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Africa red hot real estate leads world. Kenya #4
MugundaMan
#21 Posted : Sunday, October 28, 2018 9:06:18 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 1/8/2018
Posts: 2,211
Location: DC (Dustbowl County)
maka wrote:
Ummh you really are pushing this property agenda... Do you realise some people probably never ever want to own land or. a house....

@maka,
Of course. That is their right and nobody can take it away from them! smile
obiero
#22 Posted : Sunday, October 28, 2018 12:28:17 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 13,516
Location: nairobi
MugundaMan wrote:
maka wrote:
Ummh you really are pushing this property agenda... Do you realise some people probably never ever want to own land or. a house....

@maka,
Of course. That is their right and nobody can take it away from them! smile

But it's a sad choice.. Of what use would one be to his/her generations if they didn't at least provide one family house of whatever size

HF 90,000 ABP 3.83; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 23,800 ABP 6.45
sparkly
#23 Posted : Sunday, October 28, 2018 1:45:27 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 9/23/2009
Posts: 8,083
Location: Enk are Nyirobi
obiero wrote:
MugundaMan wrote:
maka wrote:
Ummh you really are pushing this property agenda... Do you realise some people probably never ever want to own land or. a house....

@maka,
Of course. That is their right and nobody can take it away from them! smile

But it's a sad choice.. Of what use would one be to his/her generations if they didn't at least provide one family house of whatever size


On another post you said KQ shares are perfect legacy d'oh!
Life is short. Live passionately.
obiero
#24 Posted : Sunday, October 28, 2018 7:06:12 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 13,516
Location: nairobi
sparkly wrote:
obiero wrote:
MugundaMan wrote:
maka wrote:
Ummh you really are pushing this property agenda... Do you realise some people probably never ever want to own land or. a house....

@maka,
Of course. That is their right and nobody can take it away from them! smile

But it's a sad choice.. Of what use would one be to his/her generations if they didn't at least provide one family house of whatever size


On another post you said KQ shares are perfect legacy d'oh!

Everyone here including you, knows that my portfolios in stocks is less than 10% of my overal net worth

HF 90,000 ABP 3.83; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 23,800 ABP 6.45
maka
#25 Posted : Monday, October 29, 2018 1:57:21 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
obiero wrote:
MugundaMan wrote:
maka wrote:
Ummh you really are pushing this property agenda... Do you realise some people probably never ever want to own land or. a house....

@maka,
Of course. That is their right and nobody can take it away from them! smile

But it's a sad choice.. Of what use would one be to his/her generations if they didn't at least provide one family house of whatever size


Let's say I have built up a portfolio of circa 10m in fixed income over the past 3-5 years... With an average return of 10pa net... Plus an average maturity period of 20 years... Comes to around 92k pm... Will it be wrong if I rent all through my life...

https://www.google.com/a...ans-to-buy-a-home-2016-9
possunt quia posse videntur
MugundaMan
#26 Posted : Monday, October 29, 2018 2:17:48 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 1/8/2018
Posts: 2,211
Location: DC (Dustbowl County)
maka wrote:

Let's say I have built up a portfolio of circa 10m in fixed income over the past 3-5 years... With an average return of 10pa net... Plus an average maturity period of 20 years... Comes to around 92k pm... Will it be wrong if I rent all through my life...

https://www.google.com/a...ns-to-buy-a-home-2016-9


@Maka,

As we said, that is your right and your choice! The beauty of Kenya is that we are a capitalist (pseudo-?) democracy! Kila mtu na stylo yage. Let's forget about returns and the financial aspects for a minute. From my personal perspective, the joys of homeownership are something that are worth pursuing as an end in itself. I remember the first home I ever bought way back in 2003. It was small, in bad shape and nothing fancy but had a very large garden in the back with nothing but bush! While other buyers overlooked it, I saw lots of potential, so I bought it cash. Some friends thought I was crazy.

The day I got the keys to the front door is a day I will never forget. Almost immediately I began the process of restoring it to livable condition. I was renting an apartment at the time and enjoyed driving to the house after work and on weekends and doing a lot of the work myself. I even cleared the bush in the back by hand!

Within a couple of months the house was in great shape. The lawns were green and well trimmed, the interior of the house was well painted with nice wood floors and a very cozy feel to it. Shortly after to completely escape rent forever, I moved in! At that point in time I was hooked on real estate!

