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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/19/2013 Posts: 2,552
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AlphDoti wrote:symbols wrote:Continue...
You can also include the two sons that Abraham had before Isaac was born. Hahahaha you're funny guy. Ati Abraham had other two sons before Isaac was born? So you already realized the issue ah! So why would Bible call Isaac ONLY SON  Anyway, let me continueHow long did Ismael stayed with his father as the only child?Genesis 17:24 - Abrahamu was circumcised at age of 90 together with his son Ishmaeli. Genesis 17:25 - Ishmael was 13 years old when both were circumcised Genesis 17:27 - God commanded Abraham that every male must be circumcised from then on. Then angels came to Abraham to deliver good news of another sonGenesis 18:9 - And he said, ...and lo, Sarah thy wife shall have a son. And Sarah heard it in the tent door, which was behind him Genesis 18:12 - Therefore Sarah laughed within herself, saying, After I am waxed old shall I have pleasure, my husband being old also? Genesis 18:12 - angel said "Is any thing too hard for the Lord?" It is not Abraham who made Sarah pregnant, but God enabled Sarah to conceiveGenesis 21:1 - And the Lord visited Sarah as he had said, and the Lord did unto Sarah as he had spoken. Genesis 21:2 - Sarah conceived, and bare Abraham a son in his old age, at the set time of which God had spoken to him. Genesis 21:3 - Abraham called the name of his son, Isaac. Ibrahim was 100 years old when Isaac was born. Ishmael was 14 years when Isaac was born.So, Isaac could not have been the ONLY CHILD, but the second one.I WILL CONTINUE... I'm just quoting at @guru267 and asking you to include it in your argument and verses. guru267 wrote:
You comprehend that when Isaac was born Abraham had two sons...
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/20/2008 Posts: 6,275 Location: Kenya
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symbols wrote:AlphDoti wrote:symbols wrote:Continue...
You can also include the two sons that Abraham had before Isaac was born. Hahahaha you're funny guy. Ati Abraham had other two sons before Isaac was born? So you already realized the issue ah! So why would Bible call Isaac ONLY SON Anyway, let me continueHow long did Ismael stayed with his father as the only child?Genesis 17:24 - Abrahamu was circumcised at age of 90 together with his son Ishmaeli. Genesis 17:25 - Ishmael was 13 years old when both were circumcised Genesis 17:27 - God commanded Abraham that every male must be circumcised from then on. Then angels came to Abraham to deliver good news of another sonGenesis 18:9 - And he said, ...and lo, Sarah thy wife shall have a son. And Sarah heard it in the tent door, which was behind him Genesis 18:12 - Therefore Sarah laughed within herself, saying, After I am waxed old shall I have pleasure, my husband being old also? Genesis 18:12 - angel said "Is any thing too hard for the Lord?" It is not Abraham who made Sarah pregnant, but God enabled Sarah to conceiveGenesis 21:1 - And the Lord visited Sarah as he had said, and the Lord did unto Sarah as he had spoken. Genesis 21:2 - Sarah conceived, and bare Abraham a son in his old age, at the set time of which God had spoken to him. Genesis 21:3 - Abraham called the name of his son, Isaac. Ibrahim was 100 years old when Isaac was born. Ishmael was 14 years when Isaac was born.So, Isaac could not have been the ONLY CHILD, but the second one.I WILL CONTINUE... I'm just quoting at @guru267 and asking you to include it in your argument and verses. guru267 wrote:
You comprehend that when Isaac was born Abraham had two sons...
I think you can see what the sentence means: "when Isaac was eventually born, Abraham now had two sons in total". So far so good. Let me continue...
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/20/2008 Posts: 6,275 Location: Kenya
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AlphDoti wrote:symbols wrote:AlphDoti wrote:symbols wrote:Continue...
