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Treasury Bills and Bonds
maka
#541 Posted : Sunday, February 05, 2017 12:17:51 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
Dahatre wrote:
Guys:
I have question:

Has any of you played around with layered (laddered?) buys/bids of Tbills?
Been toying with the idea as a method to catch rising rates since I missed the huge run-ups we had a couple of years back-cuz money was tied up in a 364-day T-bill.

The way it would work if I had ~600K and wanted to bid on an 182-day bill:
I would bid 100K each month, for six months-continuously. I would then have some chums every month in a cyclic manner so that I am ready to jump into better rates if and when they come up instead of tying up my whole 600K in a single 182-day bid.

Could also work with 91-day bills. Heck, I suppose one could bid every week there was an auction throughout the year....

Thoughts?
TIA.



Yea you can do that...i have done it with bonds...I get regular maturities through out the year....
possunt quia posse videntur
Cornelius Vanderbilt
#542 Posted : Sunday, February 05, 2017 10:37:23 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 8/15/2015
Posts: 817
all you clever investors hiding here in t-bills and bonds can you return back to the stock market !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! tunaumia . woooiiiii.
Dahatre
#543 Posted : Monday, February 06, 2017 9:29:49 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 12/21/2009
Posts: 602
maka wrote:
Dahatre wrote:
Guys:
I have question:

Has any of you played around with layered (laddered?) buys/bids of Tbills?
Been toying with the idea as a method to catch rising rates since I missed the huge run-ups we had a couple of years back-cuz money was tied up in a 364-day T-bill.

The way it would work if I had ~600K and wanted to bid on an 182-day bill:
I would bid 100K each month, for six months-continuously. I would then have some chums every month in a cyclic manner so that I am ready to jump into better rates if and when they come up instead of tying up my whole 600K in a single 182-day bid.

Could also work with 91-day bills. Heck, I suppose one could bid every week there was an auction throughout the year....

Thoughts?
TIA.



Yea you can do that...i have done it with bonds...I get regular maturities through out the year....
Oh cool..Any reason why you prefer to do it with bonds instead of T-bills?
Dahatre
#544 Posted : Monday, February 06, 2017 9:36:34 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 12/21/2009
Posts: 602
Cornelius Vanderbilt wrote:
all you clever investors hiding here in t-bills and bonds can you return back to the stock market !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! tunaumia . woooiiiii.

Lol! some of us are trying to recover stock market losses. Tungali tunalia😢😢😢
maka
#545 Posted : Monday, February 06, 2017 9:42:43 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
Dahatre wrote:
maka wrote:
Dahatre wrote:
Guys:
I have question:

Has any of you played around with layered (laddered?) buys/bids of Tbills?
Been toying with the idea as a method to catch rising rates since I missed the huge run-ups we had a couple of years back-cuz money was tied up in a 364-day T-bill.

The way it would work if I had ~600K and wanted to bid on an 182-day bill:
I would bid 100K each month, for six months-continuously. I would then have some chums every month in a cyclic manner so that I am ready to jump into better rates if and when they come up instead of tying up my whole 600K in a single 182-day bid.

Could also work with 91-day bills. Heck, I suppose one could bid every week there was an auction throughout the year....

Thoughts?
TIA.



Yea you can do that...i have done it with bonds...I get regular maturities through out the year....
Oh cool..Any reason why you prefer to do it with bonds instead of T-bills?



Just personal preference...i get better yields on bonds plus its money am investing for the long haul...the shortest bond i have is 3.7.15....longest is the 30 year...
possunt quia posse videntur
snipermnoma
#546 Posted : Monday, February 06, 2017 10:50:39 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 1/3/2014
Posts: 257
maka wrote:
Pesa Nane wrote:
maka wrote:
snipermnoma wrote:
Pesa Nane wrote:
maka wrote:

Wekelea email I send you...

wazua@googlegroups.com

snipermnoma@gmail.com



Sent...

Not received


Hiyo yenu ya groups imekataa...ambia sniper awatumie...amepata yeye.


