Wazua
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Form One Selection 2015
Rank: Elder Joined: 12/17/2009 Posts: 3,583 Location: Kenya
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murchr wrote:nakujua wrote:kaka2za wrote:nakujua wrote:the disdain towards some kids is unwaranted, just coz a section of the population is not as moneyed as some does not mean they should not get chances. we voted in a constitution that dictates national balance and when it hits home hatutaki.
Bursaries exists, well wishers exists - let the kids get a chance at bettering maisha Yao. Bursaries are funded by taxes and Public schools too. Therefore, when the son of a rich tax payer gets 415 marks he is entitled for a place in the National school. Equity is not about denying others opportunities. In ensuring a balanced society, and ensuring the country in general shares out it resources in an equitable manner, some will have to miss out on opportunities. It's there in your constitution as pertaining national resources. There's nothing like a balanced society, poverty to a large extend is a state of mind that even education cannot change. Purnishing a tax payer because he was able to squeeze that extra coin is an injustice. it's in the constitution, whose spirit is to try and ensure balance when it comes to national resources. poverty has an environment aspect to it, it matters a lot where you are born and education does play a major role to alleviating the same.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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nakujua wrote:murchr wrote:nakujua wrote:kaka2za wrote:nakujua wrote:the disdain towards some kids is unwaranted, just coz a section of the population is not as moneyed as some does not mean they should not get chances. we voted in a constitution that dictates national balance and when it hits home hatutaki.
Bursaries exists, well wishers exists - let the kids get a chance at bettering maisha Yao. Bursaries are funded by taxes and Public schools too. Therefore, when the son of a rich tax payer gets 415 marks he is entitled for a place in the National school. Equity is not about denying others opportunities. In ensuring a balanced society, and ensuring the country in general shares out it resources in an equitable manner, some will have to miss out on opportunities. It's there in your constitution as pertaining national resources. There's nothing like a balanced society, poverty to a large extend is a state of mind that even education cannot change. Purnishing a tax payer because he was able to squeeze that extra coin is an injustice. it's in the constitution, whose spirit is to try and ensure balance when it comes to national resources. poverty has an environment aspect to it, it matters a lot where you are born and education does play a major role to alleviating the same. The same constitution advocates for equal opportunities for all. The ministry would fail terribly if the constitution would be their line of argument "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore .
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/3/2008 Posts: 4,057 Location: Gwitu
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It is a fact that some of the public primary schools are more expensive than private academies e.g Westlands,Utafiti and FairLawns. The rich will take more of the public schools and make them exclusive. All the good teachers are in public schools and private encounter high staff turnover yet they still perform better. Taking a child with 283 marks to Mang'u will not necessarily be of benefit. It might actually disorient him. Truth forever on the scaffold Wrong forever on the throne (James Russell Rowell)
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Rank: Elder Joined: 4/22/2009 Posts: 2,863
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Hope no kids of Wazuans have directly been discriminated against by this year's selections. Otherwise reading through some posts on this thread can make one contemplate committing suicide. This is one thread where only those with school-going children should be allowed to post. IF YOU EXPECT ME TO POST ANYTHING POSITIVE ABOUT ASENO, YOU MAY AS WELL SIT ON A PIN
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/17/2009 Posts: 3,583 Location: Kenya
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murchr wrote:nakujua wrote:murchr wrote:nakujua wrote:kaka2za wrote:nakujua wrote:the disdain towards some kids is unwaranted, just coz a section of the population is not as moneyed as some does not mean they should not get chances. we voted in a constitution that dictates national balance and when it hits home hatutaki.
Bursaries exists, well wishers exists - let the kids get a chance at bettering maisha Yao. Bursaries are funded by taxes and Public schools too. Therefore, when the son of a rich tax payer gets 415 marks he is entitled for a place in the National school. Equity is not about denying others opportunities. In ensuring a balanced society, and ensuring the country in general shares out it resources in an equitable manner, some will have to miss out on opportunities. It's there in your constitution as pertaining national resources. There's nothing like a balanced society, poverty to a large extend is a state of mind that even education cannot change. Purnishing a tax payer because he was able to squeeze that extra coin is an injustice. it's in the constitution, whose spirit is to try and ensure balance when it comes to national resources. poverty has an environment aspect to it, it matters a lot where you are born and education does play a major role to alleviating the same. The same constitution advocates for equal opportunities for all. The ministry would fail terribly if the constitution would be their line of argument I wish someone could take it to the courts, would love to hear the arguments and the outcome. but if you deem all kids equal and only use their kcpe performance for placement then hapo sawa that's your take on it, Mimi I think equality in this particular case involves considering the conditions surrounding a kid, and opportunities apportioned in such a way that kids from all over the country get to benefit from what the national Schools have to offer.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/22/2009 Posts: 7,460
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nakujua wrote:MaichBlack wrote:And one more thing oh ye ignorant Kenyans, people don't take kids to private schools because they are rich. Some actually struggle and sacrifice to pay the fees. Why not simply take their kids to public schools? For one, where are the schools - in Nairobi for example? How many schools has the City Council and now City county built since the 90s??? Of the old ones, how many new classes has the council/county built. In new estates, how many public schools have been built. Some Nairobi estates have between zero and one public school. How do you squeeze in all the kids there? What if there is no public school? You take them to the neighbouring estate??
