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LIFE UNDER ISLAMIC RULE?
Rank: Elder Joined: 3/31/2008 Posts: 7,081 Location: Kenya
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Summarize bro... In two or three sentences!
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/6/2010 Posts: 222 Location: NAMANGA
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AlphDoti wrote:alustaadh wrote:apostle John clearly said that any spirit that does not recognize that Jesus is the son of God who came in the flesh, died on the cross and resurrected from the dead isa spirit of the antichrist You have not quoted the verse correctly. Look for the verse and please says the real words without adding your own. But it is something close to thatI'm glad to tell you that a Muslim knows about Jesus. He's mentioned in the Quran many times.For Example: " We gave Jesus, the son of Mary, clear signs and strengthened him with the Holy Spirit" (Quran 2:87) " O Mary! God giveth thee glad tidings of a Word from Him: his name will be Christ Jesus, the son of Mary..." (Quran 3:45) " ...Christ Jesus the son of Mary was an apostle of god..." (Quran 4:171) " ...And in their foot steps we sent Jesus the son of Mary..." (Quran 5:46) " And Zakariya and John, and Jesus and Elias: all in the ranks of the righteous." (Quran 6:85) He is given Titles tooBesides being mentioned by name in many places in the Quran, he is also addressed with respect as: - Ibn Maryam, meaning "The son of Mary"; - and as the Maseeh (in Hebrew it is the Messiah), which is translated as "Christ". - He is also known as Abdullah, "The servant of Allah"; - and as Rasul u Allah, the messenger of Allah. Other titles- He is spoken of as "The Word of God", - as "The Spirit of God", - as a "Sign of God", - and numerous other titles of honour over many different chapters So do you believe now that prophet Muhammad (pbuh) loved Jesus (pbuh) and taught people about Jesus (pbuh)? He did not mentioned his mother, he did not mention his wives, but he mentioned Mary mother of Jesus (pbuh)!!! @ ALPHA, AND WHAT DO YOU THINK OF THIS? During my investigative phase I found that a lot of people were involved in the compilation and the construction of the Qur’an. Unknown to the vast majority of Muslims, and buried deep inside the Qur’an, Ahadith and Sirah there are copious evidence to reject, out of hand, the contention that the Qur’an is the creation of Allah. Making Allah the author of the Quran, I think, is the prime lie perpetrated on mankind for more than a millennium. We can, with certainty, say that it was not even Muhammad alone who authored the Qur’an.In fact, the major part of the Qur’an was actually either composed by or inspired and written by a few other individuals. Most notable among them were: Imrul Qays—an ancient poet of Arabia who died a few decades before Muhammad’s birth Zayd b. Amr b. Naufal—an ‘apostate’ of his time who preached and propagated Hanifism Labid—another poet Hasan b. Thabit—the official poet of Muhammad Salman, the Persian—Muhammad’s confidante’ and an advisor Bahira—a Nestoraian Christian monk of the Syrian church Jabr—a Christian neighbour of Muhammad Ibn Qumta—a Christian slave Khadijah—Muhammad’s first wife Waraqa—Khadijah’s cousin brother Ubay b. Ka’b—Muhammad’s secretary and a Qur’an scribe Muhammad himself There were other parties involved too. They were: The Sabeans Aisha—Muhammad’s child bride Abdallah b. Salam b. al-Harith—a Jewish convert to Islam Mukhyariq—a Rabbi and another Jewish convert to Islam Of course, my list of the possible authors of the Qur’an is not exhaustive. There may be many other parties involved that I might not have even heard of. But for a concise discussion the above list should be ample enough, I guess. In this article I have simply enumerated the contribution of the above sources in the authorship of the Qur’an. Now, to understand the Qur’an and its writer/s, we must, first of all, recognise the background of Muhammad, purportedly the ultimate and the best creation of Allah. http://mukto-mona.net/Ar.../kasem/quran_origin.htm
It is humiliating to be associated with thieves and murderers.
