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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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Muriel wrote:Before you move on to panpsychism, I say this:
There was an idea. It needed to be expressed. In whichever language, even sheng. By a quirk of providence English became the all inclusive language. Proper execution of this task (communication of the idea) would lead to a given result. The opposite also. But thanks to a large degree to the two gentlemen, the idea was and is misexpressed. The result is what you, I, we see - 'tounges'. Miscommunication.
The idea is not wrong, bad, or inappropriate or impractical. We are only stuck with the miscommunication that incidentally is so entrenched it has no cure save due diligence. Many by ease of read are however ensnared. I plead for due diligence from them.
Now what is panpsychism? I am interested.
Ah! Sorry. The idea. I kindly request you to express the idea. The panpsychism matter was an aside that appeared in my thought sequence. A slip of thought. Please.
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/19/2009 Posts: 3,142
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It is 'Coming out of Babylon'
What is panpsychism?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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Muriel wrote:
It is 'Coming out of Babylon'
What is panpsychism?
Please explain what you mean using the Westcott example. Let panpsychism wait.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/19/2013 Posts: 2,552
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tycho wrote:I can think of some reasons that could make one averse to a 'new idea'. A good reason for aversion could be the unfitness of an idea to a problem being solved, or interest. Another reason could be a failure in communication.
As for now, I can't find this new idea you're talking about. Could you care to show it? Muriel wrote:Yes.
But being averse to a certain idea should not cloud one's mind to the overall objective benefits and niceties to be accrued from that idea. Miscommunication often leads to incorrect understanding of the idea, rendering (mis)implementation of the idea in (mis)solving a problem more problematic.
I had mentioned some 2 gentlemen a Mr. Prescott and a Mr. Hort but by no means the only ones. They introduced, in my opinion, a miscommunication, a failure in communication, that has made well meaning and respectable citizens reject and become averse to an otherwise excellent idea. The likes of H.M Stanley while in pursuit of providing 'solutions', excelled this miscommunication and aggravated the situation and provided no solution to speak of.
I am appealing for due diligence to avoid throwing out the baby with the bathwater. You can share information.You can share knowledge.How does one go about sharing understanding and appreciation of that understanding?
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/19/2009 Posts: 3,142
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tycho wrote:
Please explain what you mean using the Westcott example. Let panpsychism wait.
Very well. Mark's gospel depicts its subject as a very action-oriented individual of action. e.g. a) he walks on water - action b) gives assurance that certain things will be done in his name - actions c) heals a blind man without speaking to him - action d) calms the storm - action The others depict their respective starrings as: Matthew - the messiah, the king Luke - the compassionate, the humanity John - the divine, the son of God Wescott and Hort, in narrating the starring of Mark, omits one action - where the starring describes another action, that of Daniel. It may seem innocuous, little, trifling, but in the context that the action of Daniel is in the context of actions of the man of actions the reader is should be struck with the idea of referring back to Daniel for more elaborate study. The loss of this reinforcement stimuli (miscommunication) hence is detrimental to the overall understanding of the idea. Confusion. Babylon. The story is Mark 13:14. Comparisons can be made with the gentlemen's versions and others. I cannot wait for panpsychism.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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symbols wrote:tycho wrote:I can think of some reasons that could make one averse to a 'new idea'. A good reason for aversion could be the unfitness of an idea to a problem being solved, or interest. Another reason could be a failure in communication.
As for now, I can't find this new idea you're talking about. Could you care to show it? Muriel wrote:Yes.
But being averse to a certain idea should not cloud one's mind to the overall objective benefits and niceties to be accrued from that idea. Miscommunication often leads to incorrect understanding of the idea, rendering (mis)implementation of the idea in (mis)solving a problem more problematic.
I had mentioned some 2 gentlemen a Mr. Prescott and a Mr. Hort but by no means the only ones. They introduced, in my opinion, a miscommunication, a failure in communication, that has made well meaning and respectable citizens reject and become averse to an otherwise excellent idea. The likes of H.M Stanley while in pursuit of providing 'solutions', excelled this miscommunication and aggravated the situation and provided no solution to speak of.
I am appealing for due diligence to avoid throwing out the baby with the bathwater. You can share information.You can share knowledge.How does one go about sharing understanding and appreciation of that understanding? Understanding can only be shared if there's a system of perception and knowledge generation, and communication, that allows for diversity and conflict, and free choice. To share understanding is becoming 'God'. @Muriel, there's the book of Mark, there's the book of the dead, there are many books, whether we like it or not. Why do people write? Why speak?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/19/2013 Posts: 2,552
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tycho wrote:symbols wrote:tycho wrote:I can think of some reasons that could make one averse to a 'new idea'. A good reason for aversion could be the unfitness of an idea to a problem being solved, or interest. Another reason could be a failure in communication.
