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Pastor Wairimu of 'Pambazuka na yesu'
Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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kysse wrote:Amores wrote:@Kysee,you are trying to have chat with @ tycho? lol  tycho wrote:
What do you mean by 'second coming'?
About me being tycho; Hahahaha.
The book of Revelation and Daniel. They talk about rapture and the events that will take place prior to His second coming. It is these events that I wanted you to express in your own words; so that we can understand your entire argument. For example is the 'end' about the physical as well as the Spiritual? Then we can have a common frame of reference, and discuss.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 1/17/2013 Posts: 4,693 Location: Earth
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tycho wrote:
It is these events that I wanted you to express in your own words; so that we can understand your entire argument. For example is the 'end' about the physical as well as the Spiritual? Then we can have a common frame of reference, and discuss.
The end of the physical signifies the beginning of the spiritual realm, 7 yrs after rapture. It's too long to discuss here. Lets go back to basics within the context of this thread because Peace/tribulations/seals,pambazuka and wairimu is not really a good mix.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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kysse wrote:tycho wrote:
It is these events that I wanted you to express in your own words; so that we can understand your entire argument. For example is the 'end' about the physical as well as the Spiritual? Then we can have a common frame of reference, and discuss.
The end of the physical signifies the beginning of the spiritual realm, 7 yrs after rapture. It's too long to discuss here. Lets go back to basics within the context of this thread because Peace/tribulations/seals,pambazuka and wairimu is not really a good mix. Well then, the Spiritual shall not be without 'new' bodies. Check and see whether that's not what Scripture postulates. The 'end', is a new city of Jerusalem, and here it won't just be formless Spirit flowing like in Genesis. This is a motif in most religions and indicates Man's highest aspirations. Pambazuka and these are a good mix. For example, divorce rates for evangelicals are higher than that of atheists, and according to some statistics, pastors are not only mostly depressed, but are also uncertain of what they profess, and teach. Why? Because the teachings are alienated from Man. The end isn't clear in their minds, and so is it for their congregations. These Scriptures were written by humans and for humans, to preserve and nurture humanity. To remain with the Spirit alone is a fallacy that has left all this wreckage we are seeing.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 1/17/2013 Posts: 4,693 Location: Earth
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tycho wrote:
Well then, the Spiritual shall not be without 'new' bodies. but we shall all be changed, In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.”there will be no flesh carnality in the next life. Check and see whether that's not what Scripture postulates. The 'end', is a new city of Jerusalem, and here it won't just be formless Spirit flowing like in Genesis. To be honest I don't care if heaven is in mukuru or vegas.As long as God is there after this life,I am cool.And no we shall become spiritual beings,
This is a motif in most religions and indicates Man's highest aspirations.
Pambazuka and these are a good mix. For example, divorce rates for evangelicals are higher than that of atheists, and according to some statistics, pastors are not only mostly depressed, true but are also uncertain of what they profess, and teach. Why? Because the teachings are alienated from Man.
Don't blame scriptures,blame them teachers who interpret scriptures wrongly and end up depressing themselves and those around them.They are not balanced.
The end isn't clear in their minds, and so is it for their congregations.
These Scriptures were written by humans yes but the Bible was written by God and for humans, to preserve and nurture humanity. To remain with the Spirit alone is a fallacy that has left all this wreckage we are seeing.The spirit is a medium between you and God.He helps you pray.He needs a body to operate through,He doesn't hover around like casper the friendly ghost.He doesn't cause wreckage
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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kysse wrote:tycho wrote:
Well then, the Spiritual shall not be without 'new' bodies. we shall be transformed,there will be no flesh carnality in the next life. Check and see whether that's not what Scripture postulates. The 'end', is a new city of Jerusalem, and here it won't just be formless Spirit flowing like in Genesis. To be honest I don't care if heaven is in mukuru or vegas.As long as God is there after this life,I am cool.And no we shall become spiritual beings,
This is a motif in most religions and indicates Man's highest aspirations.
Pambazuka and these are a good mix. For example, divorce rates for evangelicals are higher than that of atheists, and according to some statistics, pastors are not only mostly depressed, true but are also uncertain of what they profess, and teach. Why? Because the teachings are alienated from Man.
Don't blame scriptures,blame them teachers who interpret scriptures wrongly and end up depressing themselves and those around them.They are not balanced.
The end isn't clear in their minds, and so is it for their congregations.
