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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/28/2015 Posts: 9,562 Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
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FRM2011 wrote:A lawyer friend was explaining to me that this court case is too much noise over nothing.
Apparently, the words "sex against the order of nature" would include oral sex as well.
Secondly, it's a crime almost impossible to prove in court. There was a judge who had ordered suspects to be medically examined to determine whether they had engaged in gay sex.
It's the same judge who had acquitted a guy who had defiled a 13-year old because, she seemed to have enjoyed the sex.
Both his outrageous rulings were overturned by the appeal court. So millions of BJ fans are guilty. 
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/28/2015 Posts: 9,562 Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
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Richard Quest to wed..... https://www.the-star.co....poses-to-his-gay-lover/
Quote:CNN Media personality Richard Quest is finally taken after he proposed to his gay lover. In an Instagram post yesterday, Quest revealed how pleased he was after his lover accepted his marriage proposal. Quest posted a photo of him with the love of his life and captioned; "I asked, and he said “yes” 
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,822 Location: Nairobi
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Angelica _ann wrote:masukuma wrote:How things change... While I started this thread and I don't agree with the guy who started it! I think you have answered me. I have read your contribution on this thread and they seem not to be in sync with what you advocate for nowadays. Things changed or your thinking changed!!! My thinking changed!! You know... if at 40 you think in exactly the same way you thought when you were 30 - YOU HAVE LOST 10 YEARS!! I don't mind seeing earlier versions of me as 'lacking' or 'ignorant' - it means I am growing. Consistency with ideas you had in the past (Cognitive Dissonance) is the worst trap I know... People end up doing this All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,822 Location: Nairobi
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FRM2011 wrote:A lawyer friend was explaining to me that this court case is too much noise over nothing.
Apparently, the words "sex against the order of nature" would include oral sex as well.
Secondly, it's a crime almost impossible to prove in court. There was a judge who had ordered suspects to be medically examined to determine whether they had engaged in gay sex.
It's the same judge who had acquitted a guy who had defiled a 13-year old because, she seemed to have enjoyed the sex.
Both his outrageous rulings were overturned by the appeal court. Order of Nature defined by who? There is a growing list of Animals that have been observed to engage in homoerotic activities - are they not "nature"? There are animals that change gender... are they not part of "nature"? Just because a foot is used to walk - that does not mean that it's the only thing that the foot can be used for. it can kick a ball... it can act as a weapon. Just because Hands can be used to hold on to things - that does not mean that - holding stuff is the only thing hands can be used for. it can be a weapon when it's swung as a blow. it can be used for sports. it can be used a communication tool when gesturing... Just because the head can be used to hold the brain to think does not mean that "thinking" is the only thing the head can do - it can head a ball... can be a weapon. Just because genitals can be used to make babies - that does not mean that making babies is the only thing they can and should do! All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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We haven't had adequate dialogue regarding nature, social order and homosexuality, and it seems that we might be arguing from ignorance most of the time.
For example, simulations that show animals changing sexual behavior to homosexuality tend to ignore the underlying conditions of social deprivation and competition. Conditions supporting homosexual behavior have tended to be the same for animals and humans alike.
Which brings us to a critical question: should we assume then that all conditions are valid and permissible to humans? Cursory thinking says, 'no'. We need to be very specific about the optimal conditions for humanity. That's why inequality is a big issue for example.
If we can define optimal conditions for humanity, and indeed for other animals under observation, will we still observe homosexual behavior? I haven't met such experiments/simulations so far, but human history tends to give 'no' as an answer.
Finally, current thought on homosexuality and sexuality in general, tends to downplay the role of reproduction. How valid is such an assumption? And if reproduction was accorded priority, would homosexuality be ethical? I doubt it.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,822 Location: Nairobi
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tycho wrote:We haven't had adequate dialogue regarding nature, social order and homosexuality, and it seems that we might be arguing from ignorance most of the time.
For example, simulations that show animals changing sexual behavior to homosexuality tend to ignore the underlying conditions of social deprivation and competition. Conditions supporting homosexual behavior have tended to be the same for animals and humans alike.
Which brings us to a critical question: should we assume then that all conditions are valid and permissible to humans? Cursory thinking says, 'no'. We need to be very specific about the optimal conditions for humanity. That's why inequality is a big issue for example.
If we can define optimal conditions for humanity, and indeed for other animals under observation, will we still observe homosexual behavior? I haven't met such experiments/simulations so far, but human history tends to give 'no' as an answer.
