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Descendants of Slaves Kidnapped from Kenya
mv_ufanisi
#1 Posted : Thursday, June 18, 2020 5:01:31 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 1/15/2010
Posts: 625
Being a big history buff, I'm very interested in finding out about how slavery affected Kenyans and Kenyan tribes. I'm also keen to make sure that we don't forget this important history that connects us with black people all over the world some of whom were kidnapped and stolen from us.

So I've been doing some research and this is what I can find so far.

Would appreciate Wazuans who are in the know sharing more content here.

Kikuyu People

Mustapha Olpak - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mustafa_Olpak was an Afro-Turkish writer and activist whose ancestors were Kikuyu people who were sold into slavery in 1890 to Turkey. His book Kenya-Girit-İstanbul: Köle Kıyısından İnsan Biyografileri has been compared to Alex Haley's Roots.

Kamba People
There is a group of Afro-Paraguayans who were descended from Kamba people and have managed to maintain their culture. They are called Kamba Kua and Kamba Kokue in Paraguay. Here's some links to them
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Op4-nZypCQ
mv_ufanisi
#2 Posted : Friday, June 19, 2020 12:45:07 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 1/15/2010
Posts: 625
Here are two books showing some of the earliest journeys into Kenya by European explorers and troublemakers

1. Discovery of Lake Rudolf and Stephanie - the journey by Count Samuel Teleki written by Ludwig von Hohnel which happened circa 1887 and 1888
https://books.google.co....epage&q&f=false

Here is an image of a Kikuyu War Shield which Count Teleki donated to a Hungarian Museum afterwards

https://www.neprajz.hu/e..._kikuyu-war-shield.html

2. Through Jungle and Desert by William Astor Chanler circa 1892
https://www.google.com/b...&printsec=frontcover
mv_ufanisi
#3 Posted : Monday, June 22, 2020 11:07:00 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 1/15/2010
Posts: 625
The e-book called “The Discovery of Lake Rudolf and Lake Stefanie” by Ludgwig von Hohnel which describes Count Samuel Teleki’s travel to Lake Turkana between 1887 and 1888.

On Page 284, it says “Abdullah had bought 200 Slaves from Kikuyuland and Kambaland on his way from the coast to Lake Baringo”.

On Page 302 there is an account of the Count Teleki’s caravan being offered slaves for sale in Kikuyuland including a young woman with a baby at her breast and with a three year old little boy at her hand all of who were then bought by Jumbe Kimameta for twenty rings of iron wire and twenty strings of Masai beads all of which were approimately equal to the value of 1 Dollar.

Here being clear evidence of slave dealing in Kikuyuland.
kaka2za
#4 Posted : Monday, June 22, 2020 11:44:53 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/3/2008
Posts: 4,058
Location: Gwitu
mv_ufanisi wrote:
The e-book called “The Discovery of Lake Rudolf and Lake Stefanie” by Ludgwig von Hohnel which describes Count Samuel Teleki’s travel to Lake Turkana between 1887 and 1888.

On Page 284, it says “Abdullah had bought 200 Slaves from Kikuyuland and Kambaland on his way from the coast to Lake Baringo”.

On Page 302 there is an account of the Count Teleki’s caravan being offered slaves for sale in Kikuyuland including a young woman with a baby at her breast and with a three year old little boy at her hand all of who were then bought by Jumbe Kimameta for twenty rings of iron wire and twenty strings of Masai beads all of which were approimately equal to the value of 1 Dollar.

Here being clear evidence of slave dealing in Kikuyuland.


If want to know if something existed in a community, check if there is a local name or word for it.
Kikuyu have a name for slaves but none for gays.
Even none for fish!
Truth forever on the scaffold
Wrong forever on the throne
(James Russell Rowell)
Lolest!
#5 Posted : Monday, June 22, 2020 3:11:44 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 3/18/2011
Posts: 12,069
Location: Kianjokoma
kaka2za wrote:
mv_ufanisi wrote:
The e-book called “The Discovery of Lake Rudolf and Lake Stefanie” by Ludgwig von Hohnel which describes Count Samuel Teleki’s travel to Lake Turkana between 1887 and 1888.

On Page 284, it says “Abdullah had bought 200 Slaves from Kikuyuland and Kambaland on his way from the coast to Lake Baringo”.

On Page 302 there is an account of the Count Teleki’s caravan being offered slaves for sale in Kikuyuland including a young woman with a baby at her breast and with a three year old little boy at her hand all of who were then bought by Jumbe Kimameta for twenty rings of iron wire and twenty strings of Masai beads all of which were approimately equal to the value of 1 Dollar.