I lived in that small house for many years and that sense of satisfaction in home ownership never faded a way for a single second. Especially after all that sweat equity/elbow grease I put into it. And it saved me a boatload of money (in not having to pay rent) that was beneficial in a crazy way in doing other things. In fact sometimes I regret ever disposing of it.

I long moved away from the city that house is in but it, and the heady memories I get from when I lived there will forever remain etched in my heart. I remember the days I would go park the car outside while it was under renovation, supervising the fundis as I would listen to music in my jalopy while reading books on real state investment. Meanwhile all my buddies were busy getting wasted dancing at the bars and clubs getting dead drunk and talking much of nothing while thinking I was a weirdo. They seemed unaware that time is life's most precious commodity and that youth does not last forever! Many years on, as far I know, they are still there stuck hapo hapo at those bars, lounges and clubs talking much of nothing and renting the same same types of apartments they were renting way back in 2003. Bottom line everyone has their passion, talent and investment style. Speaking for nobody but myself, nothing beats the joys of real estate as a way to rapidly build capital and enjoy yourself while at it!
sparkly
#27 Posted : Monday, October 29, 2018 9:11:50 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 9/23/2009
Posts: 8,083
Location: Enk are Nyirobi
MugundaMan wrote:
maka wrote:

Let's say I have built up a portfolio of circa 10m in fixed income over the past 3-5 years... With an average return of 10pa net... Plus an average maturity period of 20 years... Comes to around 92k pm... Will it be wrong if I rent all through my life...

https://www.google.com/a...ns-to-buy-a-home-2016-9


@Maka,

As we said, that is your right and your choice! The beauty of Kenya is that we are a capitalist (pseudo-?) democracy! Kila mtu na stylo yage. Let's forget about returns and the financial aspects for a minute. From my personal perspective, the joys of homeownership are something that are worth pursuing as an end in itself. I remember the first home I ever bought way back in 2003. It was small, in bad shape and nothing fancy but had a very large garden in the back with nothing but bush! While other buyers overlooked it, I saw lots of potential, so I bought it cash. Some friends thought I was crazy.

The day I got the keys to the front door is a day I will never forget. Almost immediately I began the process of restoring it to livable condition. I was renting an apartment at the time and enjoyed driving to the house after work and on weekends and doing a lot of the work myself. I even cleared the bush in the back by hand!

Within a couple of months the house was in great shape. The lawns were green and well trimmed, the interior of the house was well painted with nice wood floors and a very cozy feel to it. Shortly after to completely escape rent forever, I moved in! At that point in time I was hooked on real estate!

I lived in that small house for many years and that sense of satisfaction in home ownership never faded a way for a single second. Especially after all that sweat equity/elbow grease I put into it. And it saved me a boatload of money (in not having to pay rent) that was beneficial in a crazy way in doing other things. In fact sometimes I regret ever disposing of it.

I long moved away from the city that house is in but it, and the heady memories I get from when I lived there will forever remain etched in my heart. I remember the days I would go park the car outside while it was under renovation, supervising the fundis as I would listen to music in my jalopy while reading books on real state investment. Meanwhile all my buddies were busy getting wasted dancing at the bars and clubs getting dead drunk and talking much of nothing while thinking I was a weirdo. They seemed unaware that time is life's most precious commodity and that youth does not last forever! Many years on, as far I know, they are still there stuck hapo hapo at those bars, lounges and clubs talking much of nothing and renting the same same types of apartments they were renting way back in 2003. Bottom line everyone has their passion, talent and investment style. Speaking for nobody but myself, nothing beats the joys of real estate as a way to rapidly build capital and enjoy yourself while at it!


@Mugundaman, a good narrative and inspiring for homeowners.

Personally, I prefer to build a passive income stream first before venturing into home ownership.

Life is short. Live passionately.
XSK
#28 Posted : Monday, October 29, 2018 10:19:48 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 12/8/2009
Posts: 975
Location: Nairobi
sparkly wrote:
MugundaMan wrote:
maka wrote:

Let's say I have built up a portfolio of circa 10m in fixed income over the past 3-5 years... With an average return of 10pa net... Plus an average maturity period of 20 years... Comes to around 92k pm... Will it be wrong if I rent all through my life...

https://www.google.com/a...ns-to-buy-a-home-2016-9


@Maka,

As we said, that is your right and your choice! The beauty of Kenya is that we are a capitalist (pseudo-?) democracy! Kila mtu na stylo yage. Let's forget about returns and the financial aspects for a minute. From my personal perspective, the joys of homeownership are something that are worth pursuing as an end in itself. I remember the first home I ever bought way back in 2003. It was small, in bad shape and nothing fancy but had a very large garden in the back with nothing but bush! While other buyers overlooked it, I saw lots of potential, so I bought it cash. Some friends thought I was crazy.