You can also include the two sons that Abraham had before Isaac was born. Hahahaha you're funny guy. Ati Abraham had other two sons before Isaac was born? So you already realized the issue ah! So why would Bible call Isaac ONLY SON Anyway, let me continueHow long did Ismael stayed with his father as the only child?Genesis 17:24 - Abrahamu was circumcised at age of 90 together with his son Ishmaeli. Genesis 17:25 - Ishmael was 13 years old when both were circumcised Genesis 17:27 - God commanded Abraham that every male must be circumcised from then on. Then angels came to Abraham to deliver good news of another sonGenesis 18:9 - And he said, ...and lo, Sarah thy wife shall have a son. And Sarah heard it in the tent door, which was behind him Genesis 18:12 - Therefore Sarah laughed within herself, saying, After I am waxed old shall I have pleasure, my husband being old also? Genesis 18:12 - angel said "Is any thing too hard for the Lord?" It is not Abraham who made Sarah pregnant, but God enabled Sarah to conceiveGenesis 21:1 - And the Lord visited Sarah as he had said, and the Lord did unto Sarah as he had spoken. Genesis 21:2 - Sarah conceived, and bare Abraham a son in his old age, at the set time of which God had spoken to him. Genesis 21:3 - Abraham called the name of his son, Isaac. Ibrahim was 100 years old when Isaac was born. Ishmael was 14 years when Isaac was born.So, Isaac could not have been the ONLY CHILD, but the second one.I WILL CONTINUE... I'm just quoting at @guru267 and asking you to include it in your argument and verses. guru267 wrote:
You comprehend that when Isaac was born Abraham had two sons...
I think you can see what the sentence means: "when Isaac was eventually born, Abraham now had two sons in total". So far so good. Let me continue... So, Isaac could not have been the ONLY CHILD, but the second one. Let me show you whyIsaac started growing. And we know a child stops breastfeeding at around 2 years. Genesis 21:8 - And the child grew, and was weaned: and Abraham made a great feast the same day that Isaac was weaned. Genesis 21:9 - And Sarah saw the son of Hagar the Egyptian, which she had born unto Abraham, mocking Genesis 21:10 - Wherefore Sarah said unto Abraham, Cast out this slavewoman and her son. That means Isaac was 2 years, there was another child, Ishmael born of the slave woman!Genesis 21:13 - God told Abraham "And also of the son of the bondwoman will I make a nation, because he is thy seed" We see god telling Abraham I will bless your son Ishmael and make him a nation, because he's your seed! SO FAR I HAVE SHOWN: 1. Sarah didn't have a child for long 2. Worried about her old age without an heir, she asked her husband to have a child with her maid so that she may get progeny 3. At first, Abraham refused, and waited/chilled for another 10 years 4. After 10 years, Sarah gave him the maid Hagar to marry as his WIFE 5. He laid down with her and she conceived 7. Jealousy overcame Sarah, and Abraham took his second wife to Barshebah, his other plot 8. Shen the lad was 13 years he was circumcised with his father 9. Then God tested Abraham to sacrifice his only son 10. After sacrificing a sheep, Abraham and his ONLY SON and his assistance returned to Barsheba 11. Later angels visited Abraham and his first wife Sarah with promise of a son I WILL CONTINUE FROM HERE....
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/23/2008 Posts: 3,966
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@Alph, since you are quoting the bible, you should realize that at the time of the sacrifice, Ishmael had been sent away with Hagar, hence Abraham had only one son with him: Isaac. You do also realize that the reason Hagar was sent away was because Ishmael was making fun of Isaac (check your own post on Gen 21:8-9). Hence your point 11 is out of order. You are quoting the bible and using your goggles, because the quran doesn't mention hagar being sent away. Luck is when Preparation meets Opportunity. ~ Lucius Annaeus Seneca
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/19/2013 Posts: 2,552
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AlphDoti wrote:
SO FAR I HAVE SHOWN:
1. Sarah didn't have a child for long
Genesis 17:15-19 Sarai was to be called Sarah.She would be blessed with a son and would be a mother of nations.She would bear Abraham a son called Isaac and God would establish an everlasting covenant with him and his seed.The covenant is not with Ishmael. Quote:
2. Worried about her old age without an heir, she asked her husband to have a child with her maid so that she may get progeny
3. At first, Abraham refused, and waited/chilled for another 10 years
4. After 10 years, Sarah gave him the maid Hagar to marry as his WIFE
5. He laid down with her and she conceived
I've addressed that here. Quote:
7. Jealousy overcame Sarah, and Abraham took his second wife to Barshebah, his other plot
Concerning the second wife,first respond to the previous link. Ishmael dwelt in the wilderness of Paran.Genesis 21:21. Quote:
8. Shen the lad was 13 years he was circumcised with his father
