Rank: Veteran Joined: 12/11/2006 Posts: 930
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Rank: Elder Joined: 1/21/2010 Posts: 6,675 Location: Nairobi
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I bought 10 shares in this at $228 last year and didn't think anything would come of it in the short term. Target price for 5 years already smashed and still holding on Mark 12:29 Deuteronomy 4:16
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Rank: Member Joined: 6/1/2017 Posts: 288
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guru267 wrote:I bought 10 shares in this at $228 last year and didn't think anything would come of it in the short term. Target price for 5 years already smashed and still holding on Yeah.Buying at $228 was relatively reasonable but buying it now is quite risky.Look at the whipsaw action especially lately.Today the stock gapped up 10% at market open then got hammered an almost 10% as I write this.That volatility is just nuts.Its price action is like a penny stock or cryptos How Tesla bulls fantasize on the stock  How Tesla bears mock the stock  Contrarian Investor and Trader.Advocate of free markets,limited government interference in the economy and sound money
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Rank: Member Joined: 12/1/2007 Posts: 539 Location: Nakuru
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Rank: Elder Joined: 11/5/2010 Posts: 2,459
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The other day when fuelling, I had in the car my daughter and her two cousins all below 10.
I told them in future cars won't need to be fuelled but charged.
"You mean like tesla, we know that". How do you know ? I asked. "YouTube videos". Apparently every popular vlogger/youtuber has a Tesla and they regularly share videos about it.
That is the moment I realized the future belongs to EV, and Tesla is the undisputed king of the future.
Norway and Germany are leading Europe in EV adoption. The irony is not lost. Norway made her fortune selling oil and Germany is the manufacturing capital of internal combustion engines.
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Rank: Member Joined: 6/1/2017 Posts: 288
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FRM2011 wrote:The other day when fuelling, I had in the car my daughter and her two cousins all below 10.
I told them in future cars won't need to be fuelled but charged.
"You mean like tesla, we know that". How do you know ? I asked. "YouTube videos". Apparently every popular vlogger/youtuber has a Tesla and they regularly share videos about it.
That is the moment I realized the future belongs to EV, and Tesla is the undisputed king of the future.
Norway and Germany are leading Europe in EV adoption. The irony is not lost. Norway made her fortune selling oil and Germany is the manufacturing capital of internal combustion engines. Yes no doubt that Tesla EV cars are revolutionary and way ahead of competition but caveat is that Tesla most times sells its cars at a loss. Tesla made and delivered more cars in the second quarter of 2019 than it did in any other quarter in company history, but still lost $408 million, according to a new filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission. They suffered an even bigger $702 million loss posted in the first quarter of 2019.Most times they suffer from negative Free Cash Flow (FCF).Look at the appalling losses and meagre profits that the meteorite Tesla makes on selling cars vs the dinosaur other competitors per quarter.  They had been a loss making company for many years with only recently earning a profit largely from sale of EV credits. Since Tesla cars don't emit hydrocarbons,they have a massive EV credit that they sell to internal combustion car makers so that the latter can avoid even larger taxes for selling cars that emit hydrocarbons.Also they raise lots of their capital from issuing junk debt and interest rate on the US junk bond market is artificially suppressed (as is the rest of the entire US interest rate environment) by the Fed money printing to push rates down and supply cheap money to the economy thus keep zombie companies that cannot be solvent at higher normal interest rates alive.The US junk bond market-like the Mortgage Backed Securities (MBS) of the housing bubble of early 2000s has already started showing signs of distress hence the current massive Fed liquidity injections to prevent an implosion of the corporate bond market similar to collapse of MBS market in the 2008 financial crisis.Also,lots of Tesla bears short sellers believe Tesla's financials are cooked and could be a ponzi scheme like Enron and the long term prospects at least in terms of financials is dire and the company stock could collapse to zero.Billionaire major Tesla short like Jim Chanos on image above and other famous Tesla short sellers like Andrew Left believe the business model of Tesla isnt sustainable as per financials. One also shouldn't forget the controversial mercurial nature of Elon Musk calling an analyst "bonehead" during a conference call;misleading investors by pumping up the stock last year by tweeting the infamous "funding secured" whereby he was almost forced out as CEO and was compelled to pay a 20 million fine for the tweet.Also he openly smoked marijuana on a major podcast in what most investors felt was unbecoming of a CEO of a major US company.  It is this paradox of Tesla ie great prospects for EV innovation vs crappy possibly fraudulent financials that make it the most emotive stock in the US equity market with fanatical bulls and bears at each other's throats hence the wild price action swings.  It remains to see if Tesla unravels like Enron or becomes an icon to be revered in the future. Thus is Tesla a Prodigy or a Ponzi?The future will decide this Contrarian Investor and Trader.Advocate of free markets,limited government interference in the economy and sound money
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/22/2008 Posts: 2,721
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FRM2011 wrote:The other day when fuelling, I had in the car my daughter and her two cousins all below 10.
