote=aemathenge]21 Njaanuary 2021 is not very far away.
See you in Court.
And May The Best Lawyer Win. Instead of worrying about the best lawyer winning and making it a game, maybe us Kenyans can start having some compassion for our innocent friends like Mr Thogo below, a farmer, who trusted Cytonn with his hard earned savings.
The truth is he will probably never see that money again, and the four founders of Cytonn will be rolling in cash, while Mr Thogo struggles to survive. God bless him and may he win. Let us have compassion for our fellow men, rather than side with common thieves.
“Mr Thogo also wants the outstanding amount, together with interest and the cost of the insolvency petition granted to him and paid out of Cytonn’s assets. Mr Thogo adds that all his phone calls to various representatives of the company are met with different stories, which take him round in circles with no real intention of settling the matter.” https://nation.africa/ke...over-sh14m-debt-3224664[/quote] So how did the winding up petition go?  In the business world, everyone is paid in two coins - cash and experience. Take the experience first; the cash will come later - H Geneen
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Rank: Elder Joined: 9/23/2009 Posts: 8,083 Location: Enk are Nyirobi
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Angelica _ann wrote:paulkimani wrote:[quote=aemathenge]21 Njaanuary 2021 is not very far away.
See you in Court.
And May The Best Lawyer Win. Instead of worrying about the best lawyer winning and making it a game, maybe us Kenyans can start having some compassion for our innocent friends like Mr Thogo below, a farmer, who trusted Cytonn with his hard earned savings.
The truth is he will probably never see that money again, and the four founders of Cytonn will be rolling in cash, while Mr Thogo struggles to survive. God bless him and may he win. Let us have compassion for our fellow men, rather than side with common thieves.
“Mr Thogo also wants the outstanding amount, together with interest and the cost of the insolvency petition granted to him and paid out of Cytonn’s assets. Mr Thogo adds that all his phone calls to various representatives of the company are met with different stories, which take him round in circles with no real intention of settling the matter.” https://nation.africa/ke...over-sh14m-debt-3224664[/quote] So how did the winding up petition go? Let @PaulKimani enjoy his dancing on Cytonn's grave Life is short. Live passionately.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 1/20/2011 Posts: 1,820 Location: Nakuru
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/2/2009 Posts: 2,458 Location: Nairobi
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With top management changes at the rival company,We hope @paulkimani and the rest of the paid noisemakers will have their last cheque and exit the scene quietly.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/26/2007 Posts: 6,514
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poundfoolish wrote:
With top management changes at the rival company,We hope @paulkimani and the rest of the paid noisemakers will have their last cheque and exit the scene quietly.
Has @paulkimani ever been paid his money? Money talks, b*llsh*t walks. Business opportunities are like buses,there's always another one coming
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Rank: Elder Joined: 9/23/2009 Posts: 8,083 Location: Enk are Nyirobi
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People are being sued https://m.facebook.com/s...&ref=content_filter
Life is short. Live passionately.
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Rank: Member Joined: 1/19/2016 Posts: 204
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People are being SUED by CYTONN for writing on social media that they have not been paid. Investors have not been paid and yet a company is trying to silence them. Our constitution allows for free speech. Cytonn is trying to stop an investor having the right to freedom of speech. Let that sink in. Cytonn is using a baseless legal tactic to try stall attention away from The Fact they have not paid clients. This suit will not hold in a court of law. A QUOTE: ‘Cytonn Investments has chosen to sue a Kenyan pilot after he chose to vent his frustrations with the company on his social media pages over their failure to commit to refund his investments with the firm running into millions of shillings. Do you think Cytonn has any moral justifications to do this?This case should be very interesting for would be investors in Kenya’, Jaybee Matheka posted on his Facebook page.“ Link: https://kenyanmarketinte...plights-on-social-media/
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/18/2008 Posts: 3,434 Location: Kerugoya
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[quote=paulkimani]People are being SUED by CYTONN for writing on social media that they have not been paid. Investors have not been paid and yet a company is trying to silence them. Our constitution allows for free speech. Cytonn is trying to stop an investor having the right to freedom of speech. Let that sink in. Cytonn is using a baseless legal tactic to try stall attention away from The Fact they have not paid clients. This suit will not hold in a court of law. A QUOTE: ‘Cytonn Investments has chosen to sue a Kenyan pilot after he chose to vent his frustrations with the company on his social media pages over their failure to commit to refund his investments with the firm running into millions of shillings. Do you think Cytonn has any moral justifications to do this?This case should be very interesting for would be investors in Kenya’, Jaybee Matheka posted on his Facebook page.“ Link: https://kenyanmarketinte...lights-on-social-media/[/quote] 21 Njaanuary 2021 is long gone. What become of THAT Court Case? Pray do tell.
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Rank: Member Joined: 1/19/2016 Posts: 204
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“ The regulator expressed its concern that Cytonn High Yield Solutions (CHYS), one of the funds managed by the firm and debt security raised from investors dubbed Cytonn Project Notes pose risks to investing public.”
Even when the regulator has warned the public time and time again that Cytonn is a risk, you prefer to believe a Facebook status from the CEO of the risky company who is throwing a hissy fit that his client told everyone they are a risk on social media Hahaha
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Rank: Member Joined: 1/19/2016 Posts: 204
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Find out yourself, I’m not your servant aemathenge wrote:[quote=paulkimani]People are being SUED by CYTONN for writing on social media that they have not been paid. Investors have not been paid and yet a company is trying to silence them. Our constitution allows for free speech. Cytonn is trying to stop an investor having the right to freedom of speech. Let that sink in. Cytonn is using a baseless legal tactic to try stall attention away from The Fact they have not paid clients. This suit will not hold in a court of law. A QUOTE: ‘Cytonn Investments has chosen to sue a Kenyan pilot after he chose to vent his frustrations with the company on his social media pages over their failure to commit to refund his investments with the firm running into millions of shillings. Do you think Cytonn has any moral justifications to do this?This case should be very interesting for would be investors in Kenya’, Jaybee Matheka posted on his Facebook page.“ Link: https://kenyanmarketinte...lights-on-social-media/[/quote] 21 Njaanuary 2021 is long gone. What become of THAT Court Case? Pray do tell.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/18/2008 Posts: 3,434 Location: Kerugoya
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paulkimani wrote:Find out yourself, I’m not your servant The fun part is that I don't need to. You would be screaming from the Mountain top for all the universe and the galaxy to hear had Cytonn, in any way, "lost".
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 10/11/2009 Posts: 1,223
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paulkimani wrote:“ The regulator expressed its concern that Cytonn High Yield Solutions (CHYS), one of the funds managed by the firm and debt security raised from investors dubbed Cytonn Project Notes pose risks to investing public.”
Even when the regulator has warned the public time and time again that Cytonn is a risk, you prefer to believe a Facebook status from the CEO of the risky company who is throwing a hissy fit that his client told everyone they are a risk on social media Hahaha Cytonn should also sue you for bursting our eardrums with your hypotheses on cytonn! I suppose Wazua will put a strong defense team to advance your agenda. History will not remember you for your IQ. It will remember you for what you did. “Genius is 1 percent inspiration, 99 percent perspiration.” Thomas Edison
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