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Rank: Member Joined: 6/4/2015 Posts: 604
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tycho wrote:masukuma wrote:Njung'e wrote:Othelo wrote:tycho wrote:For me quitting on the God delusion and the concomitant opiate has been most troubling. But seeing the madness it has caused to me I have no option but to abandon the delusions with immediate effect!
Though it leaves me on most curious grounds... now what?   I think he means he has quit madness but i am afraid to ask how. I think it's a tycho way of saying he has lost God and he is not sure of what's next! He finds himself in rather unfamiliar territory. I myself have been 'counting the cost' and it looks like the cost is too great! One can't lose what he/she doesn't have. If there's a cost of losing a delusion then it can't outweigh the benefit. There's this quote I heard when watching one criminal minds episode; it went like, 'the good of losing a delusion is greater than that of grasping a truth'. @Njung'e: To understand how one can quit madness one needs to understand how one gets into it in the first place. In my case I entered via what I may call a cognitive trap. By changing my cognitive configuration I reverse my madness. Ah. This again. Is a terrorist attack on the horizon? Anyway,who's to say your disbelief is not madness or a case of sour grapes?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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masukuma wrote:tycho wrote:masukuma wrote:Njung'e wrote:Othelo wrote:tycho wrote:For me quitting on the God delusion and the concomitant opiate has been most troubling. But seeing the madness it has caused to me I have no option but to abandon the delusions with immediate effect!
Though it leaves me on most curious grounds... now what? I think he means he has quit madness but i am afraid to ask how. I think it's a tycho way of saying he has lost God and he is not sure of what's next! He finds himself in rather unfamiliar territory. I myself have been 'counting the cost' and it looks like the cost is too great! One can't lose what he/she doesn't have. If there's a cost of losing a delusion then it can't outweigh the benefit. There's this quote I heard when watching one criminal minds episode; it went like, 'the good of losing a delusion is greater than that of grasping a truth'. @Njung'e: To understand how one can quit madness one needs to understand how one gets into it in the first place. In my case I entered via what I may call a cognitive trap. By changing my cognitive configuration I reverse my madness. Losing a delusion is just that losing and it is gone. whether you like it or not... it's gone. The conundrum is what happens next! it's like a restart or a 180 degree turn... It is a restart indeed, and for me, there have been moments when I have almost despaired or feared that I was or I'm on the verge of some backlash or harsh criticism- withdrawal symptoms perhaps. But thankfully I have been able to overcome such feelings and experiences at least now and then.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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¿ wrote:tycho wrote:masukuma wrote:Njung'e wrote:Othelo wrote:tycho wrote:For me quitting on the God delusion and the concomitant opiate has been most troubling. But seeing the madness it has caused to me I have no option but to abandon the delusions with immediate effect!
Though it leaves me on most curious grounds... now what? I think he means he has quit madness but i am afraid to ask how. I think it's a tycho way of saying he has lost God and he is not sure of what's next! He finds himself in rather unfamiliar territory. I myself have been 'counting the cost' and it looks like the cost is too great! One can't lose what he/she doesn't have. If there's a cost of losing a delusion then it can't outweigh the benefit. There's this quote I heard when watching one criminal minds episode; it went like, 'the good of losing a delusion is greater than that of grasping a truth'. @Njung'e: To understand how one can quit madness one needs to understand how one gets into it in the first place. In my case I entered via what I may call a cognitive trap. By changing my cognitive configuration I reverse my madness. Ah. This again. Is a terrorist attack on the horizon? Anyway,who's to say your disbelief is not madness or a case of sour grapes? I suspect that you're failing to appreciate the structure of belief. A belief is either mistaken or not mistaken and can only be changed from one form to another. Hence 'disbelief' is not the issue here. Secondly, we need to appreciate what 'madness' is and what tests are given to prove its presence or absence or its degree. Generally the test is the quality of relations with others and the adaptive success that a particular mindset offers. In this case the change in belief offers a positive and more efficient state of being. Finally, 'sour grapes' must be fulfilled by the following condition: one must be seeking something, and failing to attain it, the person justifies the failure by some negating belief. My experience doesn't meet these elements. So it can't be a case of sour grapes. I have found what I have sought and I'm celebrating this finding.
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Rank: Member Joined: 6/4/2015 Posts: 604
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tycho wrote:¿ wrote:tycho wrote:masukuma wrote:Njung'e wrote:Othelo wrote:tycho wrote:For me quitting on the God delusion and the concomitant opiate has been most troubling. But seeing the madness it has caused to me I have no option but to abandon the delusions with immediate effect!
