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SHARES versus REAL ESTATE
Rank: Veteran Joined: 2/10/2010 Posts: 1,001 Location: River Road
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Quote:"The combined wealth created this year by the Shanghai and Shenzen markets could purchase all the property in London twice." That insane and amazing comparison came from UBS Wealth Management's James Purcell on Friday. Try to grasp the scale of that. London, with a population of more than 8 million, and one of the most expensive cities in the world in terms of property, could be bought out by just the *gains* made in the first five months of 2015. Read more: http://www.businessinsid...ce-2015-6#ixzz3cSn7TShS
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Rank: Chief Joined: 5/31/2011 Posts: 5,121
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kaka2za wrote:Stocks any day! Buy KQ at 45 sell at 7/- Buy Mumias at 40/- sell at 2/- Dunia kuna watu pessimist kweli kaka!
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Rank: Member Joined: 3/26/2012 Posts: 830
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mkonomtupu wrote:Quote:"The combined wealth created this year by the Shanghai and Shenzen markets could purchase all the property in London twice." That insane and amazing comparison came from UBS Wealth Management's James Purcell on Friday. Try to grasp the scale of that. London, with a population of more than 8 million, and one of the most expensive cities in the world in terms of property, could be bought out by just the *gains* made in the first five months of 2015. Read more: http://www.businessinsid...ce-2015-6#ixzz3cSn7TShS Investing is a game of risk vs returns...and real estate wins with this regard. What about a bear market in 2011 here at NSE...people lost lots of cash. Rarely will a real estate investment tank below 10%. That said, I maintain that a smart investor should invest in both, favoring real estate...say 60/40 or 70/30...with the proportion held in shares highly determined by your skills in stock market investing...I bet @ Stocksmaster may even allocate 50/50  A successful man is not he who gets the best, it is he who makes the best from what he gets.
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Rank: Chief Joined: 5/9/2007 Posts: 13,095
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/22/2009 Posts: 2,449 Location: Africa
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S.Mutaga III wrote:mkonomtupu wrote:Quote:"The combined wealth created this year by the Shanghai and Shenzen markets could purchase all the property in London twice." That insane and amazing comparison came from UBS Wealth Management's James Purcell on Friday. Try to grasp the scale of that. London, with a population of more than 8 million, and one of the most expensive cities in the world in terms of property, could be bought out by just the *gains* made in the first five months of 2015. Read more: http://www.businessinsid...ce-2015-6#ixzz3cSn7TShS Investing is a game of risk vs returns...and real estate wins with this regard. What about a bear market in 2011 here at NSE...people lost lots of cash. Rarely will a real estate investment tank below 10%. That said, I maintain that a smart investor should invest in both, favoring real estate...say 60/40 or 70/30...with the proportion held in shares highly determined by your skills in stock market investing...I bet @ Stocksmaster may even allocate 50/50 Stocks are very addictive though. Even a profit of 500bob can give you a high
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Rank: New-farer Joined: 2/7/2016 Posts: 79 Location: Home
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This discussion is usually very vague. In my opinion, what matters are individual deals presented to an investor and which are within his/her budget. If I have one million, I have two deals, to buy a 50*100 in Thika, or to buy KCB shares. In such a case, you will have to examine the true value of KCB shares and whether you are getting a discount/overpaying for the shares. You will also have to check whether the land in that area costs roughly the same, and whether you are getting any value for money e.g the rental cost of a one bedroom unit in the area where the land is. Therefore, this discussion will never end and at any one time, a smart investor will carefully examine individual deals. KCB is a bad deal if you buy at 60bob, and land is a bad deal if you buy it in a remote and uninhabited location for 1 million. Therefore, in order to make a decision, you must have a fairly accurate valuation of the stock, and the property. Then you can check which one is being offered at a greater discount and choose it. NB: The better investment (between shares and real estate) is the one that is being offered at the greatest discount from its true value.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 9/23/2009 Posts: 8,083 Location: Enk are Nyirobi
