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Death of Nairobi National Park - help save the park!
wanyee
#21 Posted : Thursday, September 15, 2016 7:15:20 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 7/17/2011
Posts: 627
Location: Mbui-Nzau, Kikumbulyu
Pretentious sentimentalism ..Karen/Langata would and should still be part of NNP ..but hey noooh the animals have a right to terrorize, maim and even kill the natives to the South East in the name of wildlife dispersal...ikatwe ijengwe nonsense if someone cares a lot about NNP let them donate a piece of Karen also.
masukuma
#22 Posted : Thursday, September 15, 2016 7:25:14 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
What I find it interesting that homo sapiens tend to think of the earth as "their property". Animals have the right to this place too... they are like you. It's bad enough that you have put them in an enclosure - you now want to kick them out because you have failed to plan for the area you have already? What a wasteful species. You have tracts of land in kiambu unoccupied and laying fallow or being used to "grow maize" and you dare look lustfully at a wildlife sanctuary. Shape up.
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
masukuma
#23 Posted : Thursday, September 15, 2016 7:32:44 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
We don't have wildlife sanctuaries for tourism or revenue... we have them so that animals may live their lives there. Revenues and benefits to human beings are secondary. Si nyinyi muende kuishi huko mnasema wanyama wasongeshwe? Nani hapa alitengeneza mchanga?
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
masukuma
#24 Posted : Thursday, September 15, 2016 7:47:06 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
It may shock you but the universe does not exist for your happiness and convenience.
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
hardwood
#25 Posted : Thursday, September 15, 2016 8:16:27 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/28/2015
Posts: 9,562
Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
masukuma wrote:
We don't have wildlife sanctuaries for tourism or revenue... we have them so that animals may live their lives there. Revenues and benefits to human beings are secondary. Si nyinyi muende kuishi huko mnasema wanyama wasongeshwe? Nani hapa alitengeneza mchanga?


Very well put. In fact when we arrived in the city from the village not so long ago we found animals which have been living in this ecosystem for hundreds (thousands? millions?) of years. And now we the recent immigrants think we have more right than the original owners, the animals, and that they should be moved away. Sad. That park should be left the way it is even if we exhaust all the land between nairobi and mombasa city. We can build in mandera. The species Homo sapiens (man) doesn't have more rights on planet earth than the other species such as Panthera leo (lion), Syncerus caffa (buffalo), Crocuta crocuta (hyena) etc etc. We are the ones who found the animals here in the city and should be the ones to find alternative settlement.
masukuma
#26 Posted : Thursday, September 15, 2016 8:21:32 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
hardwood wrote:
masukuma wrote:
We don't have wildlife sanctuaries for tourism or revenue... we have them so that animals may live their lives there. Revenues and benefits to human beings are secondary. Si nyinyi muende kuishi huko mnasema wanyama wasongeshwe? Nani hapa alitengeneza mchanga?


Very well put. In fact when we arrived in the city from the village not so long ago we found animals which have been living in this ecosystem for hundreds (thousands? millions?) of years. And now we the recent immigrants think we have more right than the original owners, the animals, and that they should be moved away. Sad. That park should be left the way it is even if we exhaust all the land between nairobi and mombasa city. We can build in mandera. The species Homo sapiens (man) doesn't have more rights on planet earth than the other species such as Panthera leo (lion), Syncerus caffa (buffalo), Crocuta crocuta (hyena) etc etc. We are the ones who found the animals here in the city and should be the ones to find alternative settlement.

The sad thing is that it's not for survival purposes i.e. for us to survive animals must die...it's for convenience. Yet we have the means to "develop" alternatives we just find it inconvenient.
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
hardwood
#27 Posted : Thursday, September 15, 2016 9:22:32 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/28/2015
Posts: 9,562
Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
masukuma wrote:
hardwood wrote:
masukuma wrote:
We don't have wildlife sanctuaries for tourism or revenue... we have them so that animals may live their lives there. Revenues and benefits to human beings are secondary. Si nyinyi muende kuishi huko mnasema wanyama wasongeshwe? Nani hapa alitengeneza mchanga?