Though it leaves me on most curious grounds... now what? I think he means he has quit madness but i am afraid to ask how. I think it's a tycho way of saying he has lost God and he is not sure of what's next! He finds himself in rather unfamiliar territory. I myself have been 'counting the cost' and it looks like the cost is too great! One can't lose what he/she doesn't have. If there's a cost of losing a delusion then it can't outweigh the benefit. There's this quote I heard when watching one criminal minds episode; it went like, 'the good of losing a delusion is greater than that of grasping a truth'. @Njung'e: To understand how one can quit madness one needs to understand how one gets into it in the first place. In my case I entered via what I may call a cognitive trap. By changing my cognitive configuration I reverse my madness. Ah. This again. Is a terrorist attack on the horizon? Anyway,who's to say your disbelief is not madness or a case of sour grapes? I suspect that you're failing to appreciate the structure of belief. A belief is either mistaken or not mistaken and can only be changed from one form to another. Hence 'disbelief' is not the issue here. Secondly, we need to appreciate what 'madness' is and what tests are given to prove its presence or absence or its degree. Generally the test is the quality of relations with others and the adaptive success that a particular mindset offers. In this case the change in belief offers a positive and more efficient state of being. Finally, 'sour grapes' must be fulfilled by the following condition: one must be seeking something, and failing to attain it, the person justifies the failure by some negating belief. My experience doesn't meet these elements. So it can't be a case of sour grapes. I have found what I have sought and I'm celebrating this finding. Your definition of 'madness' is more ideological than it is accurate.If 'belief' is the issue,who's to say it's not a delusion?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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¿ wrote:tycho wrote:¿ wrote:tycho wrote:masukuma wrote:Njung'e wrote:Othelo wrote:tycho wrote:For me quitting on the God delusion and the concomitant opiate has been most troubling. But seeing the madness it has caused to me I have no option but to abandon the delusions with immediate effect!
Though it leaves me on most curious grounds... now what? I think he means he has quit madness but i am afraid to ask how. I think it's a tycho way of saying he has lost God and he is not sure of what's next! He finds himself in rather unfamiliar territory. I myself have been 'counting the cost' and it looks like the cost is too great! One can't lose what he/she doesn't have. If there's a cost of losing a delusion then it can't outweigh the benefit. There's this quote I heard when watching one criminal minds episode; it went like, 'the good of losing a delusion is greater than that of grasping a truth'. @Njung'e: To understand how one can quit madness one needs to understand how one gets into it in the first place. In my case I entered via what I may call a cognitive trap. By changing my cognitive configuration I reverse my madness. Ah. This again. Is a terrorist attack on the horizon? Anyway,who's to say your disbelief is not madness or a case of sour grapes? I suspect that you're failing to appreciate the structure of belief. A belief is either mistaken or not mistaken and can only be changed from one form to another. Hence 'disbelief' is not the issue here. Secondly, we need to appreciate what 'madness' is and what tests are given to prove its presence or absence or its degree. Generally the test is the quality of relations with others and the adaptive success that a particular mindset offers. In this case the change in belief offers a positive and more efficient state of being. Finally, 'sour grapes' must be fulfilled by the following condition: one must be seeking something, and failing to attain it, the person justifies the failure by some negating belief. My experience doesn't meet these elements. So it can't be a case of sour grapes. I have found what I have sought and I'm celebrating this finding. Your definition of 'madness' is more ideological than it is accurate.If 'belief' is the issue,who's to say it's not a delusion? 1. What's the accurate definition of madness, and what makes it accurate? 2. Who is to say that a belief is a delusion? It is this/these person(s) who can say that another belief isn't a delusion. In the case of no.2 a person may see something to be a pool of water from a certain distance for example, but later show this to be a delusion if he fails to get to the pool no matter how much he appears to approach it. Once again I'll remind you that belief is structured subjectively with respect to internally generated goals.
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Rank: Member Joined: 6/4/2015 Posts: 604
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tycho wrote:¿ wrote:tycho wrote:¿ wrote:tycho wrote:masukuma wrote:Njung'e wrote:Othelo wrote:tycho wrote:For me quitting on the God delusion and the concomitant opiate has been most troubling. But seeing the madness it has caused to me I have no option but to abandon the delusions with immediate effect!