As for now, I can't find this new idea you're talking about. Could you care to show it? Muriel wrote:Yes.
But being averse to a certain idea should not cloud one's mind to the overall objective benefits and niceties to be accrued from that idea. Miscommunication often leads to incorrect understanding of the idea, rendering (mis)implementation of the idea in (mis)solving a problem more problematic.
I had mentioned some 2 gentlemen a Mr. Prescott and a Mr. Hort but by no means the only ones. They introduced, in my opinion, a miscommunication, a failure in communication, that has made well meaning and respectable citizens reject and become averse to an otherwise excellent idea. The likes of H.M Stanley while in pursuit of providing 'solutions', excelled this miscommunication and aggravated the situation and provided no solution to speak of.
I am appealing for due diligence to avoid throwing out the baby with the bathwater. You can share information.You can share knowledge.How does one go about sharing understanding and appreciation of that understanding? Understanding can only be shared if there's a system of perception and knowledge generation, and communication, that allows for diversity and conflict, and free choice. To share understanding is becoming 'God'. Could you explain?I fail to understand.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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@symbols, take any two parties, being two implies that they are part of a larger set of parties. Or ideas, or sets.
A relation between two sets implies a third set. Understanding is consciousness of the third set. Like two interacting circles in Euclidean space. Understanding is Euclidean geometry in this case.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/19/2013 Posts: 2,552
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/19/2009 Posts: 3,142
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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With what? Be specific, kindly.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/19/2013 Posts: 2,552
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/19/2009 Posts: 3,142
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Brother is skirting around my point.
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/19/2009 Posts: 3,142
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tycho wrote:With what? Be specific, kindly. People write to communicate. If the message meant by the writer is receipted by the receiver communication has occurred. If a different message is receipted miscommunication has occurred. There is confusion. It is Babylon. Presence, readability and availability of other books is irrelevant to this confusion.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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Muriel wrote:tycho wrote:With what? Be specific, kindly. People write to communicate. If the message meant by the writer is receipted by the receiver communication has occurred. If a different message is receipted miscommunication has occurred. There is confusion. It is Babylon. Presence, readability and availability of other books is irrelevant to this confusion. Muriel, my last post to you was#86. Kindly respond to it to generate understanding. You have recounted how Westcott misrepresented the book of Mark. And I have responded by saying that when the chief concern is a 'meta-idea' an idea that goes beyond any idea, the exchanges within a particular idea(s) are neutralized by the fact that knowledge is created out of contention, even confusion. Babylon. And so contention about Mark, is just one among many allowed contentions.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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Muriel wrote:tycho wrote:With what? Be specific, kindly. People write to communicate. If the message meant by the writer is receipted by the receiver communication has occurred. If a different message is receipted miscommunication has occurred. There is confusion. It is Babylon. Presence, readability and availability of other books is irrelevant to this confusion. Meaning is negotiated not replicated. The aim of writing, or speaking, is to set off a negotiation that will arrive at a shared meaning. The demands you're placing on communication are impossible.
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/19/2009 Posts: 3,142
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tycho wrote: ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
@Muriel, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Why do people write? Why speak?
Muriel wrote:
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
People write to communicate. If the message meant by the writer is receipted by the receiver communication has occurred. If a different message is receipted miscommunication has occurred. There is confusion. It is Babylon.
,,,,,,,,,,,,,
tycho wrote:,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Muriel, my last post to you was#86. Kindly respond to it to generate understanding.
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, Miscommunication. Non-receipt & non-replication of my intended message. Confusion. Babylon. My point. My demand.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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Muriel wrote:tycho wrote: ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
@Muriel, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Why do people write? Why speak?
Muriel wrote:
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
People write to communicate. If the message meant by the writer is receipted by the receiver communication has occurred. If a different message is receipted miscommunication has occurred. There is confusion. It is Babylon.
,,,,,,,,,,,,,
tycho wrote:,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Muriel, my last post to you was#86. Kindly respond to it to generate understanding.
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, Miscommunication. Non-receipt & non-replication of my intended message. Confusion. Babylon. My point. My demand. Sorry. But neither are you communicating.
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/19/2009 Posts: 3,142
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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Muriel wrote:
One of us is in Babylon.
You said 'Babylon' means 'confusion'?
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