Reasonable affirmative action is okay. Kids in marginalized areas need a helping hand. But what is happening currently is too much. If you are my neighbour, you still expect your kid to join a National school with 345 while mine can't join the same school with 420 marks just because you took your kid to a public school? And yet you claim there are inadequate public schools and then your neighbor takes their kid to a public school. that aside, it's not as if private school kids do not get access to the national school - the selection results have been posted and the private school have been given their share. Hey, don't argue for the sake of arguing. Those were two different scenarios. Someone living in Roysambu or Kasarani (or even Karen) may not have a public School nearby any has no option but to take their kid to a private school. People living in Kayole, Umoja or even Runda Mumwe might have at least one public school nearby. One neighbour might take his kid to the public school and the other one takes theirs to a private school. Get it now??? Never count on making a good sale. Have the purchase price be so attractive that even a mediocre sale gives good returns.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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nakujua wrote:murchr wrote:nakujua wrote:murchr wrote:nakujua wrote:kaka2za wrote:nakujua wrote:the disdain towards some kids is unwaranted, just coz a section of the population is not as moneyed as some does not mean they should not get chances. we voted in a constitution that dictates national balance and when it hits home hatutaki.
Bursaries exists, well wishers exists - let the kids get a chance at bettering maisha Yao. Bursaries are funded by taxes and Public schools too. Therefore, when the son of a rich tax payer gets 415 marks he is entitled for a place in the National school. Equity is not about denying others opportunities. In ensuring a balanced society, and ensuring the country in general shares out it resources in an equitable manner, some will have to miss out on opportunities. It's there in your constitution as pertaining national resources. There's nothing like a balanced society, poverty to a large extend is a state of mind that even education cannot change. Purnishing a tax payer because he was able to squeeze that extra coin is an injustice. it's in the constitution, whose spirit is to try and ensure balance when it comes to national resources. poverty has an environment aspect to it, it matters a lot where you are born and education does play a major role to alleviating the same. The same constitution advocates for equal opportunities for all. The ministry would fail terribly if the constitution would be their line of argument I wish someone could take it to the courts, would love to hear the arguments and the outcome. but if you deem all kids equal and only use their kcpe performance for placement then hapo sawa that's your take on it, Mimi I think equality in this particular case involves considering the conditions surrounding a kid, and opportunities apportioned in such a way that kids from all over the country get to benefit from what the national Schools have to offer. I hope someone is doing it. "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore .
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/17/2009 Posts: 3,583 Location: Kenya
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kaka2za wrote:It is a fact that some of the public primary schools are more expensive than private academies e.g Westlands,Utafiti and FairLawns. The rich will take more of the public schools and make them exclusive.
All the good teachers are in public schools and private encounter high staff turnover yet they still perform better.
Taking a child with 283 marks to Mang'u will not necessarily be of benefit. It might actually disorient him. If the kid is from a marginalized area, I think it's good to give them a chance whether they make it or not, at least a chance, otherwise we end up with a society that is skewed, not that it's not. But at least give chances to others kids who just happened to be born in certain conditions.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/3/2008 Posts: 4,057 Location: Gwitu
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National schools had 20,000 places yet only around 5,000 pupils had over 400 marks. Why not take all the 5,000 and apply affirmative action on the remaining 15,000 places? Truth forever on the scaffold Wrong forever on the throne (James Russell Rowell)
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/3/2008 Posts: 4,057 Location: Gwitu
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nakujua wrote:kaka2za wrote:It is a fact that some of the public primary schools are more expensive than private academies e.g Westlands,Utafiti and FairLawns. The rich will take more of the public schools and make them exclusive.
All the good teachers are in public schools and private encounter high staff turnover yet they still perform better.
