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Law Capping interest rates
aemathenge
#2121 Posted : Monday, July 10, 2017 6:43:00 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/18/2008
Posts: 3,434
Location: Kerugoya
wukan wrote:
There is nothing new under the sun. These usury laws were used in US in the 1970's

Come again?
alotoftalk
#2122 Posted : Tuesday, July 11, 2017 12:24:21 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 8/27/2015
Posts: 138
Location: Harare
If and when Kenyan banks return to the era of making super-normal profits it will be after 2019.

2017 - interest caps
2018 - IFRS 9 impact
2019 - upgrade of IT systems/recapitalization

https://www.euromoney.co...osive-effects-of-ifrs-9

http://www.moodysanalyti...impact-banks-information
Investment philosophy development in progress...
obiero
#2123 Posted : Tuesday, July 11, 2017 7:12:05 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 14,227
Location: nairobi
[quote=alotoftalk]If and when Kenyan banks return to the era of making super-normal profits it will be after 2019.

2017 - interest caps
2018 - IFRS 9 impact
2019 - upgrade of IT systems/recapitalization

https://www.euromoney.co...osive-effects-of-ifrs-9

http://www.moodysanalyti...mpact-banks-information[/quote]
Will IFRS 9 really find a ready home in this country. Regardless, Kenyan financial counters are in a tight bind. I'm out until further notice

obiero
#2124 Posted : Tuesday, July 11, 2017 7:28:19 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 14,227
Location: nairobi
obiero wrote:
Gatheuzi wrote:
obiero wrote:
Obi 1 Kanobi wrote:
obiero wrote:
Obi 1 Kanobi wrote:
KNM wrote:
Capping in a free market...LOL. Just as was predicted, small banks folding up with accompanying job losses. It would be laughable were it not so sad.


Which smaller banks have folded? What I see is more of;
1. investors who went into banking for short term gains selling and leaving
2. And banks with poor management and inefficiencies (like NBK) suffering because they are unable to transfer their inefficiencies to poor borrowers through expensive high interest loans

Where have you been dude? Giro, Habib..


The Giro;I&M Deal started may be 2 years before interest rate capping was done and if I am right also concluded before the capping.

Habib Bank also sold out in principle before capping.

If you dig deeper, you will realise that for both these banks, the owners wanted to make their investments more liquid by merging with listed banks, i.e I&M and DTB.

@Obiero, you spend alot of time in the investment section, the least you could do is research more so you write facts.

It does not matter when the negotiation started.. Times are hard. Even Barclays now joins in the party https://www.standardmedi...off-hundreds-of-workers

The main reason given by Barclays for reasulting to lay off was customer preferences shifting to use of mobile and online banking. That is what has lead to redundancy in a large part. But as usual the author goes further to add rate capping comments at the end.

@Gatheuzi do you believe them.. Firing 150 staff only due to technological development.. I personally think that it is an excuse. ICT would have taken down the staff count by higher numbers

@standard chartered to exit several towns http://www.businessdaily...009168-g3hlay/index.html

tom_boy
#2125 Posted : Tuesday, July 11, 2017 8:28:27 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 2/20/2007
Posts: 767
wukan wrote:
tom_boy wrote:
quicksand wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
Interest rates cap was for government to borrow money cheaply in the domestic market


There is no indicator that had the interest rates remained unregulated, the government would have borrowed less.
With no ceiling, rates would have started climbing to the mid-twenties because of irresponsible government borrowing, just like the Cheserem days when TBills hit an eye-watering return rate of 31%. The government was a simple money minting machine for banks back then.
The net effect would have been businesses getting starved of credit anyway.
If the government does not stay the course and reverses the law, it will all have been pointless. Now, Rotich needs to put his thinking cap on and finds another source of money to plug holes and reduce reliability on expensive domestic credit, we need a fiscal disciplinarian, wield a big club and smash heads if a whiff of waste is detected at ministries,..counties...and the good doctor at Central starts squeezing bankster balls. The Trifecta.
Now is not the time to relent, it is time to disembowel and exsanguinate large scale usury and predatory practices in our financial system once and for all, even if it causes us some temporary pain.
We survived 24 years of Moi for God's sake.


My sentiments exactly.