The day I got the keys to the front door is a day I will never forget. Almost immediately I began the process of restoring it to livable condition. I was renting an apartment at the time and enjoyed driving to the house after work and on weekends and doing a lot of the work myself. I even cleared the bush in the back by hand!

Within a couple of months the house was in great shape. The lawns were green and well trimmed, the interior of the house was well painted with nice wood floors and a very cozy feel to it. Shortly after to completely escape rent forever, I moved in! At that point in time I was hooked on real estate!

I lived in that small house for many years and that sense of satisfaction in home ownership never faded a way for a single second. Especially after all that sweat equity/elbow grease I put into it. And it saved me a boatload of money (in not having to pay rent) that was beneficial in a crazy way in doing other things. In fact sometimes I regret ever disposing of it.

I long moved away from the city that house is in but it, and the heady memories I get from when I lived there will forever remain etched in my heart. I remember the days I would go park the car outside while it was under renovation, supervising the fundis as I would listen to music in my jalopy while reading books on real state investment. Meanwhile all my buddies were busy getting wasted dancing at the bars and clubs getting dead drunk and talking much of nothing while thinking I was a weirdo. They seemed unaware that time is life's most precious commodity and that youth does not last forever! Many years on, as far I know, they are still there stuck hapo hapo at those bars, lounges and clubs talking much of nothing and renting the same same types of apartments they were renting way back in 2003. Bottom line everyone has their passion, talent and investment style. Speaking for nobody but myself, nothing beats the joys of real estate as a way to rapidly build capital and enjoy yourself while at it!


@Mugundaman, a good narrative and inspiring for homeowners.

Personally, I prefer to build a passive income stream first before venturing into home ownership.



@Mugundaman that is quite an inspiration for the new generation!

@sparkly wouldnt real estate (i am thinking some flats/rentals) be considered passive income?
You will know that you have arrived when money and time are not mutually exclusive "events" in you life!
the deal
#29 Posted : Monday, October 29, 2018 10:37:11 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 9/25/2009
Posts: 4,534
Location: Windhoek/Nairobbery
@maka the problem with fixed income is inflation...
Chaka
#30 Posted : Monday, October 29, 2018 10:47:24 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 2/16/2007
Posts: 2,114
@maka,out of the 97k income how much would be going towards rent?And the interest payments will be at different months hence that income is average per month?
AndyC
#31 Posted : Monday, October 29, 2018 10:54:27 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 4/21/2015
Posts: 151
the deal wrote:
@maka the problem with fixed income is inflation...


Inflation is everyone's problem. If you have rentals you can adjust for inflation but there is the risk of having no income from empty houses and we have not got to late payments and evictions yet.
maka
#32 Posted : Monday, October 29, 2018 11:06:00 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
the deal wrote:
@maka the problem with fixed income is inflation...


You read the article I sent?... Rem the 10m is not static.... The guy is probably putting in cash monthly esp for long ended bonds.... Which in itself earns interest.... For kids...He does a trust fund for them gives each one the cash built over the years when they finish campus....

Out of the 97k...50k gets you a very good house at Graceland....
possunt quia posse videntur
hardwood
#33 Posted : Monday, October 29, 2018 11:14:27 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/28/2015
Posts: 9,562
Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
the deal wrote:
@maka the problem with fixed income is inflation...


Due to inflation, after 20yrs maka's 10m investment will be worth 5m in real terms while mugundaman's will be at 50m.
TNT
#34 Posted : Monday, October 29, 2018 11:32:32 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 5/22/2009
Posts: 206
You can own a house and sleep hungry. You can rent a home and be as liquid as f***. Cashflow and liquidity rules everything. Some guy in Kiserian owns one of the biggest hardwares in Kiserian and about 5 10-wheelers for transporting building materials to clients, but he doesn't own a home, he rents. Given he makes his rent in a day from his hardware business, that makes perfect financial sense to me.
popat
#35 Posted : Monday, October 29, 2018 2:04:13 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 12/2/2009
Posts: 299
Location: kenya
TNT wrote:
You can own a house and sleep hungry. You can rent a home and be as liquid as f***. Cashflow and liquidity rules everything. Some guy in Kiserian owns one of the biggest hardwares in Kiserian and about 5 10-wheelers for transporting building materials to clients, but he doesn't own a home, he rents. Given he makes his rent in a day from his hardware business, that makes perfect financial sense to me.

