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Why investing in the NSE is fool's gold and a waste
Rank: Elder Joined: 6/20/2007 Posts: 2,074 Location: Lagos, Nigeria
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Folks am not really bothered about the downward trend rather I go for dividends that are incremental or constant on few counters with yoy profit growth . Those ones will recover I due time . KCB, STANCHART, SAFCOM, JUB are just a few. Most likely JUB will retain ritual ie 1:10 bonus every other year. FY 2018 is another one. The wazua spirit as members is to educate and inform and learn from others within the limit of what we know in any chosen area irrespective of our differences in tribes, nationalities, etc. .
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Rank: Member Joined: 1/15/2010 Posts: 625
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the deal wrote:I wonder what you people will be posting once the bull run returns... We are closer to the bottom than before!
The NSE is like any business... There are good and bad times unfortunately these are the bad times at the NSE... Stay strong... What if things get worse at the NSE? Because there is no magic cure for the poor performance of the bourse. We have had a string of companies going bankrupt or getting deregistered from the NSE. The GEMS segment doesn't seem to attract any high quality businesses. So it seems that the NSE might itself have a fundamental problem; there are likely less than 20 investable companies in the NSE whereas in the real world there are a lot of well performing businesses who are quietly making money and see no urgency or need to list at the NSE. If this pipeline problem is not corrected, we will have an NSE that doesn't really reflect the economy and is full of old companies. The only people who have made real money at the NSE are the shareholders who have listed their companies at the NSE as a way to liquidate their positions as well as facilitators like the brokers, legal and accounting firms. The guys waiting to buy at the NSE will likely be getting a fully priced, potentially overvalued company to buy into.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 1/8/2018 Posts: 2,212 Location: DC (Dustbowl County)
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mv_ufanisi wrote:
What if things get worse at the NSE? Because there is no magic cure for the poor performance of the bourse. We have had a string of companies going bankrupt or getting deregistered from the NSE. The GEMS segment doesn't seem to attract any high quality businesses.
So it seems that the NSE might itself have a fundamental problem; there are likely less than 20 investable companies in the NSE whereas in the real world there are a lot of well performing businesses who are quietly making money and see no urgency or need to list at the NSE. If this pipeline problem is not corrected, we will have an NSE that doesn't really reflect the economy and is full of old companies.
The only people who have made real money at the NSE are the shareholders who have listed their companies at the NSE as a way to liquidate their positions as well as facilitators like the brokers, legal and accounting firms. The guys waiting to buy at the NSE will likely be getting a fully priced, potentially overvalued company to buy into.
Brilliantly put. Look at Home Afrika. Listed with fanfare and it was all a shell. The guy who cashed out went on to produce several more shells in the private sector including the dead in the water Longonot Gate venture that is yet to even construct a decent road through the land in 8 years! Let alone a much taunted golf resort city! The only major structure constructed is a gate - pun fully intended. Kurwitu which has never traded a single share in years  - complete fraud. NBK, HFCK; all shells that should have collapsed decades ago - have been exposed multiple times by insiders that they are scrap metal with funny accounting and BILLIONS in hidden loans in default but very few pay attention. The "Sameer squad" companies - all speculative frauds. Tens of delisted companies - all fraudulent. KQ, Uchumi - all frauds struggling to climb out of massive looting sprees. Frauds left right and centre. The NSE long stopped tracking/being a barometer for the red hawtt 5%+ growth of the real economy because it does NOT reflect the real economy. Dumping a huge cache of one's monies in NSE is like playing real Russian Roulette with a friend for several hours and hoping to make it to work safely the next day. Gamble with a few coins..that is fine..but to invest big chunks...a big no no IMHO.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 8/28/2015 Posts: 1,247
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MugundaMan wrote:mv_ufanisi wrote:
What if things get worse at the NSE? Because there is no magic cure for the poor performance of the bourse. We have had a string of companies going bankrupt or getting deregistered from the NSE. The GEMS segment doesn't seem to attract any high quality businesses.
So it seems that the NSE might itself have a fundamental problem; there are likely less than 20 investable companies in the NSE whereas in the real world there are a lot of well performing businesses who are quietly making money and see no urgency or need to list at the NSE. If this pipeline problem is not corrected, we will have an NSE that doesn't really reflect the economy and is full of old companies.
The only people who have made real money at the NSE are the shareholders who have listed their companies at the NSE as a way to liquidate their positions as well as facilitators like the brokers, legal and accounting firms. The guys waiting to buy at the NSE will likely be getting a fully priced, potentially overvalued company to buy into.