I told them in future cars won't need to be fuelled but charged.
"You mean like tesla, we know that". How do you know ? I asked. "YouTube videos". Apparently every popular vlogger/youtuber has a Tesla and they regularly share videos about it.
That is the moment I realized the future belongs to EV, and Tesla is the undisputed king of the future.
Norway and Germany are leading Europe in EV adoption. The irony is not lost. Norway made her fortune selling oil and Germany is the manufacturing capital of internal combustion engines. The future of cars is electric but that does not necessarily mean Tesla. What convinced me is hearing in a video episode about Car making in Germany the presenter saying "an average internal combustion engine car has about 2000 moving parts, an electric car has about 200 moving parts". They are very easy to make. The concern for Germany is the loss of work for all those highly trained engineers who have perfected the art of making all sorts of engines. An electric car maker needs only a fraction of the workforce. All major car makers already have an electric vehicle and its just a matter of time before they catch up with Tesla. Japanese and Germans are masters of efficiency and I bet they will soon be giving Tesla a run for their money with pricing. The biggest threat to those industries in Japan and Germany is unemployment. As the industry gets shaken up smaller car companies might be quicker to change and grow big and dominant in the EV world; the likes of Volvo, Porsche, BMW etc. In fact I was watching a video that mentioned that BMW has the best combination right now because they have an electric car that also has a small engine that can take you 70km if you run out of charge. The engine does not run the car directly but recharges the battery so the car is not a hybrid but 100% electric.
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Rank: Member Joined: 10/6/2015 Posts: 249 Location: Nairobi
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slick wrote:FRM2011 wrote:The other day when fuelling, I had in the car my daughter and her two cousins all below 10.
I told them in future cars won't need to be fuelled but charged.
"You mean like tesla, we know that". How do you know ? I asked. "YouTube videos". Apparently every popular vlogger/youtuber has a Tesla and they regularly share videos about it.
That is the moment I realized the future belongs to EV, and Tesla is the undisputed king of the future.