Here being clear evidence of slave dealing in Kikuyuland.


If want to know if something existed in a community, check if there is a local name or word for it.
Kikuyu have a name for slaves but none for gays.
Even none for fish!

But we've heard how the southern Kikuyu sold Maasai refugees
Laughing out loudly smile Applause d'oh! Sad Drool Liar Shame on you Pray
kaka2za
#6 Posted : Monday, June 22, 2020 3:46:06 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/3/2008
Posts: 4,058
Location: Gwitu
Lolest! wrote:
kaka2za wrote:
mv_ufanisi wrote:
The e-book called “The Discovery of Lake Rudolf and Lake Stefanie” by Ludgwig von Hohnel which describes Count Samuel Teleki’s travel to Lake Turkana between 1887 and 1888.

On Page 284, it says “Abdullah had bought 200 Slaves from Kikuyuland and Kambaland on his way from the coast to Lake Baringo”.

On Page 302 there is an account of the Count Teleki’s caravan being offered slaves for sale in Kikuyuland including a young woman with a baby at her breast and with a three year old little boy at her hand all of who were then bought by Jumbe Kimameta for twenty rings of iron wire and twenty strings of Masai beads all of which were approimately equal to the value of 1 Dollar.

Here being clear evidence of slave dealing in Kikuyuland.


If want to know if something existed in a community, check if there is a local name or word for it.
Kikuyu have a name for slaves but none for gays.
Even none for fish!

But we've heard how the southern Kikuyu sold Maasai refugees


Precisely!
Kikuyus have a name for slaves 'Ngombo' which means slavery existed
Truth forever on the scaffold
Wrong forever on the throne
(James Russell Rowell)
sqft
#7 Posted : Monday, June 22, 2020 4:04:15 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 1/10/2015
Posts: 961
Location: Kenya
mv_ufanisi wrote:
The e-book called “The Discovery of Lake Rudolf and Lake Stefanie” by Ludgwig von Hohnel which describes Count Samuel Teleki’s travel to Lake Turkana between 1887 and 1888.

On Page 284, it says “Abdullah had bought 200 Slaves from Kikuyuland and Kambaland on his way from the coast to Lake Baringo”.

On Page 302 there is an account of the Count Teleki’s caravan being offered slaves for sale in Kikuyuland including a young woman with a baby at her breast and with a three year old little boy at her hand all of who were then bought by Jumbe Kimameta for twenty rings of iron wire and twenty strings of Masai beads all of which were approimately equal to the value of 1 Dollar.

Here being clear evidence of slave dealing in Kikuyuland.


I have read the book and it states clearly that the slaves were wakamba or maasai or those captured/ escapees from trading caravans. Note that whenever the kikuyu raided other communities they killed the men and old women and took away the young women. And those captured could not be taken as wives by their captors but were seen as property. So yes kikuyus had slaves but those slaves were not kikuyus.

Pg 340
Quote:
The natives (wakikuyu) brought food ,weapons, and ornaments in great qantities for sale. They also offered us slaves , chiefly girls from Ukambani, with a few Masai maidens. They were ready to accept almost anything in payment, but they preferred deep red Masai beads and thick brass wire. Some of our people,
who had been ailing ever since we left Taveta, ran away here in the night, probably tempted by the fertility of the land , but their fate was pretty sure to be slavery , and the natives always consider such fugitives their property. A good many caravan
men are caught in this way, but they always hope to evade their new masters on some favourable opportunity.
Proverbs 13:11 Dishonest money dwindles away, but whoever gathers money little by little makes it grow.
sqft
#8 Posted : Monday, June 22, 2020 4:14:33 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 1/10/2015
Posts: 961
Location: Kenya
kaka2za wrote:


If want to know if something existed in a community, check if there is a local name or word for it.
Kikuyu have a name for slaves but none for gays.
Even none for fish!


The rivers in central are too cold for fish. Trout, a cold-water fish, was introduced by colonialists. Tilapia was also introduced in the lower warmer areas like sagana. That is why kikuyu don't have a history with fish and referred to fish as tadpoles aka ciunguyu.
Proverbs 13:11 Dishonest money dwindles away, but whoever gathers money little by little makes it grow.
mv_ufanisi
#9 Posted : Monday, June 22, 2020 10:58:04 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 1/15/2010
Posts: 625
Lolest! wrote:
kaka2za wrote:
mv_ufanisi wrote:
The e-book called “The Discovery of Lake Rudolf and Lake Stefanie” by Ludgwig von Hohnel which describes Count Samuel Teleki’s travel to Lake Turkana between 1887 and 1888.