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/6/2010 Posts: 222 Location: NAMANGA
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AND THIS TOO? EH? This article delves into the very authorship of the Holy Qur’an—a new way of looking at the Holy Qur’an. An enquiry is made using logical reasoning and historical references on the authorship of the Qur’an. Thus this methodology is totally opposed to the blind believers who accept the authenticity of the Qur’an unquestionably. By analysing, dissecting and carefully interpreting the contents of the Qur’an, the Ahadith, Sirah (Muhammad’s biography) the author has identified several parties who had undoubtedly contributed to the composition of the Qur’anic verses. It was not Allah who wrote the Qur’an; it was not even Muhammad alone who did this either. The Qur’an is not the creation of a single entity or a single person. There were several parties involved in the composition, scribing, amending, inserting and deleting the Qur’anic verses. The most important personalities involved in the creation of the Qur’an were: Imrul Qays, Zayd b. Amr, Hasan b. Thabit, Salman, Bahira, ibn Qumta, Waraqa and Ubayy b. Ka’b. Muhammad himself was involved in the make-up of a limited number of verses, but the most influential person who motivated Muhammad in the invention of Islam and the opus of the Qur’an was, perhaps, Zayd b. Amr, who preached ‘Hanifism’. Muhammad later metamorphosed Zayd’s ‘Hanifism’ into Islam. Therefore, the assertion that Islam is not a new religion stands to be true. However, the important finding is that the Qur’an is definitely not the words of Allah—it is a human-made scripture which Muhammad simply passed up as Allah’s final words to mankind. Another important aspect of this essay is that among the ancient religions that the writers of the Qur’an incorporated in it, perhaps the practices of the Sabeans is crucial. In fact, the rituals of 5 prayers and the 30 days fasting were actually adapted from the Sabeans. Qur’an, thus, is a compilation of various religious books that existed during Muhammad’s time. Muhammad, not Allah, simply adopted, picked and chose from various sources and created the Qur’an. While many parties contributed to the Qur’an, Muhammad became its chief editor—to say it plainly. http://mukto-mona.net/Articles/kasem/quran_origin.htmIt is humiliating to be associated with thieves and murderers.
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/6/2010 Posts: 222 Location: NAMANGA
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RESEARCH....RESEARCH....RESEARCH..... http://jacksonsnyder.com...ticles%202002/quran.htm
By Alexander Stille The New York Times Saturday, March 2, 2002 To Muslims, the Quran is the very word of God, who spoke through the angel Gabriel to Muhammad: "This book is not to be doubted," the Quran declares unequivocally at its beginning. Scholars and writers in Islamic countries who have ignored that warning have found themselves the target of death threats and violence. Yet a handful of experts have been quietly investigating the origins of the Quran, offering radically new theories about the text's meaning and the rise of Islam. Christoph Luxenberg, a scholar of ancient Semitic languages in Germany, argues that the Quran has been misread for centuries. His work, based on the earliest copies of the Quran, maintains that parts of Islam's holy book are derived from pre-existing Christian Aramaic texts that were misinterpreted by later Islamic scholars who prepared the editions of the Quran read today. So, for example, the virgins who are supposedly awaiting Islamic martyrs in paradise are in reality "white raisins" of crystal clarity rather than fair maidens. Christoph Luxenberg, however, is a pseudonym, and his scholarly tome "The Syro-Aramaic Reading of the Quran" had trouble finding a publisher, although it is considered a major new work by several leading scholars in the field. The caution isn't surprising. Salman Rushdie's "Satanic Verses" prompted death threats because it appeared to mock Muhammad. Egyptian novelist Naguib Mahfouz was stabbed because one of his books was thought to be irreligious. And when the Palestinian scholar Suliman Bashear argued that Islam developed as a religion gradually rather than emerging fully formed from the mouth of the prophet, he was thrown from a second-story window by his students at the University of Nablus. While scriptural interpretation might seem like a remote and innocuous activity, close textual study of Jewish and Christian scripture played no small role in loosening the church's domination on the intellectual and cultural life of Europe. "The Muslims have the benefit of hindsight of the European experience, and they know very well that once you start questioning the holy scriptures, you don't know where it will stop," said one scholar at an American university who asked not to be named. The touchiness about questioning the Quran predates the latest rise of militancy. As late as 1977, John Wansbrough of the School of Oriental and African Studies