These Scriptures were written by humans yes but the Bible was written by God and for humans, to preserve and nurture humanity. To remain with the Spirit alone is a fallacy that has left all this wreckage we are seeing.The spirit is a medium between you and God.He helps you pray.He needs a body to operate through,He doesn't hover around like casper the friendly ghost.He doesn't cause wreckage
We agree on several things. 1. The body being under the Spirit's influence 2.There's an end that's the aspiration of man. And 3. that the Scripture isn't to blame and that man is, for his interpretation and teaching. Which leads us to ask the following question; what 'goggles' would constitute a true interpretation? That You may not care whether heaven is in Mukuru or Vegas as long as God is there, has it's own contradiction that I'll overlook. What I'll ask is how one gets to heaven in the first place. And about God writing Scripture. Kindly explain why the first ten commandments that were written on the tablets that Moses broke differ from the second. Or how God influenced the Canon as per Church fathers.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 1/17/2013 Posts: 4,693 Location: Earth
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tycho wrote:We agree on several things. 1. The body being under the Spirit's influence 2.There's an end that's the aspiration of man. And 3. that the Scripture isn't to blame and that man is, for his interpretation and teaching. Which leads us to ask the following question; what ' goggles' would constitute a true interpretation? eya tycho  I am not a google wearer but I will classify and pick.
-Guilt/Conscience googles-The wearer carries lots of guilt and interpretes scriptures according to the measure of guilt in him to soothe his conscience.His interpretations are usually based on forgiveness even when judgement is needed.
- Theology googles-The wearer is all word,without any real life experience to which it can be applied. The wearer dishes out scripture even to the hungry boy on the street instead of food.
He is full of knowledge but lacks wisdom and his interpretation is lost.
- Revenge,Bitterness and Anger googles.-The wearer is angry at people and life in general.
He sees judgment in every scripture and sees God through pain and calamities.He can't stand happy and joyous people. He is a religious sadist and doomsday prophet.
- Love googles. This is the best wearer.His interpretation is based on the love God has for us.He doesnt spit doom ,neither is he hasty to pass judgement. He loves all people regardless because God died for all.
He doesnt consider himself superior or the 'chosen one',He is just a messenger and his interpretation is balanced.
So I choose to wear the love googles.
That You may not care whether heaven is in Mukuru or Vegas as long as God is there, has it's own contradiction that I'll overlook. What I'll ask is how one gets to heaven in the first place. This you know no need to debate.And about God writing Scripture. Kindly explain why the first ten commandments that were written on the tablets that Moses broke differ from the second. Quote:God said he will write the tablets, but the commandments were left for Moses to write:
After He gave the original ten commandments he also gave other commandments to moses and asked him to write.
The content remain the same.
Exd 34:1 The LORD said to Moses, "Cut for yourself two tablets of stone like the first, and I will write on the tablets the words that were on the first tablets, which you broke.
Exodus 34:27
And the LORD said to Moses, "Write these words, for in accordance with these words I have made a covenant with you and with Israel." Tycho God doesnt contradict Himself at all even if you chokora the whole bible there is no contradiction. Or how God influenced the Canon as per Church fathers. ah hii mimi sijui
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 10/9/2006 Posts: 1,502
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Do Kenyans need Visa to that new Jerusalem work to prosper
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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Kysse, you have chosen 'goggles' and apparently, you do not choose them randomly, but you have certain identifiable criteria. For example, you believe that there are no chosen people, that there must be 'balance', and that God's love is a given since 'theological' goggles are hardly your choice.
These goggles are difficult to find in the Bible. If the beginning and end are true, then we consistently see 'a chosen people'.
When you speak about 'balance', you expect me to understand, and going by your preferred goggles, you'd not expect me to say that these things you are saying are from 'God', would you? If we did, then God would have to be you, me, everyone, right? Politics.
I expected you to first quote Exodus 20 then 34 to show how the Commandments are similar, or different and maybe quote what Moses told God about the chosen people, and relate that to the sets of commandments under examination. That to Me, Man God, would constitute 'balance'. But apparently, you have other weighing scales, apparently different from those that you'd prefer to wear. That is, though I may not find contradiction in Scripture, I'll find it in you, in Moses, in Me, tycho and the Bible translators and interpreters. The whole Bible is about contradiction. And that's it's value, and truth.
Not knowing about the Church fathers, and assuming that we agree on how we go to heaven is both 'unbalanced' and telling. For example, why couldn't you just transfer your preferred goggles to them? What would happen if you did?
I have no doubt that it is this understanding or rather misunderstanding and misuse of Scripture that has brought us to this thread. We'd like to believe that mortal man, of 'earth', can quench another's thirst. Otherwise, even the waters offered by Christ are inaccessible. Or are they?
For example, Kysse where can I find Christ? Tell me please.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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Hahaha. You must be very proud to be Kenyan.
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Rank: New-farer Joined: 10/1/2013 Posts: 25
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#crap washing dirty linen in public
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