On Page 284, it says “Abdullah had bought 200 Slaves from Kikuyuland and Kambaland on his way from the coast to Lake Baringo”.

On Page 302 there is an account of the Count Teleki’s caravan being offered slaves for sale in Kikuyuland including a young woman with a baby at her breast and with a three year old little boy at her hand all of who were then bought by Jumbe Kimameta for twenty rings of iron wire and twenty strings of Masai beads all of which were approimately equal to the value of 1 Dollar.

Here being clear evidence of slave dealing in Kikuyuland.


If want to know if something existed in a community, check if there is a local name or word for it.
Kikuyu have a name for slaves but none for gays.
Even none for fish!

But we've heard how the southern Kikuyu sold Maasai refugees


whats your source for this information?
mv_ufanisi
#10 Posted : Monday, June 22, 2020 11:00:27 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 1/15/2010
Posts: 625
sqft wrote:
mv_ufanisi wrote:
The e-book called “The Discovery of Lake Rudolf and Lake Stefanie” by Ludgwig von Hohnel which describes Count Samuel Teleki’s travel to Lake Turkana between 1887 and 1888.

On Page 284, it says “Abdullah had bought 200 Slaves from Kikuyuland and Kambaland on his way from the coast to Lake Baringo”.

On Page 302 there is an account of the Count Teleki’s caravan being offered slaves for sale in Kikuyuland including a young woman with a baby at her breast and with a three year old little boy at her hand all of who were then bought by Jumbe Kimameta for twenty rings of iron wire and twenty strings of Masai beads all of which were approimately equal to the value of 1 Dollar.

Here being clear evidence of slave dealing in Kikuyuland.


I have read the book and it states clearly that the slaves were wakamba or maasai or those captured/ escapees from trading caravans. Note that whenever the kikuyu raided other communities they killed the men and old women and took away the young women. And those captured could not be taken as wives by their captors but were seen as property. So yes kikuyus had slaves but those slaves were not kikuyus.

Pg 340
Quote:
The natives (wakikuyu) brought food ,weapons, and ornaments in great qantities for sale. They also offered us slaves , chiefly girls from Ukambani, with a few Masai maidens. They were ready to accept almost anything in payment, but they preferred deep red Masai beads and thick brass wire. Some of our people,
who had been ailing ever since we left Taveta, ran away here in the night, probably tempted by the fertility of the land , but their fate was pretty sure to be slavery , and the natives always consider such fugitives their property. A good many caravan
men are caught in this way, but they always hope to evade their new masters on some favourable opportunity.


which book are u referring to with page 340? I'm looking for that passage but cant seem to find it
mv_ufanisi
#11 Posted : Monday, June 22, 2020 11:04:38 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 1/15/2010
Posts: 625
kaka2za wrote:
Lolest! wrote:
kaka2za wrote:
mv_ufanisi wrote:
The e-book called “The Discovery of Lake Rudolf and Lake Stefanie” by Ludgwig von Hohnel which describes Count Samuel Teleki’s travel to Lake Turkana between 1887 and 1888.

On Page 284, it says “Abdullah had bought 200 Slaves from Kikuyuland and Kambaland on his way from the coast to Lake Baringo”.

On Page 302 there is an account of the Count Teleki’s caravan being offered slaves for sale in Kikuyuland including a young woman with a baby at her breast and with a three year old little boy at her hand all of who were then bought by Jumbe Kimameta for twenty rings of iron wire and twenty strings of Masai beads all of which were approimately equal to the value of 1 Dollar.

Here being clear evidence of slave dealing in Kikuyuland.


If want to know if something existed in a community, check if there is a local name or word for it.
Kikuyu have a name for slaves but none for gays.
Even none for fish!

But we've heard how the southern Kikuyu sold Maasai refugees


Precisely!
Kikuyus have a name for slaves 'Ngombo' which means slavery existed


I wonder how many Kenyans were sold into far away lands in this way and where they now are. Apart from the Kamba Kua and Kokue of Paraguay and Mustapha Olpak do we know of any others? There must be a lot more in Arabia, India, Pakistan and around such areas. The Sindh area of Pakistan has a large Afro population which most likely came from East Africa
mv_ufanisi
#12 Posted : Monday, June 22, 2020 11:10:02 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 1/15/2010
Posts: 625
It is claimed that one if the reasons that the population of East Africa never was that big was because of the endless slave trade. Given that the east African slave trade started about 700 or so years before the West African one, we must have lost a huge number of people to the Arab caravans.

