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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,519 Location: nairobi
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VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:Angelica _ann wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:KQ helping its shareholder KCB by narrowing provisions for bad debts: Down 37% from KShs. 958Mn to KShs. 600Mn. Not true. KCB converted a loan (probably secured) to (unsecured) equity. Not reverse, asking for a friend? It's as @vvs has stated but why he believes it would have no impact on provisions defeats logic Substance over Form. Yes, it probably reduced the provisions but not because there were recoveries or regularization of the loans. The Capital Ratios took a hit. "Equity" investments in entities like KQLC are not included in critical Capital Ratios calculations. If all the NPLs for any bank were converted to shares in (bankrupt) firms, would the bank become healthier? Of course not if the amount was significant but in this case it's not! KCB assets are fast approaching 1trillion!!!
HF 90,000 ABP 3.83; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 23,800 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Chief Joined: 5/31/2011 Posts: 5,121
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obiero wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:Angelica _ann wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:KQ helping its shareholder KCB by narrowing provisions for bad debts: Down 37% from KShs. 958Mn to KShs. 600Mn. Not true. KCB converted a loan (probably secured) to (unsecured) equity. Not reverse, asking for a friend? It's as @vvs has stated but why he believes it would have no impact on provisions defeats logic Substance over Form. Yes, it probably reduced the provisions but not because there were recoveries or regularization of the loans. The Capital Ratios took a hit. "Equity" investments in entities like KQLC are not included in critical Capital Ratios calculations. If all the NPLs for any bank were converted to shares in (bankrupt) firms, would the bank become healthier? Of course not if the amount was significant but in this case it's not! KCB assets are fast approaching 1trillion!!! Actually, KCB converted unsecured loan to a secured loan (secured partly by the KQ shares through KQLC and partly by government guarantee)
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Rank: Chief Joined: 5/31/2011 Posts: 5,121
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Cytonn has in the past week bought KCB shares. I welcome them back to simba https://cytonnreport.com/researc...-markets-review#equities
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/21/2010 Posts: 6,183 Location: nairobi
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we will sell at 100bob next year "Don't let the fear of losing be greater than the excitement of winning."
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/4/2009 Posts: 10,684 Location: NAIROBI
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I dont see anywhere mentioned that they have bought kcb shares. Nic bank is the one mentioned explicitly Wealth is built through a relatively simple equation
Wealth=Income + Investments - Lifestyle
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 8/30/2007 Posts: 1,558 Location: Nairobi
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Ericsson wrote:I dont see anywhere mentioned that they have bought kcb shares. Nic bank is the one mentioned explicitly They got in last week. Also purchased GCB
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Rank: Member Joined: 3/20/2008 Posts: 503
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Horton wrote:Ericsson wrote:I dont see anywhere mentioned that they have bought kcb shares. Nic bank is the one mentioned explicitly They got in last week. Also purchased GCB Eish. .how come they didn't call a press conference?? 
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 8/30/2007 Posts: 1,558 Location: Nairobi
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xxxxx wrote:Horton wrote:Ericsson wrote:I dont see anywhere mentioned that they have bought kcb shares. Nic bank is the one mentioned explicitly They got in last week. Also purchased GCB Eish. .how come they didn't call a press conference?? 🤣🤣 coz ithe investment was in Mirriions not in birrrions 😆
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/4/2009 Posts: 10,684 Location: NAIROBI
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Horton wrote:xxxxx wrote:Horton wrote:Ericsson wrote:I dont see anywhere mentioned that they have bought kcb shares. Nic bank is the one mentioned explicitly They got in last week. Also purchased GCB Eish. .how come they didn't call a press conference?? 🤣🤣 coz ithe investment was in Mirriions not in birrrions 😆 Acha tungoje tuone if it will reach 75 Bob for them to exit Wealth is built through a relatively simple equation
Wealth=Income + Investments - Lifestyle
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Rank: Member Joined: 3/20/2008 Posts: 503
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Ericsson wrote:Horton wrote:xxxxx wrote:Horton wrote:Ericsson wrote:I dont see anywhere mentioned that they have bought kcb shares. Nic bank is the one mentioned explicitly They got in last week. Also purchased GCB Eish. .how come they didn't call a press conference?? 🤣🤣 coz ithe investment was in Mirriions not in birrrions 😆 Acha tungoje tuone if it will reach 75 Bob for them to exit Urghh... This folly of day trading. They should have stayed invested. Did they think the value in kcb was exhausted????