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Mkondoa Macho wrote:This discussion is usually very vague. In my opinion, what matters are individual deals presented to an investor and which are within his/her budget. If I have one million, I have two deals, to buy a 50*100 in Thika, or to buy KCB shares. In such a case, you will have to examine the true value of KCB shares and whether you are getting a discount/overpaying for the shares. You will also have to check whether the land in that area costs roughly the same, and whether you are getting any value for money e.g the rental cost of a one bedroom unit in the area where the land is. Therefore, this discussion will never end and at any one time, a smart investor will carefully examine individual deals. KCB is a bad deal if you buy at 60bob, and land is a bad deal if you buy it in a remote and uninhabited location for 1 million. Therefore, in order to make a decision, you must have a fairly accurate valuation of the stock, and the property. Then you can check which one is being offered at a greater discount and choose it. NB: The better investment (between shares and real estate) is the one that is being offered at the greatest discount from its true value. If Bill Gates had invested in land, he would still be owning 100 or so acres in Washington. Life is short. Live passionately.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/7/2012 Posts: 11,908
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Innovation is the best investment  In the business world, everyone is paid in two coins - cash and experience. Take the experience first; the cash will come later - H Geneen
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Rank: Elder Joined: 9/23/2009 Posts: 8,083 Location: Enk are Nyirobi
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Angelica _ann wrote:Innovation is the best investment Damn right. Life is short. Live passionately.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 1/20/2011 Posts: 1,820 Location: Nakuru
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Lets take a hypothetical situation of two different Kenyan employees earning a net salary of 70k each with a wife and one child in kindergarten.. Employee AB - a long suffering Kenyan in his mid-thirties aspires to one day own a home. He is more biased towards the buy-a-plot-and-build-own-house route.He has shopped around and can only find plots priced at 1.5 million(50X100). He has not enough savings to pay for the plot cash and hence has no otherwise other than take a loan. He reckons he can pay-off the loan in 60 months(kshs. 25000 plus interest).Once done paying this loan, he will take another one to build the house and hence in the next 10 years this man will have a house but with little liquidity(cash and other liquid assets e.g., stocks). On the other hand, Employee BA - another weathered and battered Kenyan in his mid thirties buys Kenya power shares worth ksh. 25,000 every month for 60 months without fail. Assuming Kenya power shares never go up and remain at the current price of 4 bob in the next 5 years, employee BA will have accumulated 375,000 shares with a paper value of 1.5 million. If say after the 5 years Kenya power resumes paying its 0.5 cents dividend employee BA will be making a cool ksh. 187,500 per year or ksh. 15625 per month. If this is re-invested in the same Kenya power shares(assuming they remain at 4 bob) he would have accumulated a cool 975,000 kenya power shares(value = 975000 * 4 = 3900000) in 10 years. If the market one day irrationally or rationally decides to value Kenya power shares to an amount equal to today(Jan 2019) book value then you can guess who will be laughing all the way to the bank.... However, if the stories we are hearing from the " 1 million invested near Nairobi 10 years ago thread..." happened 10 years from now, then Employee AB will also be a happy man. So, the thrifty Mugundaman a.k.a LosAngeles-254 awachane na sisi watu wa kununua mbuzi(stocks) alafu baadaye zikizaana tutanunua ng'ombe(real estate). As he(Mugundaman alias LosAngeles) correctly states, most of us are employed by tightwad wahindis and can only buy real estate through loans which means that in all our working lives we might end up with one buloti with a poorly built house. Dumb money becomes dumb only when it listens to smart money
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Rank: Elder Joined: 1/8/2018 Posts: 2,211 Location: DC (Dustbowl County)
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Fyatu wrote:Lets take a hypothetical situation of two different Kenyan employees earning a net salary of 70k each with a wife and one child in kindergarten..
Employee AB - a long suffering Kenyan in his mid-thirties aspires to one day own a home. He is more biased towards the buy-a-plot-and-build-own-house route.He has shopped around and can only find plots priced at 1.5 million(50X100). He has not enough savings to pay for the plot cash and hence has no otherwise other than take a loan. He reckons he can pay-off the loan in 60 months(kshs. 25000 plus interest).Once done paying this loan, he will take another one to build the house and hence in the next 10 years this man will have a house but with little liquidity(cash and other liquid assets e.g., stocks).
On the other hand, Employee BA - another weathered and battered Kenyan in his mid thirties buys Kenya power shares worth ksh. 25,000 every month for 60 months without fail. Assuming Kenya power shares never go up and remain at the current price of 4 bob in the next 5 years, employee BA will have accumulated 375,000 shares with a paper value of 1.5 million. If say after the 5 years Kenya power resumes paying its 0.5 cents dividend employee BA will be making a cool ksh. 187,500 per year or ksh. 15625 per month. If this is re-invested in the same Kenya power shares(assuming they remain at 4 bob) he would have accumulated a cool 975,000 kenya power shares(value = 975000 * 4 = 3900000). If the market one day irrationally or rationally decides to value Kenya power shares to an amount equal to today(Jan 2019) book value then you can guess who will be laughing all the way to the bank....
