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Madness at the NSE
mnandii
#2141 Posted : Monday, March 16, 2020 8:58:07 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/11/2006
Posts: 2,304
lochaz-index wrote:
slick wrote:
lochaz-index wrote:
Dow futures dump 1000 points as does the Nikkei. Dax futures down 500 points. It should be a particularly red day for the MIB when the European session kicks off. Will Schengen hold? The agreement may not see light of day when this crisis is over. Fed cuts FFR by 100bps points ahead of schedule in an attempt to stem the bleeding. Not looking good as spreads widen for treasuries and cross currency swaps. Full blown dollar liquidity crisis.

CBs have shown up with a knife to a gunfight...tough luck.


These first world CBs may print themselves into hyperinflation if this keeps up.The sheer number of the money printing liquidity jobs just keep getting bigger to unprecedented levels.I expect this QE to be stepped up aggressively and repo jobs to still continue in their trillions.

I forsee the Fed getting a mandate by Congress to just outright buy stocks and corporate bonds.Its already under discussion behind the scenes.Japanese and Swiss central banks already doing it and I suspect the Fed will join this ludicrous policy and European Central Bank already buys corporate bonds and may join the rest in purchasing Euro stocks.

CBs are chasing the wind here. Buying of stocks is neither here nor there in the grand scheme of things. You can't manufacture a bull market out of thin air or much less so an economic recovery. BoJ has been at it for 20 years with various QE programs yet the Nikkei is more than 50% off its highs. The Japanese economy has been in comatose/collapsing and is literally way worse off than when QE started. The cycle must run to its completion as the market always wins in the end.

The real crisis is what occurs on main street in the form of job layoffs, bankruptcies, deleveraging, credit seize ups etc. Yellen once had the audacity to proclaim that we would never see another recession in our lifetimes. It is simply jaw dropping how much they believed the Keynesian (abenomics) hype about stimulating the economy.


Yes!
Conventional thinkers waste time building shelters when they are unnecessary and then have no shelters when they need them the most. Socionomists do the opposite.
lochaz-index
#2142 Posted : Monday, March 16, 2020 9:16:11 AM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 9/18/2014
Posts: 1,127
lochaz-index wrote:
Dow futures dump 1000 points as does the Nikkei. Dax futures down 500 points. It should be a particularly red day for the MIB when the European session kicks off. Will Schengen hold? The agreement may not see light of day when this crisis is over. Fed cuts FFR by 100bps points ahead of schedule in an attempt to stem the bleeding. Not looking good as spreads widen for treasuries and cross currency swaps. Full blown dollar liquidity crisis.

CBs have shown up with a knife to a gunfight...tough luck.

Red board for Asia as it comes to a close. Leading the pack was the ASX which tanked 9.7%. European session about to open as does the NSE. Dow futures trading triggered circuit breakers earlier.
The main purpose of the stock market is to make fools of as many people as possible.
wukan
#2143 Posted : Monday, March 16, 2020 1:44:39 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 11/13/2015
Posts: 1,654
lochaz-index wrote:
slick wrote:
lochaz-index wrote:
Dow futures dump 1000 points as does the Nikkei. Dax futures down 500 points. It should be a particularly red day for the MIB when the European session kicks off. Will Schengen hold? The agreement may not see light of day when this crisis is over. Fed cuts FFR by 100bps points ahead of schedule in an attempt to stem the bleeding. Not looking good as spreads widen for treasuries and cross currency swaps. Full blown dollar liquidity crisis.

CBs have shown up with a knife to a gunfight...tough luck.


These first world CBs may print themselves into hyperinflation if this keeps up.The sheer number of the money printing liquidity jobs just keep getting bigger to unprecedented levels.I expect this QE to be stepped up aggressively and repo jobs to still continue in their trillions.

I forsee the Fed getting a mandate by Congress to just outright buy stocks and corporate bonds.Its already under discussion behind the scenes.Japanese and Swiss central banks already doing it and I suspect the Fed will join this ludicrous policy and European Central Bank already buys corporate bonds and may join the rest in purchasing Euro stocks.

CBs are chasing the wind here. Buying of stocks is neither here nor there in the grand scheme of things. You can't manufacture a bull market out of thin air or much less so an economic recovery. BoJ has been at it for 20 years with various QE programs yet the Nikkei is more than 50% off its highs. The Japanese economy has been in comatose/collapsing and is literally way worse off than when QE started. The cycle must run to its completion as the market always wins in the end.