in London wrote that subjecting the Quran to "analysis by the instruments and techniques of biblical criticism is virtually unknown." Wansbrough insisted that the text of the Quran appeared to be a composite of different voices or texts compiled over dozens if not hundreds of years. After all, scholars agree that there is no evidence of the Quran until 691 -- 59 years after Muhammad's death -- when the Dome of the Rock mosque in Jerusalem was built, carrying several Quranic inscriptions. These inscriptions differ to some degree from the version of the Quran that has been handed down, suggesting, scholars say, that the Quran might have still been evolving in the last decade of the seventh century. Moreover, much of what we know as Islam -- the lives and sayings of the Prophet -- is based on texts from between 130 and 300 years after Muhammad's death. Scholars such as Luxenberg have returned to the earliest known copies of the Quran to grasp what they suggest about the document's origins and composition. For example, the famous passage about the virgins is based on the word "hur," an adjective in the feminine plural meaning simply "white." Islamic tradition insists the term hur stands for "houri," which means virgin, but Luxenberg says this is a forced misreading of the text. In both ancient Aramaic and in at least one respected dictionary of early Arabic, hur means "white raisin," a prized delicacy in the ancient Near East. Several new volumes of revisionist scholarship, "The Origins of the Quran" and "The Quest for the Historical Muhammad," have been edited by a former Muslim who writes under the pen name Ibn Warraq. Warraq, who leads a group called the Institute for the Secularization of Islamic Society, makes no bones about having a political agenda. "Biblical scholarship has made people less dogmatic, more open," he said, "and I hope that happens to Muslim society as well." But many Muslims, including broad-minded liberal scholars of Islam, find the tone and claims of revisionism offensive. "I think the broader implications of some of the revisionist scholarship is to say that the Quran is not an authentic book, that it was fabricated 150 years later," says Ebrahim Moosa, a Duke University religious studies professor and a Muslim cleric.It is humiliating to be associated with thieves and murderers.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/9/2009 Posts: 6,592 Location: Nairobi
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I thought Islam is about Allah and Muhammad was his messenger? Does the background of the messenger really matter? BBI will solve it :)
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/6/2010 Posts: 222 Location: NAMANGA
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2012 wrote:I thought Islam is about Allah and Muhammad was his messenger? Does the background of the messenger really matter? This article delves into the very authorship of the Holy Qur’an—a new way of looking at the Holy Qur’an. An enquiry is made using logical reasoning and historical references on the authorship of the Qur’an. Thus this methodology is totally opposed to the blind believers who accept the authenticity of the Qur’an unquestionably. By analysing, dissecting and carefully interpreting the contents of the Qur’an, the Ahadith, Sirah (Muhammad’s biography) the author has identified several parties who had undoubtedly contributed to the composition of the Qur’anic verses. It was not Allah who wrote the Qur’an; it was not even Muhammad alone who did this either. The Qur’an is not the creation of a single entity or a single person. There were several parties involved in the composition, scribing, amending, inserting and deleting the Qur’anic verses. The most important personalities involved in the creation of the Qur’an were: Imrul Qays, Zayd b. Amr, Hasan b. Thabit, Salman, Bahira, ibn Qumta, Waraqa and Ubayy b. Ka’b. Muhammad himself was involved in the make-up of a limited number of verses, but the most influential person who motivated Muhammad in the invention of Islam and the opus of the Qur’an was, perhaps, Zayd b. Amr, who preached ‘Hanifism’. Muhammad later metamorphosed Zayd’s ‘Hanifism’ into Islam. Therefore, the assertion that Islam is not a new religion stands to be true. However, the important finding is that the Qur’an is definitely not the words of Allah—it is a human-made scripture which Muhammad simply passed up as Allah’s final words to mankind. Another important aspect of this essay is that among the ancient religions that the writers of the Qur’an incorporated in it, perhaps the practices of the Sabeans is crucial. In fact, the rituals of 5 prayers and the 30 days fasting were actually adapted from the Sabeans. Qur’an, thus, is a compilation of various religious books that existed during Muhammad’s time. Muhammad, not Allah, simply adopted, picked and chose from various sources and created the Qur’an. While many parties contributed to the Qur’an, Muhammad became its chief editor—to say it plainly. It is humiliating to be associated with thieves and murderers.