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,519 Location: nairobi
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xxxxx wrote:Ericsson wrote:Horton wrote:xxxxx wrote:Horton wrote:Ericsson wrote:I dont see anywhere mentioned that they have bought kcb shares. Nic bank is the one mentioned explicitly They got in last week. Also purchased GCB Eish. .how come they didn't call a press conference?? 🤣🤣 coz ithe investment was in Mirriions not in birrrions 😆 Acha tungoje tuone if it will reach 75 Bob for them to exit Urghh... This folly of day trading. They should have stayed invested. Did they think the value in kcb was exhausted???? These people are a dangerous lot
HF 90,000 ABP 3.83; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 23,800 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Chief Joined: 1/3/2007 Posts: 18,103 Location: Nairobi
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mwekez@ji wrote:obiero wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:Angelica _ann wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:KQ helping its shareholder KCB by narrowing provisions for bad debts: Down 37% from KShs. 958Mn to KShs. 600Mn. Not true. KCB converted a loan (probably secured) to (unsecured) equity. Not reverse, asking for a friend? It's as @vvs has stated but why he believes it would have no impact on provisions defeats logic Substance over Form. Yes, it probably reduced the provisions but not because there were recoveries or regularization of the loans. The Capital Ratios took a hit. "Equity" investments in entities like KQLC are not included in critical Capital Ratios calculations. If all the NPLs for any bank were converted to shares in (bankrupt) firms, would the bank become healthier? Of course not if the amount was significant but in this case it's not! KCB assets are fast approaching 1trillion!!! Actually, KCB converted unsecured loan to a secured loan (secured partly by the KQ shares through KQLC and partly by government guarantee) Why would KCB have lent KQ UNSECURED funds? I can understand lending unsecured funds to strong firms with a good management, decent cashflow and strong parents like BAT, even EABL with its problems, among others but KQ has been losing billions since 2012. KCB should have had better insight into KQ than we do. Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 4/16/2014 Posts: 1,420 Location: Bohemian Grove
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VituVingiSana wrote:mwekez@ji wrote:obiero wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:Angelica _ann wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:KQ helping its shareholder KCB by narrowing provisions for bad debts: Down 37% from KShs. 958Mn to KShs. 600Mn. Not true. KCB converted a loan (probably secured) to (unsecured) equity. Not reverse, asking for a friend? It's as @vvs has stated but why he believes it would have no impact on provisions defeats logic Substance over Form. Yes, it probably reduced the provisions but not because there were recoveries or regularization of the loans. The Capital Ratios took a hit. "Equity" investments in entities like KQLC are not included in critical Capital Ratios calculations. If all the NPLs for any bank were converted to shares in (bankrupt) firms, would the bank become healthier? Of course not if the amount was significant but in this case it's not! KCB assets are fast approaching 1trillion!!! Actually, KCB converted unsecured loan to a secured loan (secured partly by the KQ shares through KQLC and partly by government guarantee) Why would KCB have lent KQ UNSECURED funds? I can understand lending unsecured funds to strong firms with a good management, decent cashflow and strong parents like BAT, even EABL with its problems, among others but KQ has been losing billions since 2012. KCB should have had better insight into KQ than we do. Most banks dont conduct due diligence when lending to "big companies" as it was the Case with Nakumatt.