The real crisis is what occurs on main street in the form of job layoffs, bankruptcies, deleveraging, credit seize ups etc. Yellen once had the audacity to proclaim that we would never see another recession in our lifetimes. It is simply jaw dropping how much they believed the Keynesian (abenomics) hype about stimulating the economy.


On the other hand restarting economies from zero would be really hard. In worst case scenarios some states may not even survive the bankruptcies. You may need to start from a "Mad max" scenario. Bringing back the social order will be tall order(Somalia is a good example). CBs will keep going even if they have to buy every asset.
slick
#2144 Posted : Monday, March 16, 2020 2:38:10 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 6/1/2017
Posts: 288
wukan wrote:
lochaz-index wrote:
slick wrote:
lochaz-index wrote:
Dow futures dump 1000 points as does the Nikkei. Dax futures down 500 points. It should be a particularly red day for the MIB when the European session kicks off. Will Schengen hold? The agreement may not see light of day when this crisis is over. Fed cuts FFR by 100bps points ahead of schedule in an attempt to stem the bleeding. Not looking good as spreads widen for treasuries and cross currency swaps. Full blown dollar liquidity crisis.

CBs have shown up with a knife to a gunfight...tough luck.


These first world CBs may print themselves into hyperinflation if this keeps up.The sheer number of the money printing liquidity jobs just keep getting bigger to unprecedented levels.I expect this QE to be stepped up aggressively and repo jobs to still continue in their trillions.

I forsee the Fed getting a mandate by Congress to just outright buy stocks and corporate bonds.Its already under discussion behind the scenes.Japanese and Swiss central banks already doing it and I suspect the Fed will join this ludicrous policy and European Central Bank already buys corporate bonds and may join the rest in purchasing Euro stocks.

CBs are chasing the wind here. Buying of stocks is neither here nor there in the grand scheme of things. You can't manufacture a bull market out of thin air or much less so an economic recovery. BoJ has been at it for 20 years with various QE programs yet the Nikkei is more than 50% off its highs. The Japanese economy has been in comatose/collapsing and is literally way worse off than when QE started. The cycle must run to its completion as the market always wins in the end.

The real crisis is what occurs on main street in the form of job layoffs, bankruptcies, deleveraging, credit seize ups etc. Yellen once had the audacity to proclaim that we would never see another recession in our lifetimes. It is simply jaw dropping how much they believed the Keynesian (abenomics) hype about stimulating the economy.


On the other hand restarting economies from zero would be really hard. In worst case scenarios some states may not even survive the bankruptcies. You may need to start from a "Mad max" scenario. Bringing back the social order will be tall order(Somalia is a good example). CBs will keep going even if they have to buy every asset.


A new start is needed even though its painful.This era of central banks just creating fiat from nothing to give to their buddies to buy assets then the lower classes get the fiat last when its already inflated is a corrupt system that benefits only the 1% and is responsible for the large wealth disparity in the world.The nefarious nature of central banking was known in prior centuries and was fought bitterly.Part of the reason of the American revolution in the 1770s to 1790s was to fight against the European central banking establishment that wanted to setup a US central bank and choke the masses under debt.Not known to many is that money is created from debt.The narrative that banks create loans from customer deposits is not entirely true.Banks create money from nothing and lend it out at interest which is sick.Just research on the fractional reserve banking concept it will blow your mind away.US has had 3 central banks.The first was setup in 1791 and scrapped in 1811 when it was realized its creating inflation and debt and just enriching the elites.The establishment then setup a second central bank in 1816 and was disbanded in 1836 after a titanic struggle between then US President Andrew Jackson vs the banking cartel and he disbanded it and paid off all debt owed to that central bank.



Then the Fed was formed in 1913 and has debased the US dollar by 97% since then with its money printing shenanigans to benefit the elites.



Inflation that we are used to as normal is an abnormality created by central banks.In a non central bank dispensation like a gold standard,money value stays static or even appreciates in value over time which is good to maintain the purchasing power for all.By the way the Fed isnt owned by government but owned by member banks like JP Morgan,Citigroup among others and is quasi government-private bankers outfit.The member banks make policy of where interest rates should be and how much money they can print for their own benefit and screw the masses like during the housing bubble where the banks got bailed out and the masses lost massively with their houses being repossessed by the banks.Why didnt they bail out the masses also??