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Rank: Member Joined: 2/12/2010 Posts: 474 Location: Nairobi
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When will people learn that what happens after life is not that important. There is a life to live and issues to deal with. Life after death would be thinking too far ahead. Its cool do handle one game at a time. I read the Bible a lot. That's what I was introduced to when I was a kid and also when schooling. Never had enough time to think of other religions but I don't think I should. Keep it simple
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/27/2007 Posts: 2,768
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I doubt mohammeds parents were pagans from the little knowledge i have. The arabs are descedants of the hunter, Ishmael who was brother to Jacob and their father Isaac. I bet they knew of God most probably, until 622 AD or somewhere thereafter when Islam was born and Jihad started with mohammed as the commander and the prophet...Am i right???? ...besides, the presence of a safe alone does not signify that there is money inside...
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Rank: New-farer Joined: 6/14/2011 Posts: 82
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Kaigangio wrote:I doubt mohammeds parents were pagans from the little knowledge i have.
The arabs are descedants of the hunter, Ishmael who was brother to Jacob and their father Isaac.
I bet they knew of God most probably, until 622 AD or somewhere thereafter when Islam was born and Jihad started with mohammed as the commander and the prophet...Am i right???? Aii! Please read your Bible again! Ishmael was a son of Abraham and Hagar, the Egyptian maid of his wife Sarah. Sarah's son Isaac wa his step-brother.And Jacob was one of the two sons of Isaac and Rebekah !
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/27/2007 Posts: 2,768
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villageseer wrote:Kaigangio wrote:I doubt mohammeds parents were pagans from the little knowledge i have.
The arabs are descedants of the hunter, Ishmael who was brother to Jacob and their father Isaac.
I bet they knew of God most probably, until 622 AD or somewhere thereafter when Islam was born and Jihad started with mohammed as the commander and the prophet...Am i right???? Aii! Please read your Bible again! Ishmael was a son of Abraham and Hagar, the Egyptian maid of his wife Sarah. Sarah's son Isaac wa his step-brother. thanks for the correction but Ishmael is the important object here... ...besides, the presence of a safe alone does not signify that there is money inside...
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Rank: Elder Joined: 9/23/2010 Posts: 2,221 Location: Sundowner,Amboseli
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Wee Kaigangio soma bibilia! @SufficientlyP
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/2/2009 Posts: 26,330 Location: Masada
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Am afraid the so called phundamentalist will lynch wazua...am very afraid and this thread must be terminated henceforth!!! Portfolio: Sold You know you've made it when you get a parking space for your yatcht.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/20/2008 Posts: 6,275 Location: Kenya
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Impunity wrote:Am afraid the so called phundamentalist will lynch wazua... am very afraid and this thread must be terminated henceforth!!! This is hate speech  What is 'phundamentalist'?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/20/2008 Posts: 6,275 Location: Kenya
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Kaigangio wrote:villageseer wrote:Kaigangio wrote:I doubt mohammeds parents were pagans from the little knowledge i have.
The arabs are descedants of the hunter, Ishmael who was brother to Jacob and their father Isaac.
