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Swearing with the Bible/holy book
Rank: Elder Joined: 6/20/2008 Posts: 6,275 Location: Kenya
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Mukiri wrote:washiku wrote:AlphDoti wrote:I will assume that "holy book" in your subject is the Quran.
First of all we are ordered not to do something haram/forbidden... For example those who are believers, God Almighty tells not to lie. He tells us not steal... he tells us not to kill yourself. He enjoins us many, many good things we can do and prohibits us a few evil things... So he prohibits us not to lie...
Holy books tell us "Do not ear false witness".
Now someone who is to testify is required to tell the truth. So in a moment of truth he says wallahi I speak the truth and only truth. He swears to prevent himself from doing something. It gives him incentive.
So if he breaks this vow, God Almighty will judge him... He will have earned himself a sin.
I hope this answers your question. No you have not answered. If it has earned you a sin, all you need to do after that is to repent, right? Ofcourse you can repent and be forgiven but you still bear the repercussions of your actions. Many many examples of great men of God who sinned and suffered for it, inspite of their forgiveness. I'll give you a simple example... If you choose to commit adultery with a HIV positive woman and get the disease, seek forgiveness; you will be forgiven but will suffer the affliction. Wages of sin is death ( Not necessarily loss of life, but death of so many other things e.g. finances, peace etc). So many people are walking dead What language are you talking about? Wallahi this is not English, this is gibberish even a nursery school child cannot understand!
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Rank: Chief Joined: 5/9/2007 Posts: 13,095
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AlphDoti wrote:A little details...
Whether repentance is grated or not depends on two ways:
1. If the false witness DID NOT cause any harm, or it did but you can fix it with the concerned person and all goes well and good, then you do not have to go back to the court and announce that. You can conceal that which God has concealed. He will forgive you.
2. Otherwise, if harm was caused to the aggrieved party, then your repentance is not accepted from God UNTIL you restore what is rightfully belongs to the aggrieved party.
So for the later case, you have to go to the court, tell them that you lied, and suffer the consequences of court. The judge or kadhi has the right to impose whatever lawful punishment he sees fit for the one who bear false witness. After this, then Almighty God now accepts the repentance and you are now free from the sin. On the same breath the corrupt govt officials who steal after swearing in with the Bible/Qoran can only be forgiven after returning our money and miraculously resurrecting all those who die as a result of lack of treatment due to the money they stole. Technically meaning they can never ever be forgiven....  But again the Bible says there is no sin too big for God to forgive. 
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/20/2008 Posts: 6,275 Location: Kenya
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washiku wrote:AlphDoti wrote:A little details...
Whether repentance is grated or not depends on two ways:
1. If the false witness DID NOT cause any harm, or it did but you can fix it with the concerned person and all goes well and good, then you do not have to go back to the court and announce that. You can conceal that which God has concealed. He will forgive you.
2. Otherwise, if harm was caused to the aggrieved party, then your repentance is not accepted from God UNTIL you restore what is rightfully belongs to the aggrieved party.
So for the later case, you have to go to the court, tell them that you lied, and suffer the consequences of court. The judge or kadhi has the right to impose whatever lawful punishment he sees fit for the one who bear false witness. After this, then Almighty God now accepts the repentance and you are now free from the sin. On the same breath the corrupt govt officials who steal after swearing in with the Bible/Qoran can only be forgiven after returning our money and miraculously resurrecting all those who die as a result of lack of treatment due to the money they stole. Technically meaning they can never ever be forgiven.... But again the Bible says there is no sin too big for God to forgive. @washiku, that is a very good question indeed. I'm happy you are asking me about it. First, from your example, a corrupt politician who stole public money meant for treatment, resulting in deaths. They cannot resurrect the dead. The harm which was caused to the people, they cannot restore. What was rightfully belongs to them they cannot restore to those who are now dead. However, these politicians have to confess their theft, taken to the court, and suffer the consequences of court. The judge or kadhi has the right to impose whatever lawful punishment he sees fit for the corrupt officials. After this, then Almighty God now accepts their repentance and they are now free from the sin. They will not be punished for death of the people. I hope this answers the question? So yes, there is no sin too big for God to forgive. But you must genuine repent to God. A believer should live a life of continuing process of recognizing our shortfalls, we are human, and we are not perfect, and we should seek forgiveness of God from our failures on an ongoing basis. God forgives any sin if you repent genuinely!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,823 Location: Nairobi
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AlphDoti wrote:washiku wrote:AlphDoti wrote:A little details...