Finally, current thought on homosexuality and sexuality in general, tends to downplay the role of reproduction. How valid is such an assumption? And if reproduction was accorded priority, would homosexuality be ethical? I doubt it. People should just say it’s undesirable for them not invoke nature in saying it’s “unnatural”. Just say it’s undesirable and I personally don’t like it. Like incest or cannibalism - they are undesirable and unproductive behaviors when considering a certain end. All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/18/2011 Posts: 12,069 Location: Kianjokoma
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masukuma wrote:Angelica _ann wrote:masukuma wrote:How things change... While I started this thread and I don't agree with the guy who started it! I think you have answered me. I have read your contribution on this thread and they seem not to be in sync with what you advocate for nowadays. Things changed or your thinking changed!!! My thinking changed!! You know... if at 40 you think in exactly the same way you thought when you were 30 - YOU HAVE LOST 10 YEARS!! I don't mind seeing earlier versions of me as 'lacking' or 'ignorant' - it means I am growing] Or you're regressing...
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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masukuma wrote:tycho wrote:We haven't had adequate dialogue regarding nature, social order and homosexuality, and it seems that we might be arguing from ignorance most of the time.
For example, simulations that show animals changing sexual behavior to homosexuality tend to ignore the underlying conditions of social deprivation and competition. Conditions supporting homosexual behavior have tended to be the same for animals and humans alike.
Which brings us to a critical question: should we assume then that all conditions are valid and permissible to humans? Cursory thinking says, 'no'. We need to be very specific about the optimal conditions for humanity. That's why inequality is a big issue for example.
If we can define optimal conditions for humanity, and indeed for other animals under observation, will we still observe homosexual behavior? I haven't met such experiments/simulations so far, but human history tends to give 'no' as an answer.
Finally, current thought on homosexuality and sexuality in general, tends to downplay the role of reproduction. How valid is such an assumption? And if reproduction was accorded priority, would homosexuality be ethical? I doubt it. People should just say it’s undesirable for them not invoke nature in saying it’s “unnatural”. Just say it’s undesirable and I personally don’t like it. Like incest or cannibalism - they are undesirable and unproductive behaviors when considering a certain end. True.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,822 Location: Nairobi
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Lolest! wrote:masukuma wrote:Angelica _ann wrote:masukuma wrote:How things change... While I started this thread and I don't agree with the guy who started it! I think you have answered me. I have read your contribution on this thread and they seem not to be in sync with what you advocate for nowadays. Things changed or your thinking changed!!! My thinking changed!! You know... if at 40 you think in exactly the same way you thought when you were 30 - YOU HAVE LOST 10 YEARS!! I don't mind seeing earlier versions of me as 'lacking' or 'ignorant' - it means I am growing] Or you're regressing... Perhaps... but quite unlikely All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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There's neither 'progress' nor 'regression' in thinking or being. There's only game computation.
Like the present times tend to favor game computation that favors open homosexuality...
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/20/2008 Posts: 6,275 Location: Kenya
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We also (sent) Lut: He said to his people: “Do ye commit lewdness such as no people in creation (ever) committed before you? For ye practise your lusts on men in preference to women: ye are indeed a people transgressing beyond bounds.” Quran Surat al-Araf 7:80-82
The people of Lut rejected the messengers. Behold, their brother Lut said to them: “Will ye not fear (Allah)? I am to you a messenger worthy of all trust. So fear Allah and obey me. No reward do I ask of you for it: my reward is only from the lord of the Worlds. Of all the creatures in the world, will ye approach males, And leave those whom Allah has created for you to be your mates? Nay, ye are a people transgressing (all limits)!” QUran Surat ash-Shuara 26:160-168
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,822 Location: Nairobi
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AlphDoti wrote:We also (sent) Lut: He said to his people: “Do ye commit lewdness such as no people in creation (ever) committed before you? For ye practise your lusts on men in preference to women: ye are indeed a people transgressing beyond bounds.” Quran Surat al-Araf 7:80-82
The people of Lut rejected the messengers. Behold, their brother Lut said to them: “Will ye not fear (Allah)? I am to you a messenger worthy of all trust. So fear Allah and obey me. No reward do I ask of you for it: my reward is only from the lord of the Worlds. Of all the creatures in the world, will ye approach males, And leave those whom Allah has created for you to be your mates? Nay, ye are a people transgressing (all limits)!” QUran Surat ash-Shuara 26:160-168 No one really cares what your book says! After all even in those stories - God is the one who killed them not his henchmen. He used to take care of them “personally” these days people fear his henchmen more than God himself. All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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