I bet they knew of God most probably, until 622 AD or somewhere thereafter when Islam was born and Jihad started with mohammed as the commander and the prophet...Am i right???? Aii! Please read your Bible again! Ishmael was a son of Abraham and Hagar, the Egyptian maid of his wife Sarah. Sarah's son Isaac wa his step-brother. thanks for the correction but Ishmael is the important object here... Christians and Muslims descended from the same father of faith: Abraham.- Abraham had two sons: Ishmael and Isaac. - Ishmael from Haggar and Isaac from Sarah. - Ishmael is the father of the Arabs and Isaac is the father of the Jews, Israelites. The Quran 37:101 says:"So We gave him the good news of a forbearing son". Who is it?And this son is Ishmael for he is the first son whose good news was brought to Abraham. He is older than Isaac according to Muslims and the Bible too. It is even said in the Bible that Ishmael was born when Abraham was 86 years old and Isaac was born when Abraham was 99. In the Bible as well, God is said to have ordered Abraham to sacrifice his only son and in another version his firstborn. And, at this spot, they inserted falsely the name of Isaac against the text of their very Scripture. Why?- The reason they inserted Isaac is that he is their father whereas Ishmael is the father of the Arabs. - They added Isaac out of envy and brushed away "only son" by saying that Ishmael and his mother had already been to Makkah. What is the meaning of 'only son'This is a mere false explanation since we never say "only son" except to a person who hasn't got but one son. Moreover, the firstborn has got a special place [in the heart of his father] that is not given to the following children and the order to sacrifice him is therefore a greater test. How were these two sons?The Quran points out that Ishmael as the patient son and that he is the sacrificed. The Quran afterwards says: "And We gave him the good news of Isaac - a prophet,- one of the Righteous." The Quran continues to say:"We gave her [Sarah] glad tidings of Isaac, and after him, of Jacob." Which means that in the lifetime of Abraham and Sarah, Isaac will beget a child that he will call Jacob.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/20/2008 Posts: 6,275 Location: Kenya
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My Brother @alustaadh! God has given us brains, which we should use when seeking the truth. The Swahilis say: if you stay with thieves you will also become a thief. - Not because theft is righteousness, but because you are staying in an environment of thieves you will be affected by those who surround you. - If you surround yourself with people who hate Islam, well, that is all you will get: hatred for the Muslims.
If you want to learn about the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him), then choose Muslims who can inform you who the Prophet was.
Since you are doing research, you can read 'The Sealed Nectar', which would give you a very good idea of who the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) was.
NOW PLEASE READ THE FOLLOWING
The history of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh), was similar to that of Prophet Ibrahim, alaihis salaam. - Prophet Ibrahim, alaihis salaam, was son of an idol worshipper. - His father, Azhar, actually carved and sold the idols. - But God guided him and he became the father of the monotheistic religions.
That's why until now, we Muslims and the Christians say Abraham is the father of faith.
The history of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) was similar to the of Prophet Musa, alaihis salaam. - He was brought up by the Pharaoh of Egypt who himself claimed to be God. - the Pharaoh liked that people should worship him instead of worshipping God. - These were the real pagans. - But God guided Moses and he became the leader of the Jews.
So the history of the Jews and the Christians and the Muslims is very similar - Please do not pick on the faults of the persons of the prophets or their fathers because in your ignorance you will displease God who in turn will reserve sufficient place for you in the Hell Fire.
The Da Vinci Code Please I advise you to read the davinci code, which would also give you a good idea where to find the daughter of Jesus. Did you know that Jesus was married? Well, I tell you to find out! May be the Church has hidden this info from you. The Davinci Code is not written by Muslims. Muslims don't write nonsense.
How many husbands did Mary have? Did you know that the mother of Jesus had two husbands, GOD FORBIDS (naudhubillah)? One was called Joseph son of Jacob from the house of Solomon, according to Mathew. And the other was called Joseph son of Heli from the house of Nathan, according to Luke. This information is contained in your Holy Bible, not the davinci code.
Conclusion Let us not get into mud slinging. It does not help. Seek the Truth and the Truth will set you free from the Fire. I would advise you to buy yourself a Quran and the Sealed Nectar and read. If you find any difficulty you can contact me and I will help you as far as possible.