And if M-akiba bond - Pesa link channels are exploited well by Gok, banks will start wailing all over again. Then they will dry their tears and realise they should just get to work and lend responsibly, utilise a working CRB etc etc.


River road economics at its bestd'oh! d'oh! d'oh!

There is nothing new under the sun. These usury laws were used in US in the 1970's and we ended up with prime(whites) and sub-prime borrowers(blacks and other minorities). Banks still made money and super-profits the people who suffered are the sub-prime borrowers most ended up in urban ghettos and minimum wage employment.

If you think 3% credit growth will guarantee your kids employment in this economy in the next 5 years then it's fine. Paraphrasing Kibaki, tuendelee na style hiyo hiyosmile smile



Let me advance my River road economic theory a bit further.

Other than our ' western economists' spelling doom and gloom for banks and the economy due to rate caps, I fail to see how rate caps can be bad for the the middle class, if indeed middle class drive this economy.

Lack of access to loans by middle class means less purchasing of imported, useless luxury, consumption items. How can this be bad for the economy?

It means less buying of useless pieces of land to hold for x years and sell to the next sucker that comes along. Means less land price inflation. How can this be bad for Kenya?

It means less building of mansions in remote places on loan and spending in ordinate amounts of fuel and time getting to and from work while struggling to pay off your loan. How is this bad on a macro economic scale?

It means better planned and executed businesses with proper records and a growth plan , eager to build a credit history and maintain a good credit rating so as to attract cheap bank credit.

It means no more bank funded side hussles like taxi business on loan from an unsecured salary loan. Businesses that inevitably fail or remain mediocre at best despite rosy initial projection.

Any seasoned entreprenuer will tell you that you dont need loads of cash to succeed. Infact, too much cash at the beginning will be your down fall.

My river road economic theory is based on above observations. In my view, a bit of starvation and dieting from credit, useless credit that does not help a business grow, is a good thing.

I am still waiting for the example of a 35% return business that woul qualify for a well regulated bank loan.
They must find it difficult....... those who have taken authority as the truth, rather than truth as the authority. -G. Massey.
KulaRaha
#2126 Posted : Tuesday, July 11, 2017 8:43:47 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/26/2007
Posts: 6,514
What middle class....it was a lie!
Business opportunities are like buses,there's always another one coming
Ngalaka
#2127 Posted : Tuesday, July 11, 2017 10:15:48 AM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 10/29/2008
Posts: 1,566
tom_boy wrote:



Let me advance my River road economic theory a bit further.

Other than our ' western economists' spelling doom and gloom for banks and the economy due to rate caps, I fail to see how rate caps can be bad for the the middle class, if indeed middle class drive this economy.

Lack of access to loans by middle class means less purchasing of imported, useless luxury, consumption items. How can this be bad for the economy?

It means less buying of useless pieces of land to hold for x years and sell to the next sucker that comes along. Means less land price inflation. How can this be bad for Kenya?

It means less building of mansions in remote places on loan and spending in ordinate amounts of fuel and time getting to and from work while struggling to pay off your loan. How is this bad on a macro economic scale?

It means better planned and executed businesses with proper records and a growth plan , eager to build a credit history and maintain a good credit rating so as to attract cheap bank credit.

It means no more bank funded side hussles like taxi business on loan from an unsecured salary loan. Businesses that inevitably fail or remain mediocre at best despite rosy initial projection.

Any seasoned entreprenuer will tell you that you dont need loads of cash to succeed. Infact, too much cash at the beginning will be your down fall.

My river road economic theory is based on above observations. In my view, a bit of starvation and dieting from credit, useless credit that does not help a business grow, is a good thing.

I am still waiting for the example of a 35% return business that woul qualify for a well regulated bank loan.

Are you for real!
d'oh! d'oh! d'oh!
Isuni yilu yi maa me muyo - ni Mbisuu
aemathenge
#2128 Posted : Tuesday, July 11, 2017 10:25:25 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/18/2008
Posts: 3,434
Location: Kerugoya
Ngalaka wrote:
tom_boy wrote:

Let me advance my River road economic theory a bit further.

Other than our ' western economists' spelling doom and gloom for banks and the economy due to rate caps, I fail to see how rate caps can be bad for the the middle class, if indeed middle class drive this economy.