Norway and Germany are leading Europe in EV adoption. The irony is not lost. Norway made her fortune selling oil and Germany is the manufacturing capital of internal combustion engines. Yes no doubt that Tesla EV cars are revolutionary and way ahead of competition but caveat is that Tesla most times sells its cars at a loss. Tesla made and delivered more cars in the second quarter of 2019 than it did in any other quarter in company history, but still lost $408 million, according to a new filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission. They suffered an even bigger $702 million loss posted in the first quarter of 2019.Most times they suffer from negative Free Cash Flow (FCF).Look at the appalling losses and meagre profits that the meteorite Tesla makes on selling cars vs the dinosaur other competitors per quarter.  They had been a loss making company for many years with only recently earning a profit largely from sale of EV credits. Since Tesla cars don't emit hydrocarbons,they have a massive EV credit that they sell to internal combustion car makers so that the latter can avoid even larger taxes for selling cars that emit hydrocarbons.Also they raise lots of their capital from issuing junk debt and interest rate on the US junk bond market is artificially suppressed (as is the rest of the entire US interest rate environment) by the Fed money printing to push rates down and supply cheap money to the economy thus keep zombie companies that cannot be solvent at higher normal interest rates alive.The US junk bond market-like the Mortgage Backed Securities (MBS) of the housing bubble of early 2000s has already started showing signs of distress hence the current massive Fed liquidity injections to prevent an implosion of the corporate bond market similar to collapse of MBS market in the 2008 financial crisis.Also,lots of Tesla bears short sellers believe Tesla's financials are cooked and could be a ponzi scheme like Enron and the long term prospects at least in terms of financials is dire and the company stock could collapse to zero.Billionaire major Tesla short like Jim Chanos on image above and other famous Tesla short sellers like Andrew Left believe the business model of Tesla isnt sustainable as per financials. One also shouldn't forget the controversial mercurial nature of Elon Musk calling an analyst "bonehead" during a conference call;misleading investors by pumping up the stock last year by tweeting the infamous "funding secured" whereby he was almost forced out as CEO and was compelled to pay a 20 million fine for the tweet.Also he openly smoked marijuana on a major podcast in what most investors felt was unbecoming of a CEO of a major US company.  It is this paradox of Tesla ie great prospects for EV innovation vs crappy possibly fraudulent financials that make it the most emotive stock in the US equity market with fanatical bulls and bears at each other's throats hence the wild price action swings.  It remains to see if Tesla unravels like Enron or becomes an icon to be revered in the future. Thus is Tesla a Prodigy or a Ponzi?The future will decide this Tesla is the quintessential "meme stock" Once it's on the move,don't kvetch,throw the fundamentals out the window,go out on a limb and ride the tide.Just don't be caught holding the bag when the music stops. Never lose your position in a bull market,BTFD.
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Rank: Member Joined: 6/1/2017 Posts: 288
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mamilli wrote:slick wrote:FRM2011 wrote:The other day when fuelling, I had in the car my daughter and her two cousins all below 10.
I told them in future cars won't need to be fuelled but charged.
"You mean like tesla, we know that". How do you know ? I asked. "YouTube videos". Apparently every popular vlogger/youtuber has a Tesla and they regularly share videos about it.
That is the moment I realized the future belongs to EV, and Tesla is the undisputed king of the future.
Norway and Germany are leading Europe in EV adoption. The irony is not lost. Norway made her fortune selling oil and Germany is the manufacturing capital of internal combustion engines. Yes no doubt that Tesla EV cars are revolutionary and way ahead of competition but caveat is that Tesla most times sells its cars at a loss. Tesla made and delivered more cars in the second quarter of 2019 than it did in any other quarter in company history, but still lost $408 million, according to a new filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission. They suffered an even bigger $702 million loss posted in the first quarter of 2019.Most times they suffer from negative Free Cash Flow (FCF).Look at the appalling losses and meagre profits that the meteorite Tesla makes on selling cars vs the dinosaur other competitors per quarter.  