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Rank: Member Joined: 5/7/2010 Posts: 282 Location: Nairobi
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AD, the Quran quotes given above start with "We ..." Please provide details of the "We" in the context of the text.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/20/2008 Posts: 6,275 Location: Kenya
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sky5 wrote:AD, the Quran quotes given above start with "We ..." Please provide details of the "We" in the context of the text. We already know God our lord is One. The Quran says very clearly that there is only One God, Allah. "There is no god but Allah" is the basic principle of Islam. Quran Surah al-Ikhlas chapter 112:1-4 says this. But you wonder why does Allah, our God uses the word "We" to refer to Himself in many verses in the Quran? Explanation(1) - Whenever Allah is mentioned in the third person there are always singular pronouns used, such as He, Him (Huwa or Hu). (2) - Whenever Allah is spoken to in the second person there are also singular pronouns, such as Thou, Thine and Thee (Anta, Ka). (3) - However, only in the first person some times the pronouns I, My or Mine (Ana, Iyaya, ya) are used and sometimes "We", "Us" and "Our" (Nahnu, Na) are used. Why?This is a style of speech. Sometimes the speaker says I and sometime says we. We also use that in our conversations. - you will see that often the first person singular such as I or My is used, when Allah speaks about His love, care and closeness and forgiveness for His servants. - also the first person plural is used when Allah speaks about His power, Majesty, Glory, Great deeds or when He speaks about His anger and wrath for the sinners and criminals. Pluralis MajestatisQuote:- Also known as the "royal we" or the "Victorian we" has been restricted to august personages such as monarchs, bishops, Popes, and university rectors. - The reason behind the pluralis majestatis is the idea that a monarch or other high official ALWAYS SPEAKS FOR HIS OR HER PEOPLE. The royal we (royal plural)Quote:The royal we is the first-person plural pronoun when used by an important personage to refer to himself or herself. Its best known usage is by a monarch such as a king, queen, or pope. It is also used in certain formal contexts by bishops and university rectors Conclusion- Some Christians, think that the plural pronoun which is used to show respect in verses is proof of their false belief in trinity. - These Christian writers in their desperate desire to prove their doctrine of Trinity have sometime interpreted some Biblical passages where first person plural is used to suggest that this means the " Divine Trinity". For example in the Bible it is mentioned, "Then God said, 'Let us make man in our image'" (Genesis 1:26). - Christian writers contend that this means that there is plurality in God (may Allah forgive us for mentioning this blasphemy) So @sky5, you are trying to confuse "simple Muslims" here in Wazua by taking some verses from the Quran and telling them that the Quran also supports such doctrines
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/6/2010 Posts: 222 Location: NAMANGA
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@ alphdoti,..... Christians and Muslims descended from the same father of faith: Abraham. TRUTH... Abraham had more than 2 sons: Genesis 25 verses 1-2.....six more sons were born to him by his second wife, KETURA...It seems that God favored Isaac (the son of promise) over his siblings (children of common law.), just as he favored Jacob over Esau, and Israel over the rest of the nations of the earth. we know that Judaism and Christianity came from the descendants of Issac, and Islam from the descendants of Ishmael. ..... And, at this spot, they inserted falsely the name of Isaac against the text of their very Scripture.......  who is 'they?' Kindly substantiate with evidence. ....... They added Isaac out of envy and brushed away "only son" by saying that Ishmael and his mother had already been to Makkah.... is this stuff in the Koran? ......S ince you are doing research, you can read 'The Sealed Nectar', which would give you a very good idea of who the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) was.
