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Treasury Bills Investing-Procedure?
Rank: Elder Joined: 10/13/2009 Posts: 1,950 Location: in kenya
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bird_man wrote:So you take a loan of 1M to make about 70K that whole year? You had better even buy cows or plant something.1M for 70K..... What about a guy who borrow 100k from a sacco @ 10% to make 9k without breaking a sweat by buying the treasury bills. '......to the acknowledgment of the mystery of God, and of the Father, and of Christ; 3 In whom are hid all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge.' Colossians 2:2-3
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Rank: Chief Joined: 1/13/2011 Posts: 5,964
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Mainat wrote:Impunity-you are right. I believe this is how the money market funds are doing it... If he stops us from going to work, then i'll be very concerned. OTW, as long as we'll be discussing Ocampo during our regular daily routines...I'll gladly be profiteering off that 'fear'.
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Rank: User Joined: 8/29/2011 Posts: 1,045 Location: Mtaani
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selah wrote:bird_man wrote:So you take a loan of 1M to make about 70K that whole year? You had better even buy cows or plant something.1M for 70K..... What about a guy who borrow 100k from a sacco @ 10% to make 9k without breaking a sweat by buying the treasury bills. 9k ???? thats peanuts ...even per month
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/13/2009 Posts: 1,950 Location: in kenya
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If you remember the controversial trader who said Goldmansachs rules the world you must have heard what they do in a down market they usually like recessions because they create opportunities to make huge sums of money just like some are doing by exploiting GSECs. '......to the acknowledgment of the mystery of God, and of the Father, and of Christ; 3 In whom are hid all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge.' Colossians 2:2-3
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Rank: User Joined: 8/29/2011 Posts: 1,045 Location: Mtaani
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/2/2009 Posts: 26,328 Location: Masada
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bird_man wrote:So you take a loan of 1M to make about 70K that whole year? You had better even buy cows or plant something.1M for 70K..... You think cow bizna is a walk in the path? Let say you buy 50 heifers (for beef) at 20,000 (50x20,000= 1,000,000) and bread them for 12 months. How much will they be worth after that period? What will be the cost of feed? The cost of cowboys? The cost of medication? The cost personal stress since these are live animal and they coud die anytime!? If you are lucky to sell at 25,000 thats 250,000 gross. Then pay 5K pm for 5 cowboys for 12 months = 300,000. And mambo bado yet yu are at aloss already. Dont even think of daily cows! Portfolio: Sold You know you've made it when you get a parking space for your yatcht.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 11/2/2006 Posts: 1,206 Location: Nairobi
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@Impunity...that was just an example didn't really mean it.All the same you cannot buy a cow at 20K and sell it at 25K after 12months.Maziwa na watoto je? Anyway....different strokes,different folks I guess.With 1M I know what I would do for more than 5,800sh a month. Formally employed people often live their employers' dream & forget about their own.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/13/2009 Posts: 1,950 Location: in kenya
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bird_man wrote:@Impunity...that was just an example didn't really mean it.All the same you cannot buy a cow at 20K and sell it at 25K after 12months.Maziwa na watoto je? Anyway....different strokes,different folks I guess.With 1M I know what I would do for more than 5,800sh a month. @birdman give us that example...a risk free investment that can give you 20% return without breaking a sweat. '......to the acknowledgment of the mystery of God, and of the Father, and of Christ; 3 In whom are hid all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge.' Colossians 2:2-3
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 11/2/2006 Posts: 1,206 Location: Nairobi
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Selah...without getting into details,I run a small business on the side.With a loan of about 400K I have been able to get the biz generating about 30K in net profit per month.It has taken time though & it is not RISK free. Give 1M to different people & they will do diff things.So nobody is wrong or right here.I just felt 1M for 70K profit in one year can be utilized in other more profitable ways. Formally employed people often live their employers' dream & forget about their own.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/13/2009 Posts: 1,950 Location: in kenya
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@bird_man am not disputing that but here we are talking about taking a loan and investing it on T/bills with a view of getting a profit from doing absolutely nothing.The catch though is that you will have to a pay the loan from other sources until maturity date. '......to the acknowledgment of the mystery of God, and of the Father, and of Christ; 3 In whom are hid all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge.' Colossians 2:2-3
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 11/2/2006 Posts: 1,206 Location: Nairobi
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@Selah....point taken.Interesting scenario though. A guy that can pay the 89K/month is unlikely to view 70K/yr as worthy investment income...even when doing "absolutely nothing". Formally employed people often live their employers' dream & forget about their own.