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Rank: Member Joined: 5/2/2018 Posts: 267
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whiteowl wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:mwekez@ji wrote:obiero wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:Angelica _ann wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:KQ helping its shareholder KCB by narrowing provisions for bad debts: Down 37% from KShs. 958Mn to KShs. 600Mn. Not true. KCB converted a loan (probably secured) to (unsecured) equity. Not reverse, asking for a friend? It's as @vvs has stated but why he believes it would have no impact on provisions defeats logic Substance over Form. Yes, it probably reduced the provisions but not because there were recoveries or regularization of the loans. The Capital Ratios took a hit. "Equity" investments in entities like KQLC are not included in critical Capital Ratios calculations. If all the NPLs for any bank were converted to shares in (bankrupt) firms, would the bank become healthier? Of course not if the amount was significant but in this case it's not! KCB assets are fast approaching 1trillion!!! Actually, KCB converted unsecured loan to a secured loan (secured partly by the KQ shares through KQLC and partly by government guarantee) Why would KCB have lent KQ UNSECURED funds? I can understand lending unsecured funds to strong firms with a good management, decent cashflow and strong parents like BAT, even EABL with its problems, among others but KQ has been losing billions since 2012. KCB should have had better insight into KQ than we do. Most banks dont conduct due diligence when lending to "big companies" as it was the Case with Nakumatt. Plus the aspect of a common shareholder (The Treasury)...
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Rank: Chief Joined: 1/3/2007 Posts: 18,103 Location: Nairobi
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whiteowl wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:mwekez@ji wrote:obiero wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:Angelica _ann wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:KQ helping its shareholder KCB by narrowing provisions for bad debts: Down 37% from KShs. 958Mn to KShs. 600Mn. Not true. KCB converted a loan (probably secured) to (unsecured) equity. Not reverse, asking for a friend? It's as @vvs has stated but why he believes it would have no impact on provisions defeats logic Substance over Form. Yes, it probably reduced the provisions but not because there were recoveries or regularization of the loans. The Capital Ratios took a hit. "Equity" investments in entities like KQLC are not included in critical Capital Ratios calculations. If all the NPLs for any bank were converted to shares in (bankrupt) firms, would the bank become healthier? Of course not if the amount was significant but in this case it's not! KCB assets are fast approaching 1trillion!!! Actually, KCB converted unsecured loan to a secured loan (secured partly by the KQ shares through KQLC and partly by government guarantee) Why would KCB have lent KQ UNSECURED funds? I can understand lending unsecured funds to strong firms with a good management, decent cashflow and strong parents like BAT, even EABL with its problems, among others but KQ has been losing billions since 2012. KCB should have had better insight into KQ than we do. Most banks dont conduct due diligence when lending to "big companies" as it was the Case with Nakumatt. KQ has been in the crapper for years. Even if they do not do a complete DD, why not take collateral against it? KQ has "Pride Center" among other assets e.g. land... I do not have KCB shares but I suffered through Equity and I&M. It's interesting to note that the "foreign" banks eg BBK and SCBK weren't significantly affected. Could it be they do better DD? Or they could not be arm-twisted into lending to KQ? Or they were more sensible? Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
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Rank: Chief Joined: 1/3/2007 Posts: 18,103 Location: Nairobi
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Superprime1 wrote:whiteowl wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:mwekez@ji wrote:obiero wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:Angelica _ann wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:KQ helping its shareholder KCB by narrowing provisions for bad debts: Down 37% from KShs. 958Mn to KShs. 600Mn. Not true. KCB converted a loan (probably secured) to (unsecured) equity. Not reverse, asking for a friend? It's as @vvs has stated but why he believes it would have no impact on provisions defeats logic Substance over Form. Yes, it probably reduced the provisions but not because there were recoveries or regularization of the loans. The Capital Ratios took a hit. "Equity" investments in entities like KQLC are not included in critical Capital Ratios calculations. If all the NPLs for any bank were converted to shares in (bankrupt) firms, would the bank become healthier? Of course not if the amount was significant but in this case it's not! KCB assets are fast approaching 1trillion!!! Actually, KCB converted unsecured loan to a secured loan (secured partly by the KQ shares through KQLC and partly by government guarantee) Why would KCB have lent KQ UNSECURED funds? I can understand lending unsecured funds to strong firms with a good management, decent cashflow and strong parents like BAT, even EABL with its problems, among others but KQ has been losing billions since 2012. KCB should have had better insight into KQ than we do. Most banks dont conduct due diligence when lending to "big companies" as it was the Case with Nakumatt. Plus the aspect of a common shareholder (The Treasury)... That makes sense. KCB could have been arm-twisted into lending to KQ. Then what about Equity, I&M and other local banks? Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/4/2009 Posts: 10,684 Location: NAIROBI