.....provide link please. Secular history shows that History is usually written by the victors. It is this in mind that any scholar is advised to examine the subject matter from all points of view. ... Please I advise you to read the davinci code, which would also give you a good idea where to find the daughter of Jesus.  ... Actually this storyline was invented by the European Royal families to justify their divine right to rule over the masses in undemocratic manner. http://www.bibliotecaple...odlines/merovingian.htm these people have closely intermarried over the years and are now in the process of forging A ONE WORLD GOVERNMENT so as to monopolize all TRADE AND POLITICAL POWER....They are believed to be WORSHIPERS OF SATAN...The most logical Question to ask at this Juncture is 'why should the Descendants of Jesus be associated with THE WORSHIP OF SATAN?' ...... The Davinci Code is not written by Muslims. Muslims don't write nonsense.... I agree with that. But remember Islam is not the only religiuos group with worldwide expansion ambitions....ever heard about the illuminati, or freemasons, etc? These are people advocating for the worship of demons... .....J oseph son of Jacob from the house of Solomon, according to Mathew.  [ it is the HOUSE OF DAVID...NOT SOLOMON... ....... And the other was called Joseph son of Heli from the house of Nathan, according to Luke......  IT IS STILL JOSEPH A DESCENDANT FROM THE HOUSE OF DAVID.. ... Conclusion Let us not get into mud slinging. It does not help. QUITE TRUE. We know who is doing that.... It is humiliating to be associated with thieves and murderers.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 8/11/2010 Posts: 1,588
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AlphDoti wrote:sky5 wrote:AD, the Quran quotes given above start with "We ..." Please provide details of the "We" in the context of the text. We already know God our lord is One. The Quran says very clearly that there is only One God, Allah. "There is no god but Allah" is the basic principle of Islam. Quran Surah al-Ikhlas chapter 112:1-4 says this. But you wonder why does Allah, our God uses the word "We" to refer to Himself in many verses in the Quran? Explanation(1) - Whenever Allah is mentioned in the third person there are always singular pronouns used, such as He, Him (Huwa or Hu). (2) - Whenever Allah is spoken to in the second person there are also singular pronouns, such as Thou, Thine and Thee (Anta, Ka). (3) - However, only in the first person some times the pronouns I, My or Mine (Ana, Iyaya, ya) are used and sometimes "We", "Us" and "Our" (Nahnu, Na) are used. Why?This is a style of speech. Sometimes the speaker says I and sometime says we. We also use that in our conversations. - you will see that often the first person singular such as I or My is used, when Allah speaks about His love, care and closeness and forgiveness for His servants. - also the first person plural is used when Allah speaks about His power, Majesty, Glory, Great deeds or when He speaks about His anger and wrath for the sinners and criminals. Pluralis MajestatisQuote:- Also known as the "royal we" or the "Victorian we" has been restricted to august personages such as monarchs, bishops, Popes, and university rectors. - The reason behind the pluralis majestatis is the idea that a monarch or other high official ALWAYS SPEAKS FOR HIS OR HER PEOPLE. The royal we (royal plural)Quote:The royal we is the first-person plural pronoun when used by an important personage to refer to himself or herself. Its best known usage is by a monarch such as a king, queen, or pope. It is also used in certain formal contexts by bishops and university rectors Conclusion- Some Christians, think that the plural pronoun which is used to show respect in verses is proof of their false belief in trinity. - These Christian writers in their desperate desire to prove their doctrine of Trinity have sometime interpreted some Biblical passages where first person plural is used to suggest that this means the " Divine Trinity". For example in the Bible it is mentioned, "Then God said, 'Let us make man in our image'" (Genesis 1:26). - Christian writers contend that this means that there is plurality in God (may Allah forgive us for mentioning this blasphemy) So @sky5, you are trying to confuse "simple Muslims" here in Wazua by taking some verses from the Quran and telling them that the Quran also supports such doctrines C'mon Alph doti man. Islam started in 600 ad or thereabouts. Why are you attempting to explain its concepts with literary terms as first commonly used in the 1100s as your rightly say by the popes, monarchs and bishops? Was what was the intent to the use of 'we' in around 600 ad when islam was founded and koran written? The mornachs, bishops and popes you are talking about adopted and only started using that term in the 12th century. We found out that koran was based upon the apocrypha. The use of 'we' is one aspect of the apocrypha that Mohammed forgot to edit out. That is the only logical explanation. Now you can only excuse it, saying that if the popes, bishops, rectors and monarchs used it then its ok if Allah uses it too! Is it Allahs policy to copy and imitate? First the apocrypha and later the popes, monarchs and bishops? Is that is the only plausible explanation you can have now about the use of 'we'? But I admire your tenacity. You keep keeping on even when there is overwhelming evidence against you. You are most slippery and wriggly. You might wear me out......