They had been a loss making company for many years with only recently earning a profit largely from sale of EV credits. Since Tesla cars don't emit hydrocarbons,they have a massive EV credit that they sell to internal combustion car makers so that the latter can avoid even larger taxes for selling cars that emit hydrocarbons.Also they raise lots of their capital from issuing junk debt and interest rate on the US junk bond market is artificially suppressed (as is the rest of the entire US interest rate environment) by the Fed money printing to push rates down and supply cheap money to the economy thus keep zombie companies that cannot be solvent at higher normal interest rates alive.The US junk bond market-like the Mortgage Backed Securities (MBS) of the housing bubble of early 2000s has already started showing signs of distress hence the current massive Fed liquidity injections to prevent an implosion of the corporate bond market similar to collapse of MBS market in the 2008 financial crisis.Also,lots of Tesla bears short sellers believe Tesla's financials are cooked and could be a ponzi scheme like Enron and the long term prospects at least in terms of financials is dire and the company stock could collapse to zero.Billionaire major Tesla short like Jim Chanos on image above and other famous Tesla short sellers like Andrew Left believe the business model of Tesla isnt sustainable as per financials. One also shouldn't forget the controversial mercurial nature of Elon Musk calling an analyst "bonehead" during a conference call;misleading investors by pumping up the stock last year by tweeting the infamous "funding secured" whereby he was almost forced out as CEO and was compelled to pay a 20 million fine for the tweet.Also he openly smoked marijuana on a major podcast in what most investors felt was unbecoming of a CEO of a major US company.  It is this paradox of Tesla ie great prospects for EV innovation vs crappy possibly fraudulent financials that make it the most emotive stock in the US equity market with fanatical bulls and bears at each other's throats hence the wild price action swings.  It remains to see if Tesla unravels like Enron or becomes an icon to be revered in the future. Thus is Tesla a Prodigy or a Ponzi?The future will decide this Tesla is the quintessential "meme stock" Once it's on the move,don't kvetch,throw the fundamentals out the window,go out on a limb and ride the tide.Just don't be caught holding the bag when the music stops. Exactly @mamili.Fundamentals of Tesla doesnt justify the current price of the stock.Its just future expectations that they will revolutionalize the EV market plus Musk cut following.Well,the entire US stock market has thrown fundamentals out of the window.Generally earnings have stagnated or fallen in the last few years but stock prices have exploded in multiples to achieve the greatest overvaluations in history surpassing even the dotcom mania that ended in tears.So what's driving the mania.Simple Fed liquidity.The Fed is injecting tens of billions of new money into the financial system via the repurchase agreement market everyday thus stocks keep hitting intraday and/or closing at all time highs daily.The Fed's liquidity is even defying the fears of coronavirus which the market could be massively mispricing.With the world's second largest economy (some even say its the world's largest economy in GDP PPP terms) and the world's largest manufacturing hub in lockdown,global supply chains are in trouble and could get very ugly if the virus isnt contained.Once this dawns on wall street and many more US citizens get infected with the virus,the high frequency trading computer algos on Wall Street could trigger a panic selling. Irony is that some major factories are shutdown in China but US stocks still go up.Foxconn,a Apple manufacturing partner in China,has basically shutdown (only 10% of workforce resumed work last Monday)but Apple stock still hits all time highs almost daily.Tesla also has its Shanghai factory closed down and re-opened last week with very limited production but the stock hasnt yet been badly hit by this.Hyundai in South Korea and Nissan in Japan also closed down as they couldnt source for parts in China. Madness in Wall Street fueled by particularly 4 tech stocks ie the MAGA names where M is for Microsoft,A for Apple,G for Google and A for Amazon.These four equities have over 1 trillion USD market cap and Trump stated that he will do anything to keep these 4 stocks rising and recommends investors buys them so the mania could continue for a while longer Contrarian Investor and Trader.Advocate of free markets,limited government interference in the economy and sound money
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Rank: Member Joined: 6/1/2017 Posts: 288
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slick wrote:mamilli wrote:slick wrote:FRM2011 wrote:The other day when fuelling, I had in the car my daughter and her two cousins all below 10.
I told them in future cars won't need to be fuelled but charged.
"You mean like tesla, we know that". How do you know ? I asked. "YouTube videos". Apparently every popular vlogger/youtuber has a Tesla and they regularly share videos about it.
That is the moment I realized the future belongs to EV, and Tesla is the undisputed king of the future.