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VituVingiSana wrote:Superprime1 wrote:whiteowl wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:mwekez@ji wrote:obiero wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:Angelica _ann wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:KQ helping its shareholder KCB by narrowing provisions for bad debts: Down 37% from KShs. 958Mn to KShs. 600Mn. Not true. KCB converted a loan (probably secured) to (unsecured) equity. Not reverse, asking for a friend? It's as @vvs has stated but why he believes it would have no impact on provisions defeats logic Substance over Form. Yes, it probably reduced the provisions but not because there were recoveries or regularization of the loans. The Capital Ratios took a hit. "Equity" investments in entities like KQLC are not included in critical Capital Ratios calculations. If all the NPLs for any bank were converted to shares in (bankrupt) firms, would the bank become healthier? Of course not if the amount was significant but in this case it's not! KCB assets are fast approaching 1trillion!!! Actually, KCB converted unsecured loan to a secured loan (secured partly by the KQ shares through KQLC and partly by government guarantee) Why would KCB have lent KQ UNSECURED funds? I can understand lending unsecured funds to strong firms with a good management, decent cashflow and strong parents like BAT, even EABL with its problems, among others but KQ has been losing billions since 2012. KCB should have had better insight into KQ than we do. Most banks dont conduct due diligence when lending to "big companies" as it was the Case with Nakumatt. Plus the aspect of a common shareholder (The Treasury)... That makes sense. KCB could have been arm-twisted into lending to KQ. Then what about Equity, I&M and other local banks? Equity and I&M were desperately looking for customers to lend money. Why is the interest rate at which kcb charged kq higher than that of Equity bank and I&M? Wealth is built through a relatively simple equation
Wealth=Income + Investments - Lifestyle
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,519 Location: nairobi
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Ericsson wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:Superprime1 wrote:whiteowl wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:mwekez@ji wrote:obiero wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:Angelica _ann wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:KQ helping its shareholder KCB by narrowing provisions for bad debts: Down 37% from KShs. 958Mn to KShs. 600Mn. Not true. KCB converted a loan (probably secured) to (unsecured) equity. Not reverse, asking for a friend? It's as @vvs has stated but why he believes it would have no impact on provisions defeats logic Substance over Form. Yes, it probably reduced the provisions but not because there were recoveries or regularization of the loans. The Capital Ratios took a hit. "Equity" investments in entities like KQLC are not included in critical Capital Ratios calculations. If all the NPLs for any bank were converted to shares in (bankrupt) firms, would the bank become healthier? Of course not if the amount was significant but in this case it's not! KCB assets are fast approaching 1trillion!!! Actually, KCB converted unsecured loan to a secured loan (secured partly by the KQ shares through KQLC and partly by government guarantee) Why would KCB have lent KQ UNSECURED funds? I can understand lending unsecured funds to strong firms with a good management, decent cashflow and strong parents like BAT, even EABL with its problems, among others but KQ has been losing billions since 2012. KCB should have had better insight into KQ than we do. Most banks dont conduct due diligence when lending to "big companies" as it was the Case with Nakumatt. Plus the aspect of a common shareholder (The Treasury)... That makes sense. KCB could have been arm-twisted into lending to KQ. Then what about Equity, I&M and other local banks? Equity and I&M were desperately looking for customers to lend money. Why is the interest rate at which kcb charged kq higher than that of Equity bank and I&M? You wont get a decent response from @vvs. He states that KCB should have taken the Pride Centre as collateral and then? In the event of default, the bank would sell off government co-owned property? Huyu @vvs hunishangaza. Its for the same reason that banks do not lend on collateral to Public Universities as well as Public Hospitals and almost all mainstream Churches.. You cannot sell these collateral easily without massive reputational damage
HF 90,000 ABP 3.83; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 23,800 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/4/2009 Posts: 10,684 Location: NAIROBI
