Wazua
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KenolKobil 2018 and beyond
Rank: Elder Joined: 9/20/2015 Posts: 2,811 Location: Mombasa
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peep wrote:Ebenyo wrote:Realtreaty wrote:How does KK fair in Bitumen supply in construction industry? How much revenue emanates from this type of business given the govt want to buy locally as we as well know KK is majority locally owned.
Far more how is the gas industry in this company with K-gas growing too fast. What can they do to endear Kenyans buy gas from them. I remember Total went far to other company staff cooperatives to encourage them buy on Coop loan.
Again i feel KK should as well think of a Bonus this time 1/10.
No need for bonus as that will dilute the company value. The current NAV is ksh 7.40 per share against the current price of 16. If you create more shares further in the name of bonus,that will be lowering the value further. A bonus can't lower the value of a stock. Its a transfer of money from retained earnings to issued stock, both owned by the same person. Like moving cash from the left pocket to the right one. @Ebenyo is right to contend that the value of the company is greatly affected by bonus shares. Bonus shares reduce funds that can be applied for expansionary programs. John 5:17 But Jesus replied, “My Father is always working, and so am I.”
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/4/2009 Posts: 10,684 Location: NAIROBI
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Spikes wrote:peep wrote:Ebenyo wrote:Realtreaty wrote:How does KK fair in Bitumen supply in construction industry? How much revenue emanates from this type of business given the govt want to buy locally as we as well know KK is majority locally owned.
Far more how is the gas industry in this company with K-gas growing too fast. What can they do to endear Kenyans buy gas from them. I remember Total went far to other company staff cooperatives to encourage them buy on Coop loan.
Again i feel KK should as well think of a Bonus this time 1/10.
No need for bonus as that will dilute the company value. The current NAV is ksh 7.40 per share against the current price of 16. If you create more shares further in the name of bonus,that will be lowering the value further. A bonus can't lower the value of a stock. Its a transfer of money from retained earnings to issued stock, both owned by the same person. Like moving cash from the left pocket to the right one. @Ebenyo is right to contend that the value of the company is greatly affected by bonus shares. Bonus shares reduce funds that can be applied for expansionary programs. Bonus shares do not reduce funds that can be applied for expansionary programs.Some companies give bonus shares instead of dividends so that they can use the cash money meant for dividend for expansion Wealth is built through a relatively simple equation
Wealth=Income + Investments - Lifestyle
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 4/4/2016 Posts: 1,997 Location: Kitale
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peep wrote:Ebenyo wrote:Realtreaty wrote:How does KK fair in Bitumen supply in construction industry? How much revenue emanates from this type of business given the govt want to buy locally as we as well know KK is majority locally owned.
Far more how is the gas industry in this company with K-gas growing too fast. What can they do to endear Kenyans buy gas from them. I remember Total went far to other company staff cooperatives to encourage them buy on Coop loan.
Again i feel KK should as well think of a Bonus this time 1/10.
No need for bonus as that will dilute the company value. The current NAV is ksh 7.40 per share against the current price of 16. If you create more shares further in the name of bonus,that will be lowering the value further. A bonus can't lower the value of a stock. Its a transfer of money from retained earnings to issued stock, both owned by the same person. Like moving cash from the left pocket to the right one. It will lower the NAV per share.From the current of 7.40 to 6.70.Against the current price of 16.80,KK will be some of the most expensive shares in NSE. Towards the goal of financial freedom
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 4/4/2016 Posts: 1,997 Location: Kitale
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peep wrote:Ebenyo wrote:Realtreaty wrote:How does KK fair in Bitumen supply in construction industry? How much revenue emanates from this type of business given the govt want to buy locally as we as well know KK is majority locally owned.
Far more how is the gas industry in this company with K-gas growing too fast. What can they do to endear Kenyans buy gas from them. I remember Total went far to other company staff cooperatives to encourage them buy on Coop loan.
Again i feel KK should as well think of a Bonus this time 1/10.
No need for bonus as that will dilute the company value. The current NAV is ksh 7.40 per share against the current price of 16. If you create more shares further in the name of bonus,that will be lowering the value further. A bonus can't lower the value of a stock. Its a transfer of money from retained earnings to issued stock, both owned by the same person. Like moving cash from the left pocket to the right one. It will lower the NAV per share.From the current of 7.40 to 6.70.Against the current price of 16.80,KK will be some of the most expensive shares in NSE. Towards the goal of financial freedom
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 4/4/2016 Posts: 1,997 Location: Kitale
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peep wrote:Ebenyo wrote:Realtreaty wrote:How does KK fair in Bitumen supply in construction industry? How much revenue emanates from this type of business given the govt want to buy locally as we as well know KK is majority locally owned.
Far more how is the gas industry in this company with K-gas growing too fast. What can they do to endear Kenyans buy gas from them. I remember Total went far to other company staff cooperatives to encourage them buy on Coop loan.
Again i feel KK should as well think of a Bonus this time 1/10.