One can comfort themselves all is ok to run ones affairs without a home until such people die.It can be very nasty for the family left behind especially when they were not involved in the management of such a business.You may be surprised the house is the only asset they can cling to when the shit hits the fan.A house is an insurance.
TNT
#36 Posted : Monday, October 29, 2018 2:35:36 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 5/22/2009
Posts: 206
popat wrote:
TNT wrote:
You can own a house and sleep hungry. You can rent a home and be as liquid as f***. Cashflow and liquidity rules everything. Some guy in Kiserian owns one of the biggest hardwares in Kiserian and about 5 10-wheelers for transporting building materials to clients, but he doesn't own a home, he rents. Given he makes his rent in a day from his hardware business, that makes perfect financial sense to me.

One can comfort themselves all is ok to run ones affairs without a home until such people die.It can be very nasty for the family left behind especially when they were not involved in the management of such a business.You may be surprised the house is the only asset they can cling to when the shit hits the fan.A house is an insurance.



Being cash rich (liquid) trumps being property rich, especially when one dies. Go ask Njenga Karume's kids. Additionally, most of the people in Nairobi have acres of ancestral land in their rural areas, so I don't understand why such people should buy tiny pieces of plots in the middle of nowhere when they'll eventually move back to their rural areas.
ombaalbt
#37 Posted : Monday, October 29, 2018 2:48:15 PM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 5/19/2014
Posts: 68
Location: Migori
popat wrote:
TNT wrote:
You can own a house and sleep hungry. You can rent a home and be as liquid as f***. Cashflow and liquidity rules everything. Some guy in Kiserian owns one of the biggest hardwares in Kiserian and about 5 10-wheelers for transporting building materials to clients, but he doesn't own a home, he rents. Given he makes his rent in a day from his hardware business, that makes perfect financial sense to me.

One can comfort themselves all is ok to run ones affairs without a home until such people die.It can be very nasty for the family left behind especially when they were not involved in the management of such a business.You may be surprised the house is the only asset they can cling to when the shit hits the fan.A house is an insurance.


This only happens when you die intestate (like most kenyans do) Hiding your assets from your family and not doing a will. A well done will and good planning is all you need. For the folks who would like to be buried in their village a small two/three bedroom will suffice.
Learning to sit on my hands
sparkly
#38 Posted : Monday, October 29, 2018 3:15:16 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 9/23/2009
Posts: 8,083
Location: Enk are Nyirobi
popat wrote:
TNT wrote:
You can own a house and sleep hungry. You can rent a home and be as liquid as f***. Cashflow and liquidity rules everything. Some guy in Kiserian owns one of the biggest hardwares in Kiserian and about 5 10-wheelers for transporting building materials to clients, but he doesn't own a home, he rents. Given he makes his rent in a day from his hardware business, that makes perfect financial sense to me.

One can comfort themselves all is ok to run ones affairs without a home until such people die.It can be very nasty for the family left behind especially when they were not involved in the management of such a business.You may be surprised the house is the only asset they can cling to when the shit hits the fan.A house is an insurance.


Most Africans don't even sleep let alone live in their parents' houses once they reach adulthood.
Life is short. Live passionately.
Liv
#39 Posted : Monday, October 29, 2018 4:18:39 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 11/14/2006
Posts: 1,311
hardwood wrote:
the deal wrote:
@maka the problem with fixed income is inflation...


Due to inflation, after 20yrs maka's 10m investment will be worth 5m in real terms while mugundaman's will be at 50m.



I know a guy who had over 100 acres deep in kitengela... then he suddenly got sick and he needed urgent medical attention abroad.... He tried selling but he couldn't get buyers on time ....he almost died due to lack of cash....but friends eventually fundraised for him


You need a balanced portfolio.... You may have died before those 20 years without enough cash to cover some risks.
Chaka
#40 Posted : Monday, October 29, 2018 5:13:53 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 2/16/2007
Posts: 2,114
Liv wrote:

I know a guy who had over 100 acres deep in kitengela... then he suddenly got sick and he needed urgent medical attention abroad.... He tried selling but he couldn't get buyers on time ....he almost died due to lack of cash....but friends eventually fundraised for him


You need a balanced portfolio.... You may have died before those 20 years without enough cash to cover some risks.


What did the guy do with that land after recovery?
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