Taking a child with 283 marks to Mang'u will not necessarily be of benefit. It might actually disorient him. If the kid is from a marginalized area, I think it's good to give them a chance whether they make it or not, at least a chance, otherwise we end up with a society that is skewed, not that it's not. But at least give chances to others kids who just happened to be born in certain conditions. Is a student from a private school in Bungoma East marginalised? Just check for Muranga high and see if it makes sense! Truth forever on the scaffold Wrong forever on the throne (James Russell Rowell)
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/17/2009 Posts: 3,583 Location: Kenya
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kaka2za wrote:National schools had 20,000 places yet only around 5,000 pupils had over 400 marks. Why not take all the 5,000 and apply affirmative action on the remaining 15,000 places? The kids choose the schools they wish to get admited to, and it has been mentioned the concentration is around a specific group of schools, this as has been discussed prior with the aid of 'algorithims'. the moment you introduce a subset in the filter, you limit the chances of a kid. the issue is, do you send kids to schools they did not choose, you would not be happy if your kid is dumped to a national school in manmandera that they did not choose.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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nakujua wrote:kaka2za wrote:National schools had 20,000 places yet only around 5,000 pupils had over 400 marks. Why not take all the 5,000 and apply affirmative action on the remaining 15,000 places? The kids choose the schools they wish to get admited to, and it has been mentioned the concentration is around a specific group of schools, this as has been discussed prior with the aid of 'algorithims'. the moment you introduce a subset in the filter, you limit the chances of a kid. the issue is, do you send kids to schools they did not choose, you would not be happy if your kid is dumped to a national school in manmandera that they did not choose. My niece did NOT choose to go to Elwak eish! I never knew such a school existed. That kid from a school in Embakassi did not select that day school in Bungoma "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore .
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/17/2009 Posts: 3,583 Location: Kenya
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kaka2za wrote:nakujua wrote:kaka2za wrote:It is a fact that some of the public primary schools are more expensive than private academies e.g Westlands,Utafiti and FairLawns. The rich will take more of the public schools and make them exclusive.
All the good teachers are in public schools and private encounter high staff turnover yet they still perform better.
Taking a child with 283 marks to Mang'u will not necessarily be of benefit. It might actually disorient him. If the kid is from a marginalized area, I think it's good to give them a chance whether they make it or not, at least a chance, otherwise we end up with a society that is skewed, not that it's not. But at least give chances to others kids who just happened to be born in certain conditions. Is a student from a private school in Bungoma East marginalised? Just check for Muranga high and see if it makes sense! I don't have the details, especially pertaining to the kids who had muranga as a choice for their national school, that would help define the situation. for national schools, every district get I think 6 chances, 3 boys and 3 girls, then there is the ratio of public vs private I think that is around 80:20 percent, then there is the schools a kid selected. so yes Bungoma east is given certain slots to fill.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/17/2009 Posts: 3,583 Location: Kenya
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murchr wrote:nakujua wrote:kaka2za wrote:National schools had 20,000 places yet only around 5,000 pupils had over 400 marks. Why not take all the 5,000 and apply affirmative action on the remaining 15,000 places? The kids choose the schools they wish to get admited to, and it has been mentioned the concentration is around a specific group of schools, this as has been discussed prior with the aid of 'algorithims'. the moment you introduce a subset in the filter, you limit the chances of a kid. the issue is, do you send kids to schools they did not choose, you would not be happy if your kid is dumped to a national school in manmandera that they did not choose. My niece did NOT choose to go to Elwak eish! I never knew such a school existed I am just giving the details of how the process happens, or is supposed to happen. I know there are such cases and one has an opportunity to seek redress in such situations, but for the sake of the current discussion, we are looking at what generally happens, in any process there will be errors and that's why there is an opportunity for redress. sorry for what happened to your niece, if that has been happening where kids are taken to schools they did not choose then that is wrong, the whole point of selecting schools is so that one is prepared.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/17/2009 Posts: 3,583 Location: Kenya
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Take the current scenario where around 5000 kids scored more than 400. on average each national school has a capacity of around 250, on the higher side, so to absorb all those kids we need roughly 20 national schools. now the problem comes about when the selection lists kick in, and most kids are concentrated around 10-15 prestigious national schools - I mean the kids who score more than 400, are confident that they can get admission to the said schools. the above scenario can easily lead to situation where you have 1000 + kids with more than 400 marks missing out on their preferred schools.