Though it leaves me on most curious grounds... now what? I think he means he has quit madness but i am afraid to ask how. I think it's a tycho way of saying he has lost God and he is not sure of what's next! He finds himself in rather unfamiliar territory. I myself have been 'counting the cost' and it looks like the cost is too great! One can't lose what he/she doesn't have. If there's a cost of losing a delusion then it can't outweigh the benefit. There's this quote I heard when watching one criminal minds episode; it went like, 'the good of losing a delusion is greater than that of grasping a truth'. @Njung'e: To understand how one can quit madness one needs to understand how one gets into it in the first place. In my case I entered via what I may call a cognitive trap. By changing my cognitive configuration I reverse my madness. Ah. This again. Is a terrorist attack on the horizon? Anyway,who's to say your disbelief is not madness or a case of sour grapes? I suspect that you're failing to appreciate the structure of belief. A belief is either mistaken or not mistaken and can only be changed from one form to another. Hence 'disbelief' is not the issue here. Secondly, we need to appreciate what 'madness' is and what tests are given to prove its presence or absence or its degree. Generally the test is the quality of relations with others and the adaptive success that a particular mindset offers. In this case the change in belief offers a positive and more efficient state of being. Finally, 'sour grapes' must be fulfilled by the following condition: one must be seeking something, and failing to attain it, the person justifies the failure by some negating belief. My experience doesn't meet these elements. So it can't be a case of sour grapes. I have found what I have sought and I'm celebrating this finding. Your definition of 'madness' is more ideological than it is accurate.If 'belief' is the issue,who's to say it's not a delusion? 1. What's the accurate definition of madness, and what makes it accurate? 2. Who is to say that a belief is a delusion? It is this/these person(s) who can say that another belief isn't a delusion. In the case of no.2 a person may see something to be a pool of water from a certain distance for example, but later show this to be a delusion if he fails to get to the pool no matter how much he appears to approach it. Once again I'll remind you that belief is structured subjectively with respect to internally generated goals. 1. That's the point. 2. Got it.Belief boils down to internally generated goals and delusion is failing to 'reach the pool of water'.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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¿ wrote:tycho wrote:¿ wrote:tycho wrote:¿ wrote:tycho wrote:masukuma wrote:Njung'e wrote:Othelo wrote:tycho wrote:For me quitting on the God delusion and the concomitant opiate has been most troubling. But seeing the madness it has caused to me I have no option but to abandon the delusions with immediate effect!
Though it leaves me on most curious grounds... now what? I think he means he has quit madness but i am afraid to ask how. I think it's a tycho way of saying he has lost God and he is not sure of what's next! He finds himself in rather unfamiliar territory. I myself have been 'counting the cost' and it looks like the cost is too great! One can't lose what he/she doesn't have. If there's a cost of losing a delusion then it can't outweigh the benefit. There's this quote I heard when watching one criminal minds episode; it went like, 'the good of losing a delusion is greater than that of grasping a truth'. @Njung'e: To understand how one can quit madness one needs to understand how one gets into it in the first place. In my case I entered via what I may call a cognitive trap. By changing my cognitive configuration I reverse my madness. Ah. This again. Is a terrorist attack on the horizon? Anyway,who's to say your disbelief is not madness or a case of sour grapes? I suspect that you're failing to appreciate the structure of belief. A belief is either mistaken or not mistaken and can only be changed from one form to another. Hence 'disbelief' is not the issue here. Secondly, we need to appreciate what 'madness' is and what tests are given to prove its presence or absence or its degree. Generally the test is the quality of relations with others and the adaptive success that a particular mindset offers. In this case the change in belief offers a positive and more efficient state of being. Finally, 'sour grapes' must be fulfilled by the following condition: one must be seeking something, and failing to attain it, the person justifies the failure by some negating belief. My experience doesn't meet these elements. So it can't be a case of sour grapes. I have found what I have sought and I'm celebrating this finding. Your definition of 'madness' is more ideological than it is accurate.If 'belief' is the issue,who's to say it's not a delusion? 1. What's the accurate definition of madness, and what makes it accurate? 2. Who is to say that a belief is a delusion? It is this/these person(s) who can say that another belief isn't a delusion. In the case of no.2 a person may see something to be a pool of water from a certain distance for example, but later show this to be a delusion if he fails to get to the pool no matter how much he appears to approach it. Once again I'll remind you that belief is structured subjectively with respect to internally generated goals. 1. That's the point. 2. Got it.Belief boils down to internally generated goals and delusion is failing to 'reach the pool of water'. The point is a definition has no accuracy requirement. Demanding accuracy is part of the delusion.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 14,316 Location: nairobi
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washiku wrote:Impunity wrote:alma1 wrote:@all as you can see, i've been very cranky this week. Extremely....it's not easy my friends it ain't. So what made decide to quit the double sins? Maybe he wants to build a house  300 beers at 180 per piece can build a 4 bedroom house?? ya paperbags, ama aje.. lol COOP, IMH, KEGN, KQ, MTNU
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Rank: Member Joined: 1/15/2015 Posts: 681 Location: Kenya
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alma1 wrote:From Friday I have gone through some major pain as I try quit my addictions by force.
No more cigarettes and fombe too.
I can assure you its worse than being sick. Not managed to do any work since then. But I hear its good for you. So how is it going @Alma? Have you succeeded over the two vices so far?
60% Learning, 30% synthesizing, 10% Debating
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Rank: Member Joined: 1/15/2015 Posts: 681 Location: Kenya
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@alma1 @hardwood. Hope you guys succeeded.
60% Learning, 30% synthesizing, 10% Debating
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