Whether repentance is grated or not depends on two ways:
1. If the false witness DID NOT cause any harm, or it did but you can fix it with the concerned person and all goes well and good, then you do not have to go back to the court and announce that. You can conceal that which God has concealed. He will forgive you.
2. Otherwise, if harm was caused to the aggrieved party, then your repentance is not accepted from God UNTIL you restore what is rightfully belongs to the aggrieved party.
So for the later case, you have to go to the court, tell them that you lied, and suffer the consequences of court. The judge or kadhi has the right to impose whatever lawful punishment he sees fit for the one who bear false witness. After this, then Almighty God now accepts the repentance and you are now free from the sin. On the same breath the corrupt govt officials who steal after swearing in with the Bible/Qoran can only be forgiven after returning our money and miraculously resurrecting all those who die as a result of lack of treatment due to the money they stole. Technically meaning they can never ever be forgiven.... But again the Bible says there is no sin too big for God to forgive. @washiku, that is a very good question indeed. I'm happy you are asking me about it. First, a corrupt politician who stole public money for treatment for example, resulting in deaths, cannot resurrect the dead. The harm which was caused to the people, they cannot restore what was rightfully belongs to them. However, these politicians have to confess their theft, taken to the court, and suffer the consequences of court. The judge or kadhi has the right to impose whatever lawful punishment he sees fit for the corrupt officials. After this, then Almighty God now accepts their repentance and they are now free from the sin. They will not be punished for death of the people. I hope this answers the question? So yes, there is no sin too big for God to forgive. But you must genuine repent to God. A believer should live a life of continuing process of recognizing our shortfalls, we are human, and we are not perfect, and we should seek forgiveness of God from our failures on an ongoing basis. God forgives any sin if you repent genuinely! What if the Politician is a Christian or a Hindu or a Buddhist? Should they follow the same procedure to repent? All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/20/2008 Posts: 6,275 Location: Kenya
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masukuma wrote:AlphDoti wrote:washiku wrote:AlphDoti wrote:A little details...
Whether repentance is grated or not depends on two ways:
1. If the false witness DID NOT cause any harm, or it did but you can fix it with the concerned person and all goes well and good, then you do not have to go back to the court and announce that. You can conceal that which God has concealed. He will forgive you.
2. Otherwise, if harm was caused to the aggrieved party, then your repentance is not accepted from God UNTIL you restore what is rightfully belongs to the aggrieved party.