Lack of access to loans by middle class means less purchasing of imported, useless luxury, consumption items. How can this be bad for the economy?

It means less buying of useless pieces of land to hold for x years and sell to the next sucker that comes along. Means less land price inflation. How can this be bad for Kenya?

It means less building of mansions in remote places on loan and spending in ordinate amounts of fuel and time getting to and from work while struggling to pay off your loan. How is this bad on a macro economic scale?

It means better planned and executed businesses with proper records and a growth plan , eager to build a credit history and maintain a good credit rating so as to attract cheap bank credit.

It means no more bank funded side hussles like taxi business on loan from an unsecured salary loan. Businesses that inevitably fail or remain mediocre at best despite rosy initial projection.

Any seasoned entreprenuer will tell you that you dont need loads of cash to succeed. Infact, too much cash at the beginning will be your down fall.

My river road economic theory is based on above observations. In my view, a bit of starvation and dieting from credit, useless credit that does not help a business grow, is a good thing.

I am still waiting for the example of a 35% return business that woul qualify for a well regulated bank loan.

Are you for real!
d'oh! d'oh! d'oh!


Its the silly season over at the Greens @Ngalaka

Some of us need the free entertainment this chap is providing.
wukan
#2129 Posted : Tuesday, July 11, 2017 11:35:06 AM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 11/13/2015
Posts: 1,654
Ngalaka wrote:
tom_boy wrote:



Let me advance my River road economic theory a bit further.

Other than our ' western economists' spelling doom and gloom for banks and the economy due to rate caps, I fail to see how rate caps can be bad for the the middle class, if indeed middle class drive this economy. We have a middle class that cannot afford 150/- unga so now we have subsidized unga at 90/-. But carry on

Lack of access to loans by middle class means less purchasing of imported, useless luxury, consumption items. How can this be bad for the economy?You do realize by economics we simply mean what ordinary folks do to improve their welfare i.e. standard of living by being productive. If there is demand for useless luxury items then someone has to supply

It means less buying of useless pieces of land to hold for x years and sell to the next sucker that comes along. Means less land price inflation. How can this be bad for Kenya? Isn't the market rewarding the person who took the risk to hold that useless piece of land for x years who then sells and improves his living standard. Isn't that person important in the economy for taking that risk of holding useless pieces of land. You do know land transactions support a whole chain of people lawyers,
valuers, brokers etc.


It means less building of mansions in remote places on loan and spending in ordinate amounts of fuel and time getting to and from work while struggling to pay off your loan. How is this bad on a macro economic scale? You think the fundis building those mansions don't need employment. Does it mean the person who built that mansion will now afford land near the city?

It means better planned and executed businesses with proper records and a growth plan , eager to build a credit history and maintain a good credit rating so as to attract cheap bank credit. If your customers can't afford your goods and services in cash or on credit(collapse of purchasing power) your meticulous business plan will not survive first contact with the market.

It means no more bank funded side hussles like taxi business on loan from an unsecured salary loan. Businesses that inevitably fail or remain mediocre at best despite rosy initial projection. Aren't those side hussles responding to consumer demand and isn't the economy the sum total of all those exchanges of goods and services. The only issue is no bank worth it's name will risk it's capital and deposits to fund such a venture at 14% interest. At 23% interest those side 'hussles' were breaking even and thriving

Any seasoned entreprenuer will tell you that you dont need loads of cash to succeed. Infact, too much cash at the beginning will be your down fall.Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly You're kidding right?

My river road economic theory is based on above observations. In my view, a bit of starvation and dieting from credit, useless credit that does not help a business grow, is a good thing. This is terrible theoryPray Pray Pray but from the comments on this thread actually this is economic thinking ruling this time. How about we starve the govt it doesn't need all the useless credit it's taking.

I am still waiting for the example of a 35% return business that woul qualify for a well regulated bank loan.

Are you for real!
d'oh! d'oh! d'oh!

Ericsson
#2130 Posted : Tuesday, July 11, 2017 11:47:10 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 12/4/2009
Posts: 10,809
Location: NAIROBI
Yaani people have time to respond to tom_boy
All the best
Wealth is built through a relatively simple equation
Wealth=Income + Investments - Lifestyle
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