Brilliantly put. Look at Home Afrika. Listed with fanfare and it was all a shell. The guy who cashed out went on to produce several more shells in the private sector including the dead in the water Longonot Gate venture that is yet to even construct a decent road through the land in 8 years! Let alone a much taunted golf resort city! The only major structure constructed is a gate - pun fully intended. Kurwitu which has never traded a single share in years - complete fraud. NBK, HFCK; all shells that should have collapsed decades ago - have been exposed multiple times by insiders that they are scrap metal with funny accounting and BILLIONS in hidden loans in default but very few pay attention. The "Sameer squad" companies - all speculative frauds. Tens of delisted companies - all fraudulent. KQ, Uchumi - all frauds struggling to climb out of massive looting sprees. Frauds left right and centre. The NSE long stopped tracking/being a barometer for the red hawtt 5%+ growth of the real economy because it does NOT reflect the real economy. Dumping a huge cache of one's monies in NSE is like playing real Russian Roulette with a friend for several hours and hoping to make it to work safely the next day. Gamble with a few coins..that is fine..but to invest big chunks...a big no no IMHO. The best investment in Kenya is hitting. If you can't beat them, join them. Or just leave them and continue getting the hits. Hiyo ingine ni porojo tu. You can not be comfortable anywhere in this country if you are not one of the following cliques, the hitters or the perpectual/ tirelss care givers (hitted) Kam uko hapo katikati nikuangaika tu! So, it's not so late to adjust your new years resolutions and lifestyle. Choose your legue/playground wisely. Mwanaume ni kukazana kunyongana na kukwepa kunyolewa ama kuvumilia kunyongwa na kunyolewa  ,Behold, a sower went forth to sow;....
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Rank: Elder Joined: 1/8/2018 Posts: 2,212 Location: DC (Dustbowl County)
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muandiwambeu wrote:MugundaMan wrote:mv_ufanisi wrote:
What if things get worse at the NSE? Because there is no magic cure for the poor performance of the bourse. We have had a string of companies going bankrupt or getting deregistered from the NSE. The GEMS segment doesn't seem to attract any high quality businesses.
So it seems that the NSE might itself have a fundamental problem; there are likely less than 20 investable companies in the NSE whereas in the real world there are a lot of well performing businesses who are quietly making money and see no urgency or need to list at the NSE. If this pipeline problem is not corrected, we will have an NSE that doesn't really reflect the economy and is full of old companies.
The only people who have made real money at the NSE are the shareholders who have listed their companies at the NSE as a way to liquidate their positions as well as facilitators like the brokers, legal and accounting firms. The guys waiting to buy at the NSE will likely be getting a fully priced, potentially overvalued company to buy into.
Brilliantly put. Look at Home Afrika. Listed with fanfare and it was all a shell. The guy who cashed out went on to produce several more shells in the private sector including the dead in the water Longonot Gate venture that is yet to even construct a decent road through the land in 8 years! Let alone a much taunted golf resort city! The only major structure constructed is a gate - pun fully intended. Kurwitu which has never traded a single share in years - complete fraud. NBK, HFCK; all shells that should have collapsed decades ago - have been exposed multiple times by insiders that they are scrap metal with funny accounting and BILLIONS in hidden loans in default but very few pay attention. The "Sameer squad" companies - all speculative frauds. Tens of delisted companies - all fraudulent. KQ, Uchumi - all frauds struggling to climb out of massive looting sprees. Frauds left right and centre. The NSE long stopped tracking/being a barometer for the red hawtt 5%+ growth of the real economy because it does NOT reflect the real economy. Dumping a huge cache of one's monies in NSE is like playing real Russian Roulette with a friend for several hours and hoping to make it to work safely the next day. Gamble with a few coins..that is fine..but to invest big chunks...a big no no IMHO. The best investment in Kenya is hitting. If you can't beat them, join them. Or just leave them and continue getting the hits. Hiyo ingine ni porojo tu. You can not be comfortable anywhere in this country if you are not one of the following cliques, the hitters or the perpectual/ tirelss care givers (hitted) Kam uko hapo katikati nikuangaika tu! So, it's not so late to adjust your new years resolutions and lifestyle. Choose your legue/playground wisely. Mwanaume ni kukazana kunyongana na kukwepa kunyolewa ama kuvumilia kunyongwa na kunyolewa Hapo I disagree with you brathee, Uhunyee is doing a good job of sustaining the anti corruption push. Slowly by slowly the hitters will have no rock to hide under. It is perfectly possible to live one's life quite cleanly, believe it or not. It just involves taking control of one's destiny and not in the manner you suggest. My interpretation of taking control of one's destiny is to be an owner of capital in a clean way, and to be content with the little God has blessed you with instead of letting greed overtake you in the quest to get more and more and more! Take for example Mugundaman. Hana deni na mtu, owns little compared to the billionaires out there yet God has put a roof over his head, three square meals on his family's table and bakshish ya kufanya investments hapa na pale as well as blessed him with robust health and a fulfilling religious life! What more can he ask for? As far as he is concerned, ana kila kitu! To me this is the Kenyan dream!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 9/25/2009 Posts: 4,534 Location: Windhoek/Nairobbery
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@mungundaman I will ask again... Which sectors of the Kenyan economy are doing well? I don't want to here about state contracts or tenders... It's well known fact in Wazua that Home Afrika was a no investment... Same as Sameer, NBK, KQ, Uchumi and Kirwitu... As far as HF is concerned...they took alot of risk... When the rate cap came they were caught swimming naked... HF is also a barometer on how bad things are in Kenyas real estate sector... Corruption money has been inflating prices... Artificial demand... Read this and weep https://www.businessdail...7938-kjjsa1z/index.html
The truth is Uhuru has F****d the Kenyan economy with Chinese loans! So huge projects like SGR had no impact on NSE or anyone because everything was coming from China including workers!