So for the later case, you have to go to the court, tell them that you lied, and suffer the consequences of court. The judge or kadhi has the right to impose whatever lawful punishment he sees fit for the one who bear false witness. After this, then Almighty God now accepts the repentance and you are now free from the sin. On the same breath the corrupt govt officials who steal after swearing in with the Bible/Qoran can only be forgiven after returning our money and miraculously resurrecting all those who die as a result of lack of treatment due to the money they stole. Technically meaning they can never ever be forgiven.... But again the Bible says there is no sin too big for God to forgive. @washiku, that is a very good question indeed. I'm happy you are asking me about it. First, a corrupt politician who stole public money for treatment for example, resulting in deaths, cannot resurrect the dead. The harm which was caused to the people, they cannot restore what was rightfully belongs to them. However, these politicians have to confess their theft, taken to the court, and suffer the consequences of court. The judge or kadhi has the right to impose whatever lawful punishment he sees fit for the corrupt officials. After this, then Almighty God now accepts their repentance and they are now free from the sin. They will not be punished for death of the people. I hope this answers the question? So yes, there is no sin too big for God to forgive. But you must genuine repent to God. A believer should live a life of continuing process of recognizing our shortfalls, we are human, and we are not perfect, and we should seek forgiveness of God from our failures on an ongoing basis. God forgives any sin if you repent genuinely! What if the Politician is a Christian or a Hindu or a Buddhist? Should they follow the same procedure to repent? @mavegs, as far as stealing public money meant for treatment is concerned, yes similarly if it is a Christian politician or a Hindu politician or a Buddhist politician, first he must acknowledge/confess stealing the money, he may be taken to court and charged, then he must pray to Almighty God to guide him to what is correct and ask God to forgive him. After that, God will forgive him this particular sin... I hope the above part is clear....
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/20/2008 Posts: 6,275 Location: Kenya
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Continuation of the above... (to avoid making it long)  However, as a Christian the politician is still guilty of worshiping three gods, the Hindu hundreds gods, and Budhists have various idols as their gods... When they die, they will not have peace unless they turn to the right path before death finds them. As for leaders or politicians, if they become a Muslim they will be safe and God will double their reward, but if they reject this invitation of Islam they will bear the sin of having misguided their subjects.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 11/17/2009 Posts: 1,049
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AlphDoti wrote:Continuation of the above... (to avoid making it long) However, as a Christian the politician is still guilty of worshiping three gods, the Hindu hundreds gods, and Budhists have various idols as their gods... When they die, they will not have peace unless they turn to the right path before death finds them. As for leaders or politicians, if they become a Muslim they will be safe and God will double their reward, but if they reject this invitation of Islam they will bear the sin of having misguided their subjects. Therefore in other words: As long as you are not Muslim you are already 'condemned' So it doesn't matter whether or not you lie deliberately while holding your 'holy' book. Just as absolute power corrupts leaders, so does absolute fanaticism blind the people from logic
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/20/2008 Posts: 6,275 Location: Kenya
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Nandwa wrote:AlphDoti wrote:Continuation of the above... (to avoid making it long) However, as a Christian the politician is still guilty of worshiping three gods, the Hindu hundreds gods, and Budhists have various idols as their gods... When they die, they will not have peace unless they turn to the right path before death finds them. As for leaders or politicians, if they become a Muslim they will be safe and God will double their reward, but if they reject this invitation of Islam they will bear the sin of having misguided their subjects. Therefore in other words: As long as you are not Muslim you are already 'condemned' So it doesn't matter whether or not you lie deliberately while holding your 'holy' book. @nandwa, you must have missed my response Posted Thursday, March 08, 2018 9:47:57 AM. I said as far as stealing public money meant for treatment is concerned, whether a Christian politician or a Hindu politician or a Buddhist politician, first he must acknowledge/confess stealing the money, he may be taken to court and charged, then he must pray to Almighty God to guide him to what is correct and ask God to forgive him. After that, God will forgive him this particular sin... As for your other question, the Christian politician, the Hindu politician, the Buddhist still is guilty of the sin of disbelieve, i.e. associating partners with Almighty God. No religion came with trinity. Trinity, worshiping many gods or idols was not taught by no prophet of God. Every prophet's religion was Islam i.e. submission to one God. I hope this answers your question.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,823 Location: Nairobi
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So as long as you are a politician who is a Christian, Hindu or follower any of the 3500 plus religions that are not muslim... don't bother... your repentance is null and void. All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/20/2008 Posts: 6,275 Location: Kenya
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masukuma wrote:So as long as you are a politician who is a Christian, Hindu or follower any of the 3500 plus religions that are not muslim... don't bother... your repentance is null and void. Repentance is acceptable from anybody. After that obedience and submission to Almighty God. Comprehensive answer here
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