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Rank: New-farer Joined: 1/28/2015 Posts: 10
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nakujua wrote:Take the current scenario where around 5000 kids scored more than 400. on average each national school has a capacity of around 250, on the higher side, so to absorb all those kids we need roughly 20 national schools. now the problem comes about when the selection lists kick in, and most kids are concentrated around 10-15 prestigious national schools - I mean the kids who score more than 400, are confident that they can get admission to the said schools. the above scenario can easily lead to situation where you have 1000 + kids with more than 400 marks missing out on their preferred schools. I do not think affirmative action or dumb selection of schools is the cause for this mess. Kids from marginalized areas have been getting a boost for well over 25 yrs, and complaints have been negligible. And reasonable people generally agree that it is good policy. I know because I missed a chance to join Alliance many years ago. Nor is the mess due to poor selection of schools: many parents know how to hedge their odds, and for top performing students at least, headmasters and other more experienced teachers provide advice. Besides, there hasn't ever been this level of disenchantment. What we have here is a situation where a kid who scores less gets admitted to a more selective school than the one with higher scores - where both are from the VERY SAME primary school. It doesn't seem to be an socioeconomic equalizer sort-of-policy as it is also happening in rural public schools where everyone is struggling. I have no idea how the system was devised, but I think that if there is indeed a criteria, the ministry ought to disclose it. Otherwise we are left with a bizarre system where kids sit exams whose results may or may not be a factor in determining where they head afterwards.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 10/9/2006 Posts: 1,502
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The best solution to form 1 admission challenges is improving private secondary schools to top performers. Rich parents will have more options instead of complaining. work to prosper
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Rank: New-farer Joined: 1/28/2015 Posts: 10
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Tokyo wrote:The best solution to form 1 admission challenges is improving private secondary schools to top performers. Rich parents will have more options instead of complaining. I suppose you are not familiar with this matter. To bring yourself up to speed, you may want to read/watch news reports and see that the complaints are from both the rich and the poor. Or it might help if I explain why this issue interests me. Which is simply that my friend's daughter, whose family is quite poor, was admitted to a less selective school while her schoolmates, who she beat by more than 20 points, landed the prized letter to the likes of Alliance and Precious Blood, Riruta. People like us want to know the criteria used. It is evidently not financial ability. It is also not a hardship region/fertile region sort of balancing. And for what it is worth, it does not seem the usual tribal thing. One more point, it is needlessly arrogant to change the rules after the students have made their choices and sat the exams, and not care whatsoever about the aftermath.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/22/2009 Posts: 7,460
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Tokyo wrote:The best solution to form 1 admission challenges is improving private secondary schools to top performers. Rich parents will have more options instead of complaining. Kindly reads posts #96 and #106. This manenos of kids in private schools have "rich parents" is a lie repeated so much the people peddling it must have believed it by now! People should stop saying things they don't know. Talk to subordinate staff at your work place, mama mboga, your house help etc. and you will be surprised a good number of them have kids in some sort of private schools. It might not be the Riaras, Makini, Hillcrest and Msingi Boras of this world but a private school all the same - owned and operated by an individual. And they have not taken the kids there just for the sake or because they have heard people take kids to private schools. They have very good reasons. I once had a discussion with one who was really struggling to pay fees and advised them to shift their kids to public schools. They explained to me their reasons and I realised that if I was in their shoes I would do exactly what they were doing!! It does not matter if you pay 3k or 200k per term, as far as the government is concerned, your kid is in a private school. It doesn't matter if the school is in Karen or it is those informal schools in Mathare Valley, your kid is in a private school! Never count on making a good sale. Have the purchase price be so attractive that even a mediocre sale gives good returns.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/8/2013 Posts: 4,068 Location: At Large.
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This Kaimenyi and Co must be very Kichwa ngumu. How can there be such hue and cry and they are not saying a word. I suggest we take a week kirudio. 1.National schools are meant to give a National outlook.This can be gotten by dividing the 21000 slots equally with the 47 counties.This will give about 400 per county.Distribute the top 400 in every county in all National schools.This will take care of the marginalised areas. From there move to the next lot.Those with 350 +....distribute them in the next cadre of schools. And so on and so forth. Having said that we should be pushing the government to equip all schools to ensure they are all good. It is a fact all students cannot fit in Alliance but we can have several Alliances out there. Off to see Kimenyi....Kirudio....we are watching as things go wrong and doing nothing.Maybe we need to talk to Boniface to lead us in some demonstration. Love is beautiful and so are those who share it.With Love, Marriage is an amazing event in ones life time, the foundation of joy, happiness and success.
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