Genesis 17 Quote:
9. Then God tested Abraham to sacrifice his only son
10. After sacrificing a sheep, Abraham and his ONLY SON and his assistance returned to Barsheba
11. Later angels visited Abraham and his first wife Sarah with promise of a son
@Jus Blazin has highlighted your goggles. She was visited in chapter 18. Birth of Isaac in chapter 21 then Ishmael and Hagar were sent away by Abraham. Chapter 22 is where God tested Abraham and the only son he had with him was Isaac.Isaac's age is not specified.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/20/2008 Posts: 6,275 Location: Kenya
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Jus Blazin wrote:@Alph, since you are quoting the bible, you should realize that at the time of the sacrifice, Ishmael had been sent away with Hagar, hence Abraham had only one son with him: Isaac. You do also realize that the reason Hagar was sent away was because Ishmael was making fun of Isaac (check your own post on Gen 21:8-9). Hence your point 11 is out of order. You are quoting the bible and using your goggles, because the quran doesn't mention hagar being sent away. @jb you're moving ahead. I'm coming to that  So when Isaac was weaned (check Genesis 21:8-10): Isaac 2 years Ismael 16 years Ibraham 102 years Sarah was jealous. She asked Ibraham to chase away Hagar. It's not God. Sarah said Ismael will not inherit. God had said Ismael will inherit, and God comforted Ibrahim. Genesis 21:14 - And Abraham rose up early in the morning, and took bread, and a bottle of water, and gave it unto Hagar, putting it on her shoulder, and the child, and sent her away: Genesis 21:14 - ..Hagar and child wandered in the wilderness of Beersheba Big question: can a woman carry on her shoulders a child of 16 years? Which child is being layed down, a baby or a 16 year old? Remember she went away to Barsheba. Who owned Barsheba? See below where Abraham took back his land Barsheba, which had been taken away by somebody Genesis 21:25 - And Abraham reproved Abimelech because of a well of water, which Abimelech's servants had violently taken away. NOW ANSWER ME @JB If you have two wives, a problem comes up, you take one wife to another land you own as a husband. Does that make her not your wife anymore?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 1/21/2010 Posts: 6,675 Location: Nairobi
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Jus Blazin wrote:@Alph, since you are quoting the bible, you should realize that at the time of the sacrifice, Ishmael had been sent away with Hagar, hence Abraham had only one son with him: Isaac. You do also realize that the reason Hagar was sent away was because Ishmael was making fun of Isaac (check your own post on Gen 21:8-9). Hence your point 11 is out of order. You are quoting the bible and using your goggles, because the quran doesn't mention hagar being sent away. @Jus Blazin please learn how to read... In that verse Sarah saw Isaac and Ishmael playing and she was filled with envy... Stop cooking things up.. Hagar was sent away because Sarah was jealous that Abraham had another son older than hers and he might love him more.. The Qur'an does acknowledge that Hagar was sent away so stop using guesswork and apply yourself! Abraham sent them away but he did not disown them... Otherwise why did God say he would bless Ishmael and why did both Ishmael and Isaac bury Abraham if Ishmael stopped being his son?????? #Think Mark 12:29
Deuteronomy 4:16
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/20/2008 Posts: 6,275 Location: Kenya
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symbols wrote:@Jus Blazin has highlighted your goggles.
She was visited in chapter 18.
Birth of Isaac in chapter 21 then Ishmael and Hagar were sent away by Abraham.
Chapter 22 is where God tested Abraham and the only son he had with him was Isaac.Isaac's age is not specified. Those with goggles are the ones accusing others Ishmael was there before IsaacGenesis 17:24 - Abraham was circumcised at age of 90 together with his son Ishmael. Genesis 17:25 - Ishmael was 13 years old when both were circumcised Birth of Isaac came laterGenesis 18:9 - And he said, ...and lo, Sarah thy wife shall have a son. Genesis 21:1 - And the Lord visited Sarah as he had said, and the Lord did unto Sarah as he had spoken. Genesis 21:2 - Sarah conceived, and bare Abraham a son Genesis 21:3 - Abraham called the name of his son, Isaac. Let me ask you questions:1. if you send away your wife to another plot you own, Barsheba, does she stop being your wife? 2. Explain why in Chapter 22 when God tested Abraham, the Bible says "the only son Isaac", yet there was another son Ishmael. We know the Bible says Ishmael and Isaac buried Abraham, when did Ishmael stopped being Abraham's son?
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/19/2009 Posts: 3,142
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Alphdoti,
I am glad to note you are discussing Abraham.
You do know I have unfinished business with you about Abraham, the boy and the sacrifice.