Sent to group
snipermnoma
#547 Posted : Monday, February 06, 2017 10:52:12 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 1/3/2014
Posts: 257
maka wrote:
Issuing IFB1/2017/12Yr. Coupon 12.50%. Settlement 27-Feb-17. Maturity Date 12-Feb-29. Amortised payments: 21-Feb-22 (20%), 19-Feb-24 (45%) & 12-Feb-29 (100%).


Anyone to the cbk website link to this prospectus?
maka
#548 Posted : Monday, February 06, 2017 11:20:26 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
snipermnoma wrote:
maka wrote:
Issuing IFB1/2017/12Yr. Coupon 12.50%. Settlement 27-Feb-17. Maturity Date 12-Feb-29. Amortised payments: 21-Feb-22 (20%), 19-Feb-24 (45%) & 12-Feb-29 (100%).


Anyone to the cbk website link to this prospectus?


Bado haijatoka...
possunt quia posse videntur
Ebenyo
#549 Posted : Monday, February 06, 2017 2:38:23 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 4/4/2016
Posts: 1,997
Location: Kitale
maka wrote:
snipermnoma wrote:
maka wrote:
Issuing IFB1/2017/12Yr. Coupon 12.50%. Settlement 27-Feb-17. Maturity Date 12-Feb-29. Amortised payments: 21-Feb-22 (20%), 19-Feb-24 (45%) & 12-Feb-29 (100%).


Anyone to the cbk website link to this prospectus?


Bado haijatoka...



i called cbk.not yet.i will be among the first to know cause the prospectus will hit my email before the news is public.
Towards the goal of financial freedom
maka
#550 Posted : Monday, February 06, 2017 2:41:13 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
Ebenyo wrote:
maka wrote:
snipermnoma wrote:
maka wrote:
Issuing IFB1/2017/12Yr. Coupon 12.50%. Settlement 27-Feb-17. Maturity Date 12-Feb-29. Amortised payments: 21-Feb-22 (20%), 19-Feb-24 (45%) & 12-Feb-29 (100%).


Anyone to the cbk website link to this prospectus?


Bado haijatoka...



i called cbk.not yet.i will be among the first to know cause the prospectus will hit my email before the news is public.


Haya you post it here for the fans.
possunt quia posse videntur
Pesa Nane
#551 Posted : Monday, February 06, 2017 5:36:48 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 5/25/2012
Posts: 4,105
Location: 08c
Ebenyo wrote:


i called cbk.not yet.i will be among the first to know cause the prospectus will hit my email before the news is public.


From the printer smile

Quote:
Central Bank of Kenya, acting in its capacity as fiscal agent for the Republic of Kenya, invites bids for the above bond whose terms and conditions are as follows:-

Issuer : Republic of Kenya.
Amount : Kshs. 30 Billion.

Purpose : For partial funding of infrastucture projects in Roads, Energy and Water sectors.

Tenor : Twelve-year
Coupon : 12.500%


Period of sale : 07/02/2017 to 21/02/2017
Value Date : 27/02/2017

Auction Date : Wednesday, 22/02/2017
Results : Investors should obtain details of amounts
payable for successful bids, from Central Bank on Thursday 23/02/2017.

Price Quote : Discounted/Premium/ Par
Minimum Amount : Kshs. 100,000.00

Interest Payment Dates:
28/08/2017 24/08/2020 21/08/2023 17/08/2026
26/02/2018 22/02/2021 19/02/2024 15/02/2027
27/08/2018 23/08/2021 19/08/2024 16/08/2027
25/02/2019 21/02/2022 17/02/2025 14/02/2028
26/08/2019 22/08/2022 18/08/2025 14/08/2028
24/02/2020 20/02/2023 16/02/2026 12/02/2029

Redemption Date : 12/02/2029

Taxation : The Bond will be tax free as is the case for all Infrastructure Bonds as provided for under the
Income Tax Act.

Redemption Structure :

21st February, 2022- 20.000% of unencumbered
outstanding principal amount

19th February,2024-45.000% of unencumbered
outstanding principal amount

12th February, 2029 - 100% - Final Redemption
of all outstanding amounts

Amortization : No partial redemption will be paid on
encumbered securities on armotization dates.
Any amount upto Kshs. 1.0 million per CDS
account at armotization will be redeemed in
full except for encumbered securities.