No need for bonus as that will dilute the company value. The current NAV is ksh 7.40 per share against the current price of 16. If you create more shares further in the name of bonus,that will be lowering the value further. A bonus can't lower the value of a stock. Its a transfer of money from retained earnings to issued stock, both owned by the same person. Like moving cash from the left pocket to the right one. It will lower the NAV per share.From the current of 7.40 to 6.70.Against the current price of 16.80,KK will be some of the most expensive shares in NSE. Towards the goal of financial freedom
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Rank: Chief Joined: 1/3/2007 Posts: 18,103 Location: Nairobi
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Ebenyo wrote:peep wrote:Ebenyo wrote:Realtreaty wrote:How does KK fair in Bitumen supply in construction industry? How much revenue emanates from this type of business given the govt want to buy locally as we as well know KK is majority locally owned.
Far more how is the gas industry in this company with K-gas growing too fast. What can they do to endear Kenyans buy gas from them. I remember Total went far to other company staff cooperatives to encourage them buy on Coop loan.
Again i feel KK should as well think of a Bonus this time 1/10.
No need for bonus as that will dilute the company value. The current NAV is ksh 7.40 per share against the current price of 16. If you create more shares further in the name of bonus,that will be lowering the value further. A bonus can't lower the value of a stock. Its a transfer of money from retained earnings to issued stock, both owned by the same person. Like moving cash from the left pocket to the right one. It will lower the NAV per share.From the current of 7.40 to 6.70.Against the current price of 16.80,KK will be some of the most expensive shares in NSE. NAV is a core concept in fundamental investing BUT not the only concept nor the most important one. 1) KK has many properties/assets stated at historical cost AND read the Financial Statements to understand that point. It would be helpful to have a revaluation done and put in the Notes even if the "revaluation" isn't included in the Balance Sheet. 2) Read Warren Buffett's letters. Cash generation [& moat] are important. Can KK keep on selling fuel at a (profitable) decent margin? Can it continue to leverage its network and connections [OTS] to reduce costs? And increase volumes? 3) A bonus does not increase/decrease a firm's INTRINSIC value BUT it does affect "perception" by investors. 4) A bonus does not reduce/increase the availability of funds for expansion. What @ericsson said is that when a firm doesn't want to pay a CASH dividend, it may issue a bonus. It's a sleight of hand to keep noisy shareholders happy. For KK: - Solid (profitable) cash generating machine. - Undervalued assets [needs a revaluation] as shown on the books. - Growth [not double digits but a respectable growth] in volumes/profits. - KK shares, IMHO, are cheap if it can make 2.50 in 2018 [FY 2017 has all sorts of one-off provisions]. That's a PER of 7 - Finally, there's been an expectation of a takeover. At a significant premium, I hope. Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 4/4/2016 Posts: 1,997 Location: Kitale
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VituVingiSana wrote:Ebenyo wrote:peep wrote:Ebenyo wrote:Realtreaty wrote:How does KK fair in Bitumen supply in construction industry? How much revenue emanates from this type of business given the govt want to buy locally as we as well know KK is majority locally owned.
Far more how is the gas industry in this company with K-gas growing too fast. What can they do to endear Kenyans buy gas from them. I remember Total went far to other company staff cooperatives to encourage them buy on Coop loan.
Again i feel KK should as well think of a Bonus this time 1/10.
No need for bonus as that will dilute the company value. The current NAV is ksh 7.40 per share against the current price of 16. If you create more shares further in the name of bonus,that will be lowering the value further. A bonus can't lower the value of a stock. Its a transfer of money from retained earnings to issued stock, both owned by the same person. Like moving cash from the left pocket to the right one. It will lower the NAV per share.From the current of 7.40 to 6.70.Against the current price of 16.80,KK will be some of the most expensive shares in NSE. NAV is a core concept in fundamental investing BUT not the only concept nor the most important one. 1) KK has many properties/assets stated at historical cost AND read the Financial Statements to understand that point. It would be helpful to have a revaluation done and put in the Notes even if the "revaluation" isn't included in the Balance Sheet. 2) Read Warren Buffett's letters. Cash generation [& moat] are important. Can KK keep on selling fuel at a (profitable) decent margin? Can it continue to leverage its network and connections [OTS] to reduce costs? And increase volumes? 3) A bonus does not increase/decrease a firm's INTRINSIC value BUT it does affect "perception" by investors. 4) A bonus does not reduce/increase the availability of funds for expansion. What @ericsson said is that when a firm doesn't want to pay a CASH dividend, it may issue a bonus. It's a sleight of hand to keep noisy shareholders happy. For KK: - Solid (profitable) cash generating machine. - Undervalued assets [needs a revaluation] as shown on the books. - Growth [not double digits but a respectable growth] in volumes/profits. - KK shares, IMHO, are cheap if it can make 2.50 in 2018 [FY 2017 has all sorts of one-off provisions]. That's a PER of 7 - Finally, there's been an expectation of a takeover. At a significant premium, I hope. Thanks for extensive explanation. Carbacid has been doing revaluation in their reports.I have been uncomfortable with it, but your explanation has now made me see a point. I got the importance of NAV recently when seabord put a bid for unga. I decided to look at the NAV of all the counters in my portfolio.I was shocked to find 70% are over valued while 30% are undervalued by the market. Im now very careful with my buying as my aim is to beat both the market and NAV. I entered KK last year after i became uncomfortable with ownership structure of Total. Your explanation means the current balance sheet does not reflect the true NAV of KK.I may agree with you as CMA recently ordered for an independent valuation of UNGA despite the available financial reports.Lets hope the report will be made public as to the true value of UNGA. For long term investors,NAV is what you get when the company crumble.I like a company that grows it Y.O.Y. KCB grew its sharehoders funds by 10% and i like that. I like to pass to my children and grand children great companies that will take care of them when im long gone. Towards the goal of financial freedom