Contrarian Investor and Trader.Advocate of free markets,limited government interference in the economy and sound money
wukan
#2145 Posted : Monday, March 16, 2020 7:25:40 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 11/13/2015
Posts: 1,654
NSE 20 share index ended the day at 2057.96

newfarer
#2146 Posted : Monday, March 16, 2020 8:05:38 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 3/19/2010
Posts: 3,505
Location: Uganda
wukan wrote:
NSE 20 share index ended the day at 2057.96


At this rate they will be issuing free shares to corona survivors. A buy one get one free style
punda amecheka
slick
#2147 Posted : Monday, March 16, 2020 8:21:08 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 6/1/2017
Posts: 288
mnandii wrote:
lochaz-index wrote:
slick wrote:
lochaz-index wrote:
Dow futures dump 1000 points as does the Nikkei. Dax futures down 500 points. It should be a particularly red day for the MIB when the European session kicks off. Will Schengen hold? The agreement may not see light of day when this crisis is over. Fed cuts FFR by 100bps points ahead of schedule in an attempt to stem the bleeding. Not looking good as spreads widen for treasuries and cross currency swaps. Full blown dollar liquidity crisis.

CBs have shown up with a knife to a gunfight...tough luck.


These first world CBs may print themselves into hyperinflation if this keeps up.The sheer number of the money printing liquidity jobs just keep getting bigger to unprecedented levels.I expect this QE to be stepped up aggressively and repo jobs to still continue in their trillions.

I forsee the Fed getting a mandate by Congress to just outright buy stocks and corporate bonds.Its already under discussion behind the scenes.Japanese and Swiss central banks already doing it and I suspect the Fed will join this ludicrous policy and European Central Bank already buys corporate bonds and may join the rest in purchasing Euro stocks.

CBs are chasing the wind here. Buying of stocks is neither here nor there in the grand scheme of things. You can't manufacture a bull market out of thin air or much less so an economic recovery. BoJ has been at it for 20 years with various QE programs yet the Nikkei is more than 50% off its highs. The Japanese economy has been in comatose/collapsing and is literally way worse off than when QE started. The cycle must run to its completion as the market always wins in the end.

The real crisis is what occurs on main street in the form of job layoffs, bankruptcies, deleveraging, credit seize ups etc. Yellen once had the audacity to proclaim that we would never see another recession in our lifetimes. It is simply jaw dropping how much they believed the Keynesian (abenomics) hype about stimulating the economy.


Yes!


@lochaz-index.But they did manufacture a bull market.A fake one from money printing.Post 2008,the major central bank have created 25 trillion of new currency via Quantitative Easing to create this mega bull market to all time highs in stocks and bonds.Fed quintupled the base money supply and S&P equally rose five times in tandem.It was all hot air bubble due to money printing with valuations being ridiculous and US market cap to GDP of over 156% (highest in history).Buffet uses Mkt Cap to GDP as an indicator of an overvalued market and if this percentage is over 100% its overvalued.It was just nominal gains.Mind you Venezuela had the best performing stock market for a number of years because they printed the bolivar to hyperinflation.
Contrarian Investor and Trader.Advocate of free markets,limited government interference in the economy and sound money
lochaz-index
#2148 Posted : Tuesday, March 17, 2020 7:59:38 AM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 9/18/2014
Posts: 1,127
wukan wrote:
NSE 20 share index ended the day at 2057.96


The market should ideally bounce off this level for a relief rally but given what has transpired elsewhere we could be looking at sub-2000 today if the selling persists.
The main purpose of the stock market is to make fools of as many people as possible.
lochaz-index
#2149 Posted : Tuesday, March 17, 2020 8:02:39 AM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 9/18/2014
Posts: 1,127
wukan wrote:
lochaz-index wrote:
slick wrote:
lochaz-index wrote:
Dow futures dump 1000 points as does the Nikkei. Dax futures down 500 points. It should be a particularly red day for the MIB when the European session kicks off. Will Schengen hold? The agreement may not see light of day when this crisis is over. Fed cuts FFR by 100bps points ahead of schedule in an attempt to stem the bleeding. Not looking good as spreads widen for treasuries and cross currency swaps. Full blown dollar liquidity crisis.

CBs have shown up with a knife to a gunfight...tough luck.


These first world CBs may print themselves into hyperinflation if this keeps up.The sheer number of the money printing liquidity jobs just keep getting bigger to unprecedented levels.I expect this QE to be stepped up aggressively and repo jobs to still continue in their trillions.

I forsee the Fed getting a mandate by Congress to just outright buy stocks and corporate bonds.Its already under discussion behind the scenes.Japanese and Swiss central banks already doing it and I suspect the Fed will join this ludicrous policy and European Central Bank already buys corporate bonds and may join the rest in purchasing Euro stocks.