Auction Method : Multi-Price Bid Auction


Pesa Nane plans to be shilingi when he grows up.
Angelica _ann
#552 Posted : Monday, February 06, 2017 5:41:27 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/7/2012
Posts: 11,908
Auction Method : Multi-Price Bid Auction......... what does this mean?
In the business world, everyone is paid in two coins - cash and experience. Take the experience first; the cash will come later - H Geneen
maka
#553 Posted : Monday, February 06, 2017 5:48:38 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
Angelica _ann wrote:
Auction Method : Multi-Price Bid Auction......... what does this mean?


In a multiple price auction, the successful bidders are required to pay for the allotted quantity at the respective price or yield at which they bid.If its within the cut off range...
possunt quia posse videntur
Hobitke
#554 Posted : Monday, February 06, 2017 7:17:21 PM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 5/22/2016
Posts: 69
Location: Nairobi
maka wrote:
Angelica _ann wrote:
Auction Method : Multi-Price Bid Auction......... what does this mean?


In a multiple price auction, the successful bidders are required to pay for the allotted quantity at the respective price or yield at which they bid.If its within the cut off range...


This bond business is difficult to grasp!

If anyone can be as so kind as to explain how to arrive at the quoted yield? Is this the same as the coupon rate? ( newbie questions )
maka
#555 Posted : Monday, February 06, 2017 8:21:12 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
Hobitke wrote:
maka wrote:
Angelica _ann wrote:
Auction Method : Multi-Price Bid Auction......... what does this mean?


In a multiple price auction, the successful bidders are required to pay for the allotted quantity at the respective price or yield at which they bid.If its within the cut off range...


This bond business is difficult to grasp!

If anyone can be as so kind as to explain how to arrive at the quoted yield? Is this the same as the coupon rate? ( newbie questions )


Two different things...quoted yield is the current market price of the bond at the secondary market...or if its at the auction its the price you put your bid at...Coupon rate is normally fixed never changes during the tenor of the bond thats what you will be getting every year usually semi annually...
possunt quia posse videntur
Hobitke
#556 Posted : Monday, February 06, 2017 9:14:44 PM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 5/22/2016
Posts: 69
Location: Nairobi
maka wrote:
Hobitke wrote:
maka wrote:
Angelica _ann wrote:
Auction Method : Multi-Price Bid Auction......... what does this mean?


In a multiple price auction, the successful bidders are required to pay for the allotted quantity at the respective price or yield at which they bid.If its within the cut off range...


This bond business is difficult to grasp!

If anyone can be as so kind as to explain how to arrive at the quoted yield? Is this the same as the coupon rate? ( newbie questions )


Two different things...quoted yield is the current market price of the bond at the secondary market...or if its at the auction its the price you put your bid at...Coupon rate is normally fixed never changes during the tenor of the bond thats what you will be getting every year usually semi annually...


@ Maka , thanks, by price do you mean total value I am bidding? e.g 1 million? Would that not be face value?
maka
#557 Posted : Tuesday, February 07, 2017 5:36:14 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
Hobitke wrote:
maka wrote:
Hobitke wrote:
maka wrote:
Angelica _ann wrote:
Auction Method : Multi-Price Bid Auction......... what does this mean?


In a multiple price auction, the successful bidders are required to pay for the allotted quantity at the respective price or yield at which they bid.If its within the cut off range...


This bond business is difficult to grasp!

If anyone can be as so kind as to explain how to arrive at the quoted yield? Is this the same as the coupon rate? ( newbie questions )


Two different things...quoted yield is the current market price of the bond at the secondary market...or if its at the auction its the price you put your bid at...Coupon rate is normally fixed never changes during the tenor of the bond thats what you will be getting every year usually semi annually...


@ Maka , thanks, by price do you mean total value I am bidding? e.g 1 million? Would that not be face value?


Yes but depending on your bid rate you can buy at premium,at par or a at a discount. ..so a paper that is 1 million...you might pay less for every 100 but coupon will still be calculated on your 1 million...and you will still get your 1 million at maturity.
possunt quia posse videntur
Hobitke
#558 Posted : Tuesday, February 07, 2017 8:11:13 AM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 5/22/2016
Posts: 69
Location: Nairobi
maka wrote:
Hobitke wrote:
maka wrote:
Hobitke wrote:
maka wrote:
Angelica _ann wrote:
Auction Method : Multi-Price Bid Auction......... what does this mean?