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Rank: Chief Joined: 1/3/2007 Posts: 18,103 Location: Nairobi
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@Ebenyo - When a company crumbles, the NAV is whittled away as the rot comes out. Look at KQ's NAV from 2011 to 2017. Uchumi, ARM, etc... Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 4/4/2016 Posts: 1,997 Location: Kitale
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What was wrong with wazua? Two days without access. Towards the goal of financial freedom
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/4/2009 Posts: 10,684 Location: NAIROBI
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Ebenyo wrote:What was wrong with wazua? Two days without access. Hawakutaka posts mingi Wealth is built through a relatively simple equation
Wealth=Income + Investments - Lifestyle
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 4/4/2016 Posts: 1,997 Location: Kitale
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Ericsson wrote:Ebenyo wrote:What was wrong with wazua? Two days without access. Hawakutaka posts mingi  mali inatafutwa kwa bidii. Towards the goal of financial freedom
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Rank: Elder Joined: 8/16/2011 Posts: 2,297
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/11/2010 Posts: 5,040
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VituVingiSana wrote:Aguytrying wrote:Kk is doing well. I only wish they could attract customers like total and shell do, I find their stations except a few unattractive. However financial performance, management is top notch.
Remember we are back to takeover price range. With Ohana at the helm were in safe hands As a KK shareholder and customer... I admit, KK have the UGLIEST stations out of the Big 3.  Total and Shell have stations that are bright, attractive, warm... Glad I'm not the only one to notice this! Exactly my point The investor's chief problem - and even his worst enemy - is likely to be himself
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Rank: Chief Joined: 1/3/2007 Posts: 18,103 Location: Nairobi
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Aguytrying wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:Aguytrying wrote:Kk is doing well. I only wish they could attract customers like total and shell do, I find their stations except a few unattractive. However financial performance, management is top notch.
Remember we are back to takeover price range. With Ohana at the helm were in safe hands As a KK shareholder and customer... I admit, KK have the UGLIEST stations out of the Big 3. Total and Shell have stations that are bright, attractive, warm... Glad I'm not the only one to notice this! Exactly my point Let's call a spade a spade! Someone told be the "blue & red" is also unappealing. I am OK with the colors but the stations need to be spruced up. Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 4/4/2016 Posts: 1,997 Location: Kitale
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VituVingiSana wrote:@Ebenyo - When a company crumbles, the NAV is whittled away as the rot comes out.
Look at KQ's NAV from 2011 to 2017.
Uchumi, ARM, etc... That emphasise the importance of good and credible management. Its bad management that will bring out the rot while good management will just bring out the good. Towards the goal of financial freedom
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 8/10/2014 Posts: 969 Location: Kenya
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Aguytrying wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:Aguytrying wrote:Kk is doing well. I only wish they could attract customers like total and shell do, I find their stations except a few unattractive. However financial performance, management is top notch.
Remember we are back to takeover price range. With Ohana at the helm were in safe hands As a KK shareholder and customer... I admit, KK have the UGLIEST stations out of the Big 3. Total and Shell have stations that are bright, attractive, warm... Glad I'm not the only one to notice this! Exactly my point I FULLY AGREE....This always pops up in my mind EVERY time i pass their stations...they need some serious renovations ASAP!!! Total and Shell always have customers lined up in their stations while KK are mostly empty.
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Rank: Member Joined: 2/8/2007 Posts: 808
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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Kausha wrote:http://www.kenolkobil.com/uploads/1/3/3/9/13398397/kenolkobil_audited_group_results_2017.pdf Asante - Results almost flat Volume growth - 42% PBT 3.68Bn against 3.53Bn Fin div - 30cents total div 60cents in the year. "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/4/2009 Posts: 10,684 Location: NAIROBI
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They have done well Wealth is built through a relatively simple equation
Wealth=Income + Investments - Lifestyle
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Rank: Elder Joined: 8/16/2011 Posts: 2,297
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Decent results. This shows the capacity to grow Very soon this stock will break the under 20 like Total. From Loss making to excellent profits Next FY 18 it may yield 75 Cents (30 cents interim and 45 cents final) 
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