Very well put. In fact when we arrived in the city from the village not so long ago we found animals which have been living in this ecosystem for hundreds (thousands? millions?) of years. And now we the recent immigrants think we have more right than the original owners, the animals, and that they should be moved away. Sad. That park should be left the way it is even if we exhaust all the land between nairobi and mombasa city. We can build in mandera. The species Homo sapiens (man) doesn't have more rights on planet earth than the other species such as Panthera leo (lion), Syncerus caffa (buffalo), Crocuta crocuta (hyena) etc etc. We are the ones who found the animals here in the city and should be the ones to find alternative settlement.

The sad thing is that it's not for survival purposes i.e. for us to survive animals must die...it's for convenience. Yet we have the means to "develop" alternatives we just find it inconvenient.


I understand the Chinese had proposed to build a 6km tunnel running under the park and leave everything above ground intact. And that would have been much much cheaper than the proposed elevated line over the park. But KWS refused. That tunnel was the best option in my honest opinion.
Alba
#28 Posted : Thursday, September 15, 2016 10:49:36 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 12/27/2012
Posts: 2,256
Location: Bandalungwa
hardwood wrote:


Very well put. In fact when we arrived in the city from the village not so long ago we found animals which have been living in this ecosystem for hundreds (thousands? millions?) of years. And now we the recent immigrants think we have more right than the original owners, the animals, and that they should be moved away. Sad. That park should be left the way it is even if we exhaust all the land between nairobi and mombasa city. We can build in mandera. The species Homo sapiens (man) doesn't have more rights on planet earth than the other species such as Panthera leo (lion), Syncerus caffa (buffalo), Crocuta crocuta (hyena) etc etc. We are the ones who found the animals here in the city and should be the ones to find alternative settlement.


Over 100 years ago, Homo Sapiens were building a railway across Tsavo and some maneless Panthera Leo terrorized Homo Sapiens, attacking them in their sleep. Many Bahindi and Baafrigha labourers lost their lives. Nature will fight back again. Ngoja tu.
hardwood
#29 Posted : Thursday, September 15, 2016 11:01:19 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/28/2015
Posts: 9,562
Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
Alba wrote:
hardwood wrote:


Very well put. In fact when we arrived in the city from the village not so long ago we found animals which have been living in this ecosystem for hundreds (thousands? millions?) of years. And now we the recent immigrants think we have more right than the original owners, the animals, and that they should be moved away. Sad. That park should be left the way it is even if we exhaust all the land between nairobi and mombasa city. We can build in mandera. The species Homo sapiens (man) doesn't have more rights on planet earth than the other species such as Panthera leo (lion), Syncerus caffa (buffalo), Crocuta crocuta (hyena) etc etc. We are the ones who found the animals here in the city and should be the ones to find alternative settlement.


Over 100 years ago, Homo Sapiens were building a railway across Tsavo and some maneless Panthera Leo terrorized Homo Sapiens, attacking them in their sleep. Many Bahindi and Baafrigha labourers lost their lives. Nature will fight back again. Ngoja tu.


If you look at the major cities in the world on Google maps and Google earth you will realise that Nairobi is one of the few cities in the whole world with huge tracts of land sorrounding it available to expand to. Towards kangundo, machakos, tatu and kajiado. Thus i just can't understand the obsession with Nairobi park land.
wa P
#30 Posted : Friday, September 16, 2016 9:51:28 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 5/26/2009
Posts: 326
Location: Nairobi
NNP may not survive the next few years but for reasons completely outside this debate.
There is extremely high rural and other urban migration to Nairobi post the devolution bubble.

Possibly 40% of all Kenya votes will reside in Nairobi by 2022.

Adjacent/ expansion land is mainly held by speculators yet purchase power among <30 is shrinking.

A 'Mwenje' happens; imagine what becomes to animals if just 10,000 angry, hungry and high youths occupy the park even for 1 week.

To protect the NNP (and of course many other urban needs and externalities thereof), a serious economic stimulus is needed in Kenya.

Looking at the current political actors, such stimulus may be a generation or a revolution away.

As for NNP and SGR - let us save our time and efforts. Reli will pass through the park - there is no viable counter-route, no credible counter-advocacy and you-know-who already played his cards well with key appointment at KWS.
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