In a multiple price auction, the successful bidders are required to pay for the allotted quantity at the respective price or yield at which they bid.If its within the cut off range...


This bond business is difficult to grasp!

If anyone can be as so kind as to explain how to arrive at the quoted yield? Is this the same as the coupon rate? ( newbie questions )


Two different things...quoted yield is the current market price of the bond at the secondary market...or if its at the auction its the price you put your bid at...Coupon rate is normally fixed never changes during the tenor of the bond thats what you will be getting every year usually semi annually...


@ Maka , thanks, by price do you mean total value I am bidding? e.g 1 million? Would that not be face value?


Yes but depending on your bid rate you can buy at premium,at par or a at a discount. ..so a paper that is 1 million...you might pay less for every 100 but coupon will still be calculated on your 1 million...and you will still get your 1 million at maturity.


@ Maka, thanks , So ..if at auction they state ''Price per Kshs 100 at Average Yield '' that means its at par therefore yield would be zero?

Hobitke
#559 Posted : Tuesday, February 07, 2017 8:14:07 AM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 5/22/2016
Posts: 69
Location: Nairobi
Hobitke wrote:
maka wrote:
Hobitke wrote:
maka wrote:
Hobitke wrote:
maka wrote:
Angelica _ann wrote:
Auction Method : Multi-Price Bid Auction......... what does this mean?


In a multiple price auction, the successful bidders are required to pay for the allotted quantity at the respective price or yield at which they bid.If its within the cut off range...


This bond business is difficult to grasp!

If anyone can be as so kind as to explain how to arrive at the quoted yield? Is this the same as the coupon rate? ( newbie questions )


Two different things...quoted yield is the current market price of the bond at the secondary market...or if its at the auction its the price you put your bid at...Coupon rate is normally fixed never changes during the tenor of the bond thats what you will be getting every year usually semi annually...


@ Maka , thanks, by price do you mean total value I am bidding? e.g 1 million? Would that not be face value?


Yes but depending on your bid rate you can buy at premium,at par or a at a discount. ..so a paper that is 1 million...you might pay less for every 100 but coupon will still be calculated on your 1 million...and you will still get your 1 million at maturity.


@ Maka, thanks , So ..if at auction they state ''Price per Kshs 100 at Average Yield '' that means its at par therefore yield would be zero?

Is the face value the same as the amount you are bidding? Mysterious world of bonds.Sad


maka
#560 Posted : Tuesday, February 07, 2017 9:59:07 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
Hobitke wrote:
maka wrote:
Hobitke wrote:
maka wrote:
Hobitke wrote:
maka wrote:
Angelica _ann wrote:
Auction Method : Multi-Price Bid Auction......... what does this mean?


In a multiple price auction, the successful bidders are required to pay for the allotted quantity at the respective price or yield at which they bid.If its within the cut off range...


This bond business is difficult to grasp!

If anyone can be as so kind as to explain how to arrive at the quoted yield? Is this the same as the coupon rate? ( newbie questions )


Two different things...quoted yield is the current market price of the bond at the secondary market...or if its at the auction its the price you put your bid at...Coupon rate is normally fixed never changes during the tenor of the bond thats what you will be getting every year usually semi annually...


@ Maka , thanks, by price do you mean total value I am bidding? e.g 1 million? Would that not be face value?


Yes but depending on your bid rate you can buy at premium,at par or a at a discount. ..so a paper that is 1 million...you might pay less for every 100 but coupon will still be calculated on your 1 million...and you will still get your 1 million at maturity.


@ Maka, thanks , So ..if at auction they state ''Price per Kshs 100 at Average Yield '' that means its at par therefore yield would be zero?



smile Nope...at market weighted average yield...you will get the bond at the average yield of accepted bids fellows went in at...which can still be at discount,par or premium depending on the auction outcome...you should try with this IFB you will get to learn...expecting a discount on it...
possunt quia posse videntur
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