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Rank: Member Joined: 6/21/2010 Posts: 514 Location: Nairobi
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Nabwire wrote:erifloss wrote:Everything held constant for the year at the current rate of 20.696%, if one rolls over their investment the effective rate will be around 22.35% now where else can one get a safe return like this. 20% is roughly 5% every 3 months, even if we get generous and stretch it to 9% every 3 months, thats only 3% per month!! Nimekataa, there are stocks that rally 10% in a couple of days, I just dont get it. But then again, Im not loking for a safe return. I think you should check the average loss for the last 6 months alone at the NSE and also remember this is an elections year. To be true to ourselves foreigners are the ones who initiate most of the rallies and this year i don't see them coming in but getting out in droves. The economic environment is not also that promising. I'm totally happy with a 20% return. 'They say money cannot buy me happiness but when i compare when i had none and now, i'm happier' Kevin O'leary
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 7/22/2011 Posts: 1,325
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erifloss wrote:Nabwire wrote:[quote=erifloss]Everything held constant for the year at the current rate of 20.696%, if one rolls over their investment the effective rate will be around 22.35% now where else can one get a safe return like this. 20% is roughly 5% every 3 months, even if we get generous and stretch it to 9% every 3 months, thats only 3% per month!! Nimekataa, there are stocks that rally 10% in a couple of days, I just dont get it. But then again, Im not loking for a safe return. I think you should check the average loss for the last 6 months alone at the NSE and also remember this is an elections year. To be true to ourselves foreigners are the ones who initiate most of the rallies and this year i don't see them coming in but getting out in droves. The economic environment is not also that promising. I'm totally happy with a 20% return.[/quote And here is where the true investors are separated from the wannabes. If you look at the market as being down and that foreigners are fleeing, you miss the half full analogy of this being a great buying opportunity. We all know markets are cyclical, so even if they are fleeing, they will be back There is money to be made. I see alot of herd mentality here, Tbills are safe, they are not great. It takes great risk to make great money, why would one want to preserve their capital when they could grow it? (Granted there is a chance of "losing" the capital) A good example, EK has more than doubled in less than a week Granted it is a huge risk coz the comapny may be going to bankruptcy, but no pain no gain. Why in hell would I tie up my money in Tbills for a paltry 3% per month???!!! http://finance.yahoo.com/q?s=EK&ql=1
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Rank: Chief Joined: 8/4/2010 Posts: 8,977
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@Nabwire - list one or a few stocks that will return 20% or more by end of March 2012. That way u help more people and prove your point clearly. Happy investing $15/barrel oil... The commodities lehman moment arrives as well as Sovereign debt volcano!
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/12/2010 Posts: 111 Location: MOMBASA
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hisah wrote:@Nabwire - list one or a few stocks that will return 20% or more by end of March 2012. That way u help more people and prove your point clearly. Happy investing Haiya what a challenge..Nabwire give us 5 stocks only and let's c if it works...
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 7/22/2011 Posts: 1,325
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Hisah unfortunately, I am not based in Kenya and the NSE has very limited info BUT I am going to buy KK, KCB & Kengen. Just looking at it from a contrarian investing point of view, these stocks should have decent returns.Granted the NYSE has a more fluid/ greater turnover than the NSE so I realize it could be harder to get decent returns in a short time.Hisah you are a trader, so our time frames are different plus you know the entry/ exit points, alot of your followers dont, lets wait and see. In other news http://seekingalpha.com/...of-america?source=yahoo
http://seekingalpha.com/...-of-america?source=yahoo
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/2/2009 Posts: 26,328 Location: Masada
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[quote=Nabwire]Hisah unfortunately, I am not based in Kenya and the NSE has very limited info BUT I am going to buy KK, KCB & Kengen. Just looking at it from a contrarian investing point of view, these stocks should have decent returns.Granted the NYSE has a more fluid/ greater turnover than the NSE so I realize it could be harder to get decent returns in a short time.Hisah you are a trader, so our time frames are different plus you know the entry/ exit points, alot of your followers dont, lets wait and see. In other news http://seekingalpha.com/...of-america?source=yahoo
http://seekingalpha.com/...of-america?source=yahoo[/quote] Keep queit where you are, in Kenia its erection year and stocks are historically inclined to lose massively in an election year! T-bill for us Kenians is worthwhile. Portfolio: Sold You know you've made it when you get a parking space for your yatcht.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 7/22/2011 Posts: 1,325
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And Hisah 20% by end of March? Tbills will yield 5% by the same time. Apples & Oranges?
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 7/22/2011 Posts: 1,325
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Impunity wrote:[quote=Nabwire]Hisah unfortunately, I am not based in Kenya and the NSE has very limited info BUT I am going to buy KK, KCB & Kengen. Just looking at it from a contrarian investing point of view, these stocks should have decent returns.Granted the NYSE has a more fluid/ greater turnover than the NSE so I realize it could be harder to get decent returns in a short time.Hisah you are a trader, so our time frames are different plus you know the entry/ exit points, alot of your followers dont, lets wait and see. In other news http://seekingalpha.com/...of-america?source=yahoo
http://seekingalpha.com/...of-america?source=yahoo[/quote] Keep queit where you are, in Kenia its erection year and stocks are historically inclined to lose massively in an election year! T-bill for us Kenians is worthwhile. If something is selling at 50% off, why would you run away until when it has gained 40%?? Anyways endeleeni na Tbills, I predict only a few like Hisah will actually be net profiters coz I bet most dont know when to jump out and into equities.
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Rank: User Joined: 5/3/2011 Posts: 559
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@Nabwire, we've been in process of building a Diaspora Investment Fund that mainly invest in Kenyan Market (equity, fixed income and alternative investments) and small cap US public traded companies, even though the fund is structured such that it is a closed fund( investment by invitation), We envision more Kenyans in Diaspora starting structure that will facilitate investments for all!
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