CBs are chasing the wind here. Buying of stocks is neither here nor there in the grand scheme of things. You can't manufacture a bull market out of thin air or much less so an economic recovery. BoJ has been at it for 20 years with various QE programs yet the Nikkei is more than 50% off its highs. The Japanese economy has been in comatose/collapsing and is literally way worse off than when QE started. The cycle must run to its completion as the market always wins in the end.

The real crisis is what occurs on main street in the form of job layoffs, bankruptcies, deleveraging, credit seize ups etc. Yellen once had the audacity to proclaim that we would never see another recession in our lifetimes. It is simply jaw dropping how much they believed the Keynesian (abenomics) hype about stimulating the economy.


On the other hand restarting economies from zero would be really hard. In worst case scenarios some states may not even survive the bankruptcies. You may need to start from a "Mad max" scenario. Bringing back the social order will be tall order(Somalia is a good example). CBs will keep going even if they have to buy every asset.

When you find time research on how Iceland navigated the GFC and came out stronger. All what central banks achieve with bailouts and monetary experiments is weakening the economic system further and setting it up for a more calamitous collapse.
The main purpose of the stock market is to make fools of as many people as possible.
lochaz-index
#2150 Posted : Tuesday, March 17, 2020 8:18:02 AM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 9/18/2014
Posts: 1,127
slick wrote:
mnandii wrote:
lochaz-index wrote:
slick wrote:
lochaz-index wrote:
Dow futures dump 1000 points as does the Nikkei. Dax futures down 500 points. It should be a particularly red day for the MIB when the European session kicks off. Will Schengen hold? The agreement may not see light of day when this crisis is over. Fed cuts FFR by 100bps points ahead of schedule in an attempt to stem the bleeding. Not looking good as spreads widen for treasuries and cross currency swaps. Full blown dollar liquidity crisis.

CBs have shown up with a knife to a gunfight...tough luck.


These first world CBs may print themselves into hyperinflation if this keeps up.The sheer number of the money printing liquidity jobs just keep getting bigger to unprecedented levels.I expect this QE to be stepped up aggressively and repo jobs to still continue in their trillions.

I forsee the Fed getting a mandate by Congress to just outright buy stocks and corporate bonds.Its already under discussion behind the scenes.Japanese and Swiss central banks already doing it and I suspect the Fed will join this ludicrous policy and European Central Bank already buys corporate bonds and may join the rest in purchasing Euro stocks.

CBs are chasing the wind here. Buying of stocks is neither here nor there in the grand scheme of things. You can't manufacture a bull market out of thin air or much less so an economic recovery. BoJ has been at it for 20 years with various QE programs yet the Nikkei is more than 50% off its highs. The Japanese economy has been in comatose/collapsing and is literally way worse off than when QE started. The cycle must run to its completion as the market always wins in the end.

The real crisis is what occurs on main street in the form of job layoffs, bankruptcies, deleveraging, credit seize ups etc. Yellen once had the audacity to proclaim that we would never see another recession in our lifetimes. It is simply jaw dropping how much they believed the Keynesian (abenomics) hype about stimulating the economy.


Yes!


@lochaz-index.But they did manufacture a bull market.A fake one from money printing.Post 2008,the major central bank have created 25 trillion of new currency via Quantitative Easing to create this mega bull market to all time highs in stocks and bonds.Fed quintupled the base money supply and S&P equally rose five times in tandem.It was all hot air bubble due to money printing with valuations being ridiculous and US market cap to GDP of over 156% (highest in history).Buffet uses Mkt Cap to GDP as an indicator of an overvalued market and if this percentage is over 100% its overvalued.It was just nominal gains.Mind you Venezuela had the best performing stock market for a number of years because they printed the bolivar to hyperinflation.

The market bottoms and peaks on its own schedule. Central banks and governments suffer from an illusion of control. The best they can do is delay the proceedings but they can't stop it. If it were possible for CBs and governments to manufacture bull markets/economic recoveries the world would never experience a recession/panic/depression. The Wallstreet idea that CBs created the bull market is a case of mistaking correlation for causation. Yesterday was another exhibit of the impotence of policy makers and failure of central planning.

On Venezuela, you have your facts twisted. There was a bull market thanks to the largest oil reserves in the world which drew in investments. What happens in hyperinflationary situations is not a bull market but a repricing of stocks in line with erosion of the purchasing power of currency. Devaluations achieve the same effect eg devaluation of the Egyptian pound. In nominal terms it appears like a bull market but there are no gains in real terms.
The main purpose of the stock market is to make fools of as many people as possible.
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