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Rank: New-farer Joined: 7/16/2011 Posts: 59
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still unable to answer any of the my questions so far?Quote:Why? - The reason they inserted Isaac is that he is their father whereas Ishmael is the father of the Arabs. - They added Isaac out of envy and brushed away "only son" by saying that Ishmael and his mother had already been to Makkah. The suggestion that Abraham could have made it to Makkah along with Ishamael is a historical impossibility; 1.For them to get to Makkah, they had to use an existing trade route.The first trade route via the desert came to exist in the early common era shortly before Islam.Considering they would have journeyed from Mesopotamia up north to Turkey then into syria further into canaan before going into Egypt.Where Abraham met Hagar.This is where she probably spent all her years after coming from Canaan. 2.Fact ,Makkah was backwater.A study of ancient empires shows the Romans,Greeks,Persians avoided Makkah and it's environs because of the hardships of getting there. 3.Don't be to sure that Ishmaelites are arabs.Consider what this respected historian says: Quote:there is no historical evidence for the assertion that Abraham or Ishmael was ever in Mecca, and if there had been such a tradition it would have to be explained how all memory of the Old Semitic name Ishmael (which was not in its true Arabian form in Arabian inscriptions and written correctly with an initial consonant Y) came to be lost. The form in the Quran is taken either from Greek or Syriac sources." (Alfred Guillaume, Islam [Penguin Books Inc., Baltimore, 1956], pp. 61-62). Quote:The history of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) was similar to the of Prophet Musa, alaihis salaam. - He was brought up by the Pharaoh of Egypt who himself claimed to be God. - the Pharaoh liked that people should worship him instead of worshipping God. - These were the real pagans. - But God guided Moses and he became the leader of the Jews. I've wondered where the Quranic author(s) came up with the name Musa for Moses.The Hebrew word is Moshe so is the aramaic adaptation.One realises,even the greek and english translators never made such mistakes. A quick comparison of prophet Muhammad and Moses/Jesus shows a diametric difference. Jesus and Moses were: 1.Not Political leaders.Moses was not a leader God was the leader. 2.Lettered ie were schooled. 3.Did not marry multiple partners.(Jesus was never married according to historical sources) 4.Both did not have armies.They never engaged in rebellious activities against Egyptians & Romans respectively despite them being Polytheists. 5.Miracle workers. 6.The prophetic mission was not carried out alone.Moses had Aaron:Jesus had John the Baptist. 7.Neither performed Hajj. Quote:Please do not pick on the faults of the persons of the prophets or their fathers because in your ignorance you will displease God who in turn will reserve sufficient place for you in the Hell Fire. If you are suggesting God has the capability of destroying His own creation ;take time and understand the Perfection attribute of God.If God is perfect He makes Perfect things.How can He then, destroy perfection? Quote: The Da Vinci Code Please I advise you to read the davinci code, which would also give you a good idea where to find the daughter of Jesus. Did you know that Jesus was married? Well, I tell you to find out! May be the Church has hidden this info from you. The Davinci Code is not written by Muslims. Muslims don't write nonsense.
Da Vinci code is the work of fiction that is purely based on conspiracy theories.If it is considered a fact then It makes many assumptions chiefly Jesus survived the cross.The Romans and Early Christians who both held opposite beliefs thought He did not.This belief had a profound effect in their respective societies.Who would you believe? Quote:One was called Joseph son of Jacob from the house of Solomon, according to Mathew. And the other was called Joseph son of Heli from the house of Nathan, according to Luke. The first lineage is that of Kings.Mathew showed Jesus was in the lineage of Kings through Joseph.Luke wrote extensively about Mary in the first chapters.Thus the second lineage is that of Priesthood.That goes all the way to Moses.Mary was a Levite.Jesus is referred to as a priest later. Why was there no lineage in the Quran?Meanwhile trouble has come to Tanzania one of the last places on earth where muslims had leaved in coexistence with others. http://www.thecitizen.co.tz/sunday-citizen/40-sunday-citizen-news/26531-122-arrested-over-mbagala-riots-burning-of-churches[url=tz riots 2] http://www.africareview..../-/67h8taz/-/index.html[/url]
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LIFE UNDER ISLAMIC RULE?
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