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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,823 Location: Nairobi
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let's face it... no one is fixing this place unless we do! we wish someone would... but it doesn't look likely. lets do a thought experiment... ASSUME FOR 2 MINS - God is not there. Just ASSUME no one ever told you about God for 2 mins. Look at the world outside. The hunger, the crime, the injustice. When stuff is stolen from us we 'know' there is a greater plan, the all seeing Eye that is God has recorded this action and someday the thief will pay for it. Assume that once it has been stolen there is no plan (you are still within your 2 mins). Ask yourself - then what? Look at a kid dying out of hunger in Turkana - what if this was IT for them? 'that's all folks!' - gone!! what of the person wrongfully incarcerated? if there is no one listening to his genuine prayers in seeking justice - what is to happen to him? that he is calling out to an inexistent person for justice and unless chaos brings it to him - he will die in jail of a crime he didn't commit. Ask yourself, If we are all living in a universe of chaos... then what is to happen to these people? if we are living in chaos and hitler got away scot-free... that there is no judgement and torment for him - then what? Some of the most passionate people i know for either the environment, peace, humanity, justice are actually atheists and it was conflicting... I asked myself why and realized... they have not delegated the responsibility of making things right to God but rather have decided to give a shit more and actually move to ending this damage! End of your 2 mins All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Member Joined: 12/17/2011 Posts: 887
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masukuma wrote:let's face it... no one is fixing this place unless we do! we wish someone would... but it doesn't look likely. lets do a thought experiment... ASSUME FOR 2 MINS - God is not there. Just ASSUME no one ever told you about God for 2 mins. Look at the world outside. The hunger, the crime, the injustice. When stuff is stolen from us we 'know' there is a greater plan, the all seeing Eye that is God has recorded this action and someday the thief will pay for it. Assume that once it has been stolen there is no plan (you are still within your 2 mins). Ask yourself - then what? Look at a kid dying out of hunger in Turkana - what if this was IT for them? 'that's all folks!' - gone!! what of the person wrongfully incarcerated? if there is no one listening to his genuine prayers in seeking justice - what is to happen to him? that he is calling out to an inexistent person for justice and unless chaos brings it to him - he will die in jail of a crime he didn't commit. Ask yourself, If we are all living in a universe of chaos... then what is to happen to these people? if we are living in chaos and hitler got away scot-free... that there is no judgement and torment for him - then what? Some of the most passionate people i know for either the environment, peace, humanity, justice are actually atheists and it was conflicting... I asked myself why and realized... they have not delegated the responsibility of making things right to God but rather have decided to give a shit more and actually move to ending this damage! End of your 2 mins Masukuma where are you I come buy you a beer right now? Lol. Curtains closed. There is nothing more to say after this. End of discussion.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 10/9/2006 Posts: 1,502
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masukuma wrote:let's face it... no one is fixing this place unless we do! we wish someone would... but it doesn't look likely. lets do a thought experiment... ASSUME FOR 2 MINS - God is not there. Just ASSUME no one ever told you about God for 2 mins. Look at the world outside. The hunger, the crime, the injustice. When stuff is stolen from us we 'know' there is a greater plan, the all seeing Eye that is God has recorded this action and someday the thief will pay for it. Assume that once it has been stolen there is no plan (you are still within your 2 mins). Ask yourself - then what? Look at a kid dying out of hunger in Turkana - what if this was IT for them? 'that's all folks!' - gone!! what of the person wrongfully incarcerated? if there is no one listening to his genuine prayers in seeking justice - what is to happen to him? that he is calling out to an inexistent person for justice and unless chaos brings it to him - he will die in jail of a crime he didn't commit. Ask yourself, If we are all living in a universe of chaos... then what is to happen to these people? if we are living in chaos and hitler got away scot-free... that there is no judgement and torment for him - then what? Some of the most passionate people i know for either the environment, peace, humanity, justice are actually atheists and it was conflicting... I asked myself why and realized... they have not delegated the responsibility of making things right to God but rather have decided to give a shit more and actually move to ending this damage! End of your 2 mins  work to prosper
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/9/2009 Posts: 6,592 Location: Nairobi
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masukuma wrote:let's face it... no one is fixing this place unless we do! we wish someone would... but it doesn't look likely. lets do a thought experiment... ASSUME FOR 2 MINS - God is not there. Just ASSUME no one ever told you about God for 2 mins. Look at the world outside. The hunger, the crime, the injustice. When stuff is stolen from us we 'know' there is a greater plan, the all seeing Eye that is God has recorded this action and someday the thief will pay for it. Assume that once it has been stolen there is no plan (you are still within your 2 mins). Ask yourself - then what? Look at a kid dying out of hunger in Turkana - what if this was IT for them? 'that's all folks!' - gone!! what of the person wrongfully incarcerated? if there is no one listening to his genuine prayers in seeking justice - what is to happen to him? that he is calling out to an inexistent person for justice and unless chaos brings it to him - he will die in jail of a crime he didn't commit. Ask yourself, If we are all living in a universe of chaos... then what is to happen to these people? if we are living in chaos and hitler got away scot-free... that there is no judgement and torment for him - then what? Some of the most passionate people i know for either the environment, peace, humanity, justice are actually atheists and it was conflicting... I asked myself why and realized... they have not delegated the responsibility of making things right to God but rather have decided to give a shit more and actually move to ending this damage! End of your 2 mins @masukuma, I can tell that you are an intelligent, good natured and logical person. I like your thinking too and there's nothing I can discredit out of what you've written. I also cannot impose my God on you because no two people can experience God in the same way, so I can only tell you about my belief and understanding and nothing else. I will engage with you soberly because for a long time I thought the same way. So, what do you believe, including hamburglar and Tokyo? Do you believe that there is a higher power than yourself?