However, if the stories we are hearing from the "1 million invested near Nairobi 10 years ago thread..." happened 10 years from now, then Employee AB will also be a happy man.
So, the thrifty Mugundaman a.k.a LosAngeles-254 awachane na sisi watu wa kununua mbuzi(stocks) alafu baadaye zikizaana tutanunua ng'ombe(real estate). As he(Mugundaman alias LosAngeles) correctly states, most of us are employed by tightwad wahindis and can only buy real estate through loans which means that in all our working lives we might end up with one buloti with a poorly built house.
You have a gift for comedy my buradzee. 1. On AB. Hahitaji loan hata kamwe. I been preachin' hapa for a full year that nobody should take even one kobo (ndururu) in loans to get to paradise (DC). Iko kito naitwa INSTALLMENT PLAN for pulotis. You pay kedo 50k down and then as little as 10k a month and you are good to go. A few years later you own the plot clean. After that you just do your progress mdogo mdogo with the same money you were using to pay for the plot. Anza na fence. Then pay the architect, then pay for approvals, then buy your first trip of sand or kokoto (a joyful moment for first timers) hivo hivo until dream house is done. 70k is a LOT of money ma broda. I bet those who earn it though spend 20 of it on fombe and nyamchom and then cry they can only get ahead with loans. Disabuse yourselves of that myth. Inawezekana na itawezekana ESPECIALLY in DC. 2. On BA - You have a point on Shilling-cost averaging KPLC. Ubaya these mbuzis and nyanis are unpredictable my broda. All it takes is one big thief or scandal and huyoooo you hear KPLC is being wound up and your hundreds of thousands of shares are worth zero. The biggest mistake in life is to invest in an asset you have zero control over except a piece of paper saying you are a "part owne." People shilling-cost averaged Mumias to the skies. Some had MILLIONS of shares. Some cried that gava will NEVER let a company it owns a huge chunk of shares in to collapse. Wapi? Billions in bailouts later, that mkebe is worth a very round zero 10 years down the line. They are not crushing cane, not producing ethanol and electricity was shut off juzi juzi. Yet some are still buying the shares Bottom line I will say it for the LAST time. Real estate in Kiinya is the path of LEAST RESISTANCE in the wealth building ladder in Kiinya. -Low risk -You have control -Hard to liquidate on impulse (capital preserving/land banking) -Unmatched and STEADY appreciationg potential And all this is a no-brainer in a DEVELOPING country that has HIGH HOUSING DEFICITS and a HUGE GROWING POPULATION that will need a piece of land to sleep on, eat on, conduct business on and even walk on yet no new pieces of land are being created except at Lamu port. Ni hayo maoni yangu tu!
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 1/20/2011 Posts: 1,820 Location: Nakuru
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James Mworia is a living testament of how consistent purchase of a stock over the long haul can make one a billionaire. He can now afford lots of bulotis in DC and even develop them. My point is, first things first. Start by buying affordable assets(chickens), sell them and their eggs and buy goats...rear them and sell them together with mbuzi mtotos and buy cattle and camels. Dumb money becomes dumb only when it listens to smart money
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 1/20/2011 Posts: 1,820 Location: Nakuru
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MugundaMan wrote:Fyatu wrote:Lets take a hypothetical situation of two different Kenyan employees earning a net salary of 70k each with a wife and one child in kindergarten..
Employee AB - a long suffering Kenyan in his mid-thirties aspires to one day own a home. He is more biased towards the buy-a-plot-and-build-own-house route.He has shopped around and can only find plots priced at 1.5 million(50X100). He has not enough savings to pay for the plot cash and hence has no otherwise other than take a loan. He reckons he can pay-off the loan in 60 months(kshs. 25000 plus interest).Once done paying this loan, he will take another one to build the house and hence in the next 10 years this man will have a house but with little liquidity(cash and other liquid assets e.g., stocks).
On the other hand, Employee BA - another weathered and battered Kenyan in his mid thirties buys Kenya power shares worth ksh. 25,000 every month for 60 months without fail. Assuming Kenya power shares never go up and remain at the current price of 4 bob in the next 5 years, employee BA will have accumulated 375,000 shares with a paper value of 1.5 million. If say after the 5 years Kenya power resumes paying its 0.5 cents dividend employee BA will be making a cool ksh. 187,500 per year or ksh. 15625 per month. If this is re-invested in the same Kenya power shares(assuming they remain at 4 bob) he would have accumulated a cool 975,000 kenya power shares(value = 975000 * 4 = 3900000). If the market one day irrationally or rationally decides to value Kenya power shares to an amount equal to today(Jan 2019) book value then you can guess who will be laughing all the way to the bank....