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Rank: Member Joined: 8/29/2008 Posts: 573
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the deal wrote:@mungundaman I will ask again... Which sectors of the Kenyan economy are doing well? I don't want to here about state contracts or tenders... It's well known fact in Wazua that Home Afrika was a no investment... Same as Sameer, NBK, KQ, Uchumi and Kirwitu... As far as HF is concerned...they took alot of risk... When the rate cap came they were caught swimming naked... HF is also a barometer on how bad things are in Kenyas real estate sector... Corruption money has been inflating prices... Artificial demand... Read this and weep https://www.businessdail...7938-kjjsa1z/index.html
The truth is Uhuru has F****d the Kenyan economy with Chinese loans! So huge projects like SGR had no impact on NSE or anyone because everything was coming from China including workers! And then I hear the ignorants and psycophants say that he should be rewarded with a Prime Minister position after he retires in 2022.And the stupid say he is too young,"where will he go ?".Kwani where did his agemate Barrack Obama go??
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Rank: Elder Joined: 1/8/2018 Posts: 2,212 Location: DC (Dustbowl County)
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the deal wrote:@mungundaman I will ask again... Which sectors of the Kenyan economy are doing well?I don't want to here about state contracts or tenders... It's well known fact in Wazua that Home Afrika was a no investment... Same as Sameer, NBK, KQ, Uchumi and Kirwitu... As far as HF is concerned...they took alot of risk... When the rate cap came they were caught swimming naked... HF is also a barometer on how bad things are in Kenyas real estate sector... Corruption money has been inflating prices... Artificial demand... Read this and weep https://www.businessdail...7938-kjjsa1z/index.html
The truth is Uhuru has F****d the Kenyan economy with Chinese loans! So huge projects like SGR had no impact on NSE or anyone because everything was coming from China including workers! Real estate -red hawtt Service industry -red hawtt Agriculture -red hawtt Fintech-red hawtt Financial services -red hawtt Manufacturing -doing reasonably well Don't let a few crumbling companies on the casino fool you. The vast majority of companies in the sectors above are doing very well.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 1/8/2018 Posts: 2,212 Location: DC (Dustbowl County)
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And don't forget diaspora remittances!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 9/25/2009 Posts: 4,534 Location: Windhoek/Nairobbery
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MugundaMan wrote:the deal wrote:@mungundaman I will ask again... Which sectors of the Kenyan economy are doing well?I don't want to here about state contracts or tenders... It's well known fact in Wazua that Home Afrika was a no investment... Same as Sameer, NBK, KQ, Uchumi and Kirwitu... As far as HF is concerned...they took alot of risk... When the rate cap came they were caught swimming naked... HF is also a barometer on how bad things are in Kenyas real estate sector... Corruption money has been inflating prices... Artificial demand... Read this and weep https://www.businessdail...7938-kjjsa1z/index.html
The truth is Uhuru has F****d the Kenyan economy with Chinese loans! So huge projects like SGR had no impact on NSE or anyone because everything was coming from China including workers! Real estate -red hawtt Service industry -red hawtt Agriculture -red hawtt Fintech-red hawtt Financial services -red hawtt Manufacturing -doing reasonably well Don't let a few crumbling companies on the casino fool you. The vast majority of companies in the sectors above are doing very well. I wish you could backup your arguments with data or links "Banking sector data for the first nine months of the year showed that non-performing loans rose to Sh326 billion from Sh260 billion in a similar period last year, driven by defaults from small businesses and the taxi sector. The data paints a picture of households and small traders taking loans that they are unable to service." Link https://www.businessdail...7938-kjjsa1z/index.html
Fintech???" Those Apps are blowing up with defaults. ... How is Real People doing? Look at Suraya Properties not at the NSE but blowing up https://www.businessdail...9700-mxpc1xz/index.html In fact Real Estate is becoming the biggest contributor of NPL's in the banking sector... Data from CBK... Why are folks defaulting on loans if they're making a killing? https://www.standardmedi...close-is-it-to-bursting
NSE is a safe haven... Just learn how to invest properly... Stop investing in monkeys 
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