BBI will solve it :)
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,823 Location: Nairobi
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2012 wrote:So, what do you believe, including hamburglar and Tokyo? Do you believe that there is a higher power than yourself? I actually don't think debating on beliefs actually helps anyone or even converts anyone. belief is something really personal and profound. What do I believe - that changes with situations. I am fluid... do I believe there is a higher power? sometimes! do I think there is a higher power? No! Do I want there to be a higher power? most definitely yes! Sometimes i get to the end of me and I look up (why do we look up?) and ask "is this all?". Sometimes i triumph and I want to credit someone and I say "Thank you!". I diligently pray with my kids to God. Life is tough and having God makes it easier to swallow. The death of a girl like this one is easier to swallow if God is there  I want genghis khan judged for the killing everyone in Nishapur, including women, children, infants, and even dogs and cats and beheading them, and piling their skulls in pyramids - all 1.7 million people. I want all the slave traders who were responsible for the plunder of my african people punished! depending on who you ask - 50 million plus africans died over that period. I want King Leopod of belgium punished for what he did to the congo. the effects of his work is still being felt today! Yes... I want there to be a God! to thank for everything good in my life and for him to punish everything bad! but his/her being there is not subject to my want and belief - right? he is either there or not there irregardless of whether I believe him to be there or not! All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/20/2008 Posts: 6,275 Location: Kenya
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Now you see what happens when you read stories about a God who was walking on this tiny earth! It's evident that people never really believed such stories. What was He (God) stepping on before creating Earth? Such kind of thinking made kina @hamburglar to become atheists! And now @masukuma... After all those Sunday school tales, now you grow up and think of a God who walks on Earth, with footsteps heard like that of another fellow man walking, you wonder how can God walk on surface of this tiny earth, an earth which is not even visible in the Galaxy, can you imagine God walking on some path on earth!!! 
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,823 Location: Nairobi
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AlphDoti wrote:Now you see what happens when you read stories about a God who was walking on this tiny earth! It's evident that people never really believed such stories. What was He (God) stepping on before creating Earth? Such kind of thinking made kina @hamburglar to become atheists! And now @masukuma... After all those Sunday school tales, now you grow up and think of a God who walks on Earth, with footsteps heard like that of another fellow man walking, you wonder how can God walk on surface of this tiny earth, an earth which is not even visible in the Galaxy, can you imagine God walking on some path on earth!!! boss... I am not an atheist! I am a human.... All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,823 Location: Nairobi
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here is what i think... i think religions are like parents! they mean well! they are very useful! but people leave their parents at different time. some people are ophaned earlier than others. you tend to look like and behave like your folks. you and your siblings tend to think (broadly) in the same way. you respond to issues in similar ways - as you had been taught. some people leave their parents later than others! some people blame their parents for everything bad, some people believe that their parents are the best in the world. some people passionately love their parents and hate those other families (as their parents have taught them). but generally parents mean well! even if you come to a point where you are a grown up and you don't do everything they tell you to do; or even when their words don't carry much weight; or even when you start seeing them as really humans and a product of their environments - you don't (shouldn't) stop loving them. they have brought you up in the best way they know how! their influence will be with you for as long as you are alive. in the same way while you can generalize and say people of a certain family (Akina Fulani) do ABCD. you cannot generalize and say that all Ophans are similar! they are similar in their lack of parentage not their way of thinking or how they were born and raised and their influences. All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/18/2011 Posts: 12,069 Location: Kianjokoma
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AlphDoti wrote:Now you see what happens when you read stories about a God who was walking on this tiny earth! It's evident that people never really believed such stories. What was He (God) stepping on before creating Earth? Such kind of thinking made kina @hamburglar to become atheists! And now @masukuma... After all those Sunday school tales, now you grow up and think of a God who walks on Earth, with footsteps heard like that of another fellow man walking, you wonder how can God walk on surface of this tiny earth, an earth which is not even visible in the Galaxy, can you imagine God walking on some path on earth!!! What about some Arab prophet receiving prophecies from Satan?
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Rank: Member Joined: 12/17/2011 Posts: 887
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masukuma wrote:AlphDoti wrote:Now you see what happens when you read stories about a God who was walking on this tiny earth! It's evident that people never really believed such stories. What was He (God) stepping on before creating Earth? Such kind of thinking made kina @hamburglar to become atheists! And now @masukuma... After all those Sunday school tales, now you grow up and think of a God who walks on Earth, with footsteps heard like that of another fellow man walking, you wonder how can God walk on surface of this tiny earth, an earth which is not even visible in the Galaxy, can you imagine God walking on some path on earth!!! boss... I am not an atheist! I am a human.... I think you are more agnostic than anything else maspinach. Na atheists ni humans too. Lol.
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