However, if the stories we are hearing from the "1 million invested near Nairobi 10 years ago thread..." happened 10 years from now, then Employee AB will also be a happy man.
So, the thrifty Mugundaman a.k.a LosAngeles-254 awachane na sisi watu wa kununua mbuzi(stocks) alafu baadaye zikizaana tutanunua ng'ombe(real estate). As he(Mugundaman alias LosAngeles) correctly states, most of us are employed by tightwad wahindis and can only buy real estate through loans which means that in all our working lives we might end up with one buloti with a poorly built house.
You have a gift for comedy my buradzee. 1. On AB. Hahitaji loan hata kamwe. I been preachin' hapa for a full year that nobody should take even one kobo (ndururu) in loans to get to paradise (DC). Iko kito naitwa INSTALLMENT PLAN for pulotis. You pay kedo 50k down and then as little as 10k a month and you are good to go. A few years later you own the plot clean. After that you just do your progress mdogo mdogo with the same money you were using to pay for the plot. Anza na fence. Then pay the architect, then pay for approvals, then buy your first trip of sand or kokoto (a joyful moment for first timers) hivo hivo until dream house is done. 70k is a LOT of money ma broda. I bet those who earn it though spend 20 of it on fombe and nyamchom and then cry they can only get ahead with loans. Disabuse yourselves of that myth. Inawezekana na itawezekana ESPECIALLY in DC. 2. On BA - You have a point on Shilling-cost averaging KPLC. Ubaya these mbuzis and nyanis are unpredictable my broda. All it takes is one big thief or scandal and huyoooo you hear KPLC is being wound up and your hundreds of thousands of shares are worth zero. The biggest mistake in life is to invest in an asset you have zero control over except a piece of paper saying you are a "part owne." People shilling-cost averaged Mumias to the skies. Some had MILLIONS of shares. Some cried that gava will NEVER let a company it owns a huge chunk of shares in to collapse. Wapi? Billions in bailouts later, that mkebe is worth a very round zero 10 years down the line. They are not crushing cane, not producing ethanol and electricity was shut off juzi juzi. Yet some are still buying the shares Bottom line I will say it for the LAST time. Real estate in Kiinya is the path of LEAST RESISTANCE in the wealth building ladder in Kiinya. -Low risk -You have control -Hard to liquidate on impulse (capital preserving/land banking) -Unmatched and STEADY appreciationg potential And all this is a no-brainer in a DEVELOPING country that has HIGH HOUSING DEFICITS and a HUGE GROWING POPULATION that will need a piece of land to sleep on, eat on, conduct business on and even walk on yet no new pieces of land are being created except at Lamu port. Ni hayo maoni yangu tu! Brathe share a link of this company that sells land kwa stylo hiyo hiyo. At what point does one get a title deed? Dumb money becomes dumb only when it listens to smart money
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Rank: Elder Joined: 1/8/2018 Posts: 2,211 Location: DC (Dustbowl County)
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Fyatu wrote:
Brathe share a link of this company that sells land kwa stylo hiyo hiyo. At what point does one get a title deed?
Now you are asking all the right questions papa  Ziko nyiiiiiiingi. Here is a taste: https://www.capitalfm.co...sh9000-per-month-plots/
Bottom line.. Come to DC where all possibilities exist. My suggestion to you to find more of these type of opportunities..if you are on FB, just search for "kitengela plots" or "ngong plots" or "Rongai plots" etc and then LIKE every single company you see selling them. Then as the months go by you will see eye popping deals floating in your timeline huyoooo. Just make sure to "like" them as a thanks for this info. Title deed huwes pata till ulipe fully fully bradza. That's why you gotta do your due diligence on both the company and the ploti to make sure everything is 100% legit. If there are many people complaining title has not come 2 years after payment completion RUN even before doing due diligence.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 1/8/2018 Posts: 2,211 Location: DC (Dustbowl County)
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Fyatu wrote:James Mworia is a living testament of how consistent purchase of a stock over the long haul can make one a billionaire. He can now afford lots of bulotis in DC and even develop them. My point is, first things first. Start by buying affordable assets(chickens), sell them and their eggs and buy goats...rear them and sell them together with mbuzi mtotos and buy cattle and camels. But JM did not make his billions from trading stocks Mutaga style He has been earning HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS in salaries and perks and performance based "bonuses" (a ripoff to shareholders) in a company over which HE HAS DIRECT CONTROL in which he is reinvesting in. That is a totally different ballgame hapo hapo.
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SHARES versus REAL ESTATE
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