Norway and Germany are leading Europe in EV adoption. The irony is not lost. Norway made her fortune selling oil and Germany is the manufacturing capital of internal combustion engines. Yes no doubt that Tesla EV cars are revolutionary and way ahead of competition but caveat is that Tesla most times sells its cars at a loss. Tesla made and delivered more cars in the second quarter of 2019 than it did in any other quarter in company history, but still lost $408 million, according to a new filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission. They suffered an even bigger $702 million loss posted in the first quarter of 2019.Most times they suffer from negative Free Cash Flow (FCF).Look at the appalling losses and meagre profits that the meteorite Tesla makes on selling cars vs the dinosaur other competitors per quarter.  They had been a loss making company for many years with only recently earning a profit largely from sale of EV credits. Since Tesla cars don't emit hydrocarbons,they have a massive EV credit that they sell to internal combustion car makers so that the latter can avoid even larger taxes for selling cars that emit hydrocarbons.Also they raise lots of their capital from issuing junk debt and interest rate on the US junk bond market is artificially suppressed (as is the rest of the entire US interest rate environment) by the Fed money printing to push rates down and supply cheap money to the economy thus keep zombie companies that cannot be solvent at higher normal interest rates alive.The US junk bond market-like the Mortgage Backed Securities (MBS) of the housing bubble of early 2000s has already started showing signs of distress hence the current massive Fed liquidity injections to prevent an implosion of the corporate bond market similar to collapse of MBS market in the 2008 financial crisis.Also,lots of Tesla bears short sellers believe Tesla's financials are cooked and could be a ponzi scheme like Enron and the long term prospects at least in terms of financials is dire and the company stock could collapse to zero.Billionaire major Tesla short like Jim Chanos on image above and other famous Tesla short sellers like Andrew Left believe the business model of Tesla isnt sustainable as per financials. One also shouldn't forget the controversial mercurial nature of Elon Musk calling an analyst "bonehead" during a conference call;misleading investors by pumping up the stock last year by tweeting the infamous "funding secured" whereby he was almost forced out as CEO and was compelled to pay a 20 million fine for the tweet.Also he openly smoked marijuana on a major podcast in what most investors felt was unbecoming of a CEO of a major US company.  It is this paradox of Tesla ie great prospects for EV innovation vs crappy possibly fraudulent financials that make it the most emotive stock in the US equity market with fanatical bulls and bears at each other's throats hence the wild price action swings.  It remains to see if Tesla unravels like Enron or becomes an icon to be revered in the future. Thus is Tesla a Prodigy or a Ponzi?The future will decide this Tesla is the quintessential "meme stock" Once it's on the move,don't kvetch,throw the fundamentals out the window,go out on a limb and ride the tide.Just don't be caught holding the bag when the music stops. Exactly @mamili.Fundamentals of Tesla doesnt justify the current price of the stock.Its just future expectations that they will revolutionalize the EV market plus Musk cut following.Well,the entire US stock market has thrown fundamentals out of the window.Generally earnings have stagnated or fallen in the last few years but stock prices have exploded in multiples to achieve the greatest overvaluations in history surpassing even the dotcom mania that ended in tears.So what's driving the mania.Simple Fed liquidity.The Fed is injecting tens of billions of new money into the financial system via the repurchase agreement market everyday thus stocks keep hitting intraday and/or closing at all time highs daily.The Fed's liquidity is even defying the fears of coronavirus which the market could be massively mispricing.With the world's second largest economy (some even say its the world's largest economy in GDP PPP terms) and the world's largest manufacturing hub in lockdown,global supply chains are in trouble and could get very ugly if the virus isnt contained.Once this dawns on wall street and many more US citizens get infected with the virus,the high frequency trading computer algos on Wall Street could trigger a panic selling. Irony is that some major factories are shutdown in China but US stocks still go up.Foxconn,a Apple manufacturing partner in China,has basically shutdown (only 10% of workforce resumed work last Monday)but Apple stock still hits all time highs almost daily.Tesla also has its Shanghai factory closed down and re-opened last week with very limited production but the stock hasnt yet been badly hit by this.Hyundai in South Korea and Nissan in Japan also closed down as they couldnt source for parts in China. Madness in Wall Street fueled by particularly 4 tech stocks ie the MAGA names where M is for Microsoft,A for Apple,G for Google and A for Amazon.These four equities have over 1 trillion USD market cap and Trump stated that he will do anything to keep these 4 stocks rising and recommends investors buys them so the mania could continue for a while longe Oh the Tesla hype but other car manufacturers are coming up and may give Tesla a run for its money No doubt Tesla will go down as one of the most fascinating stocks and firms in history.Fanatical stock with billionaires backing both the long and short side and the most shorted stock in the US stock market.Lets see if it collapses like Enron or becomes an icon like the once Ford Motors (when Ford was an icon decades ago and now its a bogus basketcase). Contrarian Investor and Trader.Advocate of free markets,limited government interference in the economy and sound money
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