I will not let that matter rest no matter what you do.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/19/2013 Posts: 2,552
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AlphDoti wrote:symbols wrote:@Jus Blazin has highlighted your goggles.
She was visited in chapter 18.
Birth of Isaac in chapter 21 then Ishmael and Hagar were sent away by Abraham.
Chapter 22 is where God tested Abraham and the only son he had with him was Isaac.Isaac's age is not specified. Those with googles are the ones accusing others Ishmael was there before IsaacGenesis 17:24 - Abraham was circumcised at age of 90 together with his son Ishmael. Genesis 17:25 - Ishmael was 13 years old when both were circumcised Birth of Isaac came laterGenesis 18:9 - And he said, ...and lo, Sarah thy wife shall have a son. Genesis 21:1 - And the Lord visited Sarah as he had said, and the Lord did unto Sarah as he had spoken. Genesis 21:2 - Sarah conceived, and bare Abraham a son Genesis 21:3 - Abraham called the name of his son, Isaac. Let me ask you questions:1. if you send away your wife to another plot you own, Barsheba, does she stop being your wife? 2. Explain why in Chapter 22 when God tested Abraham, the Bible says "the only son Isaac", yet there was another son Ishmael. We know the Bible says Ishmael and Isaac buried Abraham, when did Ishmael stopped being Abraham's son? Genesis 17:24 wrote:And Abraham was ninety years old and nine, when he was circumcised in the flesh of his foreskin. 1. Ishmael and Hagar sent away.Which other plot and which wife?Genesis 16:2-3 wrote:And Sarai said unto Abram, Behold now, the Lord hath restrained me from bearing: I pray thee, go in unto my maid; it may be that I may obtain children by her. And Abram hearkened to the voice of Sarai.
3 And Sarai Abram's wife took Hagar her maid the Egyptian, after Abram had dwelt ten years in the land of Canaan, and gave her to her husband Abram to be his wife. Genesis 16:5 wrote:And the angel of the Lord said unto her, Return to thy mistress, and submit thyself under her hands Genesis 21:10 wrote: Wherefore she said unto Abraham, Cast out this bondwoman and her son: for the son of this bondwoman shall not be heir with my son, even with Isaac. Genesis 21:12 wrote:And God said unto Abraham, Let it not be grievous in thy sight because of the lad, and because of thy bondwoman; in all that Sarah hath said unto thee, hearken unto her voice; for in Isaac shall thy seed be called. Genesis 21:14 wrote: And Abraham rose up early in the morning, and took bread, and a bottle of water, and gave it unto Hagar, putting it on her shoulder, and the child, and sent her away: and she departed, and wandered in the wilderness of Beersheba. Genesis 21:21 wrote: And he dwelt in the wilderness of Paran: and his mother took him a wife out of the land of Egypt. 2. Isaac the promised son of the covenant after Ishmael was sent away.
Genesis 22:1 wrote: Some time later God tested Abraham... AlphDoti wrote:So we are going to analyze Abraham issue. Starting from a bit back genesis 12. So big question is which book is telling the truth? If you're looking for truth, you need to look closely.
Ecclesiastes 7:27 - Behold, this have I found, saith the preacher, counting one by one, to find out the account:
Lo, this only have I found, that God hath made man upright; but they have sought out many inventions. Ignoring the obvious to seek out your inventions?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/20/2008 Posts: 6,275 Location: Kenya
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Muriel wrote:Alphdoti,
I am glad to note you are discussing Abraham.
You do know I have unfinished business with you about Abraham, the boy and the sacrifice.
I will not let that matter rest no matter what you do.
I'm glad you are running after a non-issue when the elephant contradictions above are staring in your eyes 
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/19/2013 Posts: 2,552
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AlphDoti wrote:Muriel wrote:Alphdoti,
I am glad to note you are discussing Abraham.
You do know I have unfinished business with you about Abraham, the boy and the sacrifice.
I will not let that matter rest no matter what you do.
I'm glad you are running after a non-issue when the elephant contradictions above are staring in your eyes Quote the Quran where it says Ishmael was the child of sacrifice.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/20/2008 Posts: 6,275 Location: Kenya
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symbols wrote:AlphDoti wrote:symbols wrote:@Jus Blazin has highlighted your goggles.
She was visited in chapter 18.
Birth of Isaac in chapter 21 then Ishmael and Hagar were sent away by Abraham.
Chapter 22 is where God tested Abraham and the