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obiero wrote:Ericsson wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:Superprime1 wrote:whiteowl wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:mwekez@ji wrote:obiero wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:Angelica _ann wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:KQ helping its shareholder KCB by narrowing provisions for bad debts: Down 37% from KShs. 958Mn to KShs. 600Mn. Not true. KCB converted a loan (probably secured) to (unsecured) equity. Not reverse, asking for a friend? It's as @vvs has stated but why he believes it would have no impact on provisions defeats logic Substance over Form. Yes, it probably reduced the provisions but not because there were recoveries or regularization of the loans. The Capital Ratios took a hit. "Equity" investments in entities like KQLC are not included in critical Capital Ratios calculations. If all the NPLs for any bank were converted to shares in (bankrupt) firms, would the bank become healthier? Of course not if the amount was significant but in this case it's not! KCB assets are fast approaching 1trillion!!! Actually, KCB converted unsecured loan to a secured loan (secured partly by the KQ shares through KQLC and partly by government guarantee) Why would KCB have lent KQ UNSECURED funds? I can understand lending unsecured funds to strong firms with a good management, decent cashflow and strong parents like BAT, even EABL with its problems, among others but KQ has been losing billions since 2012. KCB should have had better insight into KQ than we do. Most banks dont conduct due diligence when lending to "big companies" as it was the Case with Nakumatt. Plus the aspect of a common shareholder (The Treasury)... That makes sense. KCB could have been arm-twisted into lending to KQ. Then what about Equity, I&M and other local banks? Equity and I&M were desperately looking for customers to lend money. Why is the interest rate at which kcb charged kq higher than that of Equity bank and I&M? You wont get a decent response from @vvs. He states that KCB should have taken the Pride Centre as collateral and then? In the event of default, the bank would sell off government co-owned property? Huyu @vvs hunishangaza. Its for the same reason that banks do not lend on collateral to Public Universities as well as Public Hospitals and almost all mainstream Churches.. You cannot sell these collateral easily without massive reputational damage Well spoken like ten elders. vvs take note of that Wealth is built through a relatively simple equation
Wealth=Income + Investments - Lifestyle
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Rank: Chief Joined: 1/3/2007 Posts: 18,103 Location: Nairobi
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Ericsson wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:Superprime1 wrote:whiteowl wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:mwekez@ji wrote:obiero wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:Angelica _ann wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:KQ helping its shareholder KCB by narrowing provisions for bad debts: Down 37% from KShs. 958Mn to KShs. 600Mn. Not true. KCB converted a loan (probably secured) to (unsecured) equity. Not reverse, asking for a friend? It's as @vvs has stated but why he believes it would have no impact on provisions defeats logic Substance over Form. Yes, it probably reduced the provisions but not because there were recoveries or regularization of the loans. The Capital Ratios took a hit. "Equity" investments in entities like KQLC are not included in critical Capital Ratios calculations. If all the NPLs for any bank were converted to shares in (bankrupt) firms, would the bank become healthier? Of course not if the amount was significant but in this case it's not! KCB assets are fast approaching 1trillion!!! Actually, KCB converted unsecured loan to a secured loan (secured partly by the KQ shares through KQLC and partly by government guarantee) Why would KCB have lent KQ UNSECURED funds? I can understand lending unsecured funds to strong firms with a good management, decent cashflow and strong parents like BAT, even EABL with its problems, among others but KQ has been losing billions since 2012. KCB should have had better insight into KQ than we do. Most banks dont conduct due diligence when lending to "big companies" as it was the Case with Nakumatt. Plus the aspect of a common shareholder (The Treasury)... That makes sense. KCB could have been arm-twisted into lending to KQ. Then what about Equity, I&M and other local banks? Equity and I&M were desperately looking for customers to lend money. Why is the interest rate at which kcb charged kq higher than that of Equity bank and I&M? I am a fan of JM and I do not understand the reason for giving KQ a loan if it was unsecured. From what I understand, Equity refused to accept the initial proposal from GoK/KQ for the Debt Conversion. Banks like I&M went "Yes, Massah" to the initial proposal. JM (who has skin in the game) tossed the initial proposal into the loo. That's why JM is who he is. What "reputation" damage would KCB (or any lender) face for selling off Pride Center? As a bank, it (among other banks) put customers' deposits at risk by lending to a bankrupt and corrupt organization. The former CFO should be in jail. His subordinates are in court for fleecing KQ. Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
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