Unfortunately this history is very hidden and we dont really learn about it in Kenyan history. I remember seeing a black emirati in Dubai and wondering if he might be descended from Kenya.

Here's a story about a Siddi in Pakistan who was the first to be nominated to their parliament. https://www.google.com/a.../amp/world-asia-45099970
kaka2za
#13 Posted : Monday, June 22, 2020 11:49:38 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/3/2008
Posts: 4,058
Location: Gwitu
[quote=mv_ufanisi]It is claimed that one if the reasons that the population of East Africa never was that big was because of the endless slave trade. Given that the east African slave trade started about 700 or so years before the West African one, we must have lost a huge number of people to the Arab caravans.

Unfortunately this history is very hidden and we dont really learn about it in Kenyan history. I remember seeing a black emirati in Dubai and wondering if he might be descended from Kenya.

Here's a story about a Siddi in Pakistan who was the first to be nominated to their parliament. https://www.google.com/a...amp/world-asia-45099970[/quote]





There isn't much in our oral history about slave raids so they probably never happened.
Truth forever on the scaffold
Wrong forever on the throne
(James Russell Rowell)
mv_ufanisi
#14 Posted : Tuesday, June 23, 2020 7:33:14 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 1/15/2010
Posts: 625
kaka2za wrote:
[quote=mv_ufanisi]It is claimed that one if the reasons that the population of East Africa never was that big was because of the endless slave trade. Given that the east African slave trade started about 700 or so years before the West African one, we must have lost a huge number of people to the Arab caravans.

Unfortunately this history is very hidden and we dont really learn about it in Kenyan history. I remember seeing a black emirati in Dubai and wondering if he might be descended from Kenya.

Here's a story about a Siddi in Pakistan who was the first to be nominated to their parliament. https://www.google.com/a...amp/world-asia-45099970[/quote]





There isn't much in our oral history about slave raids so they probably never happened.


the fact the last of these raids happened in the early 1900s. Most of the others would have happened during the 1800s and before. We have lost most oral history from such periods.

there was debt based indenturement - the word ngobo in Kikuyu comes from the word ngoba, which suggests a debt. so some people went into the debt of others especially during famines and sometimes many would put up their women and children for a debt especially during famine.
sqft
#15 Posted : Tuesday, June 23, 2020 8:35:21 AM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 1/10/2015
Posts: 961
Location: Kenya
mv_ufanisi wrote:
sqft wrote:
mv_ufanisi wrote:
The e-book called “The Discovery of Lake Rudolf and Lake Stefanie” by Ludgwig von Hohnel which describes Count Samuel Teleki’s travel to Lake Turkana between 1887 and 1888.

On Page 284, it says “Abdullah had bought 200 Slaves from Kikuyuland and Kambaland on his way from the coast to Lake Baringo”.

On Page 302 there is an account of the Count Teleki’s caravan being offered slaves for sale in Kikuyuland including a young woman with a baby at her breast and with a three year old little boy at her hand all of who were then bought by Jumbe Kimameta for twenty rings of iron wire and twenty strings of Masai beads all of which were approimately equal to the value of 1 Dollar.

Here being clear evidence of slave dealing in Kikuyuland.


I have read the book and it states clearly that the slaves were wakamba or maasai or those captured/ escapees from trading caravans. Note that whenever the kikuyu raided other communities they killed the men and old women and took away the young women. And those captured could not be taken as wives by their captors but were seen as property. So yes kikuyus had slaves but those slaves were not kikuyus.

Pg 340
Quote:
The natives (wakikuyu) brought food ,weapons, and ornaments in great qantities for sale. They also offered us slaves , chiefly girls from Ukambani, with a few Masai maidens. They were ready to accept almost anything in payment, but they preferred deep red Masai beads and thick brass wire. Some of our people,
who had been ailing ever since we left Taveta, ran away here in the night, probably tempted by the fertility of the land , but their fate was pretty sure to be slavery , and the natives always consider such fugitives their property. A good many caravan
men are caught in this way, but they always hope to evade their new masters on some favourable opportunity.


which book are u referring to with page 340? I'm looking for that passage but cant seem to find it

Page 315 Vol 1.
Proverbs 13:11 Dishonest money dwindles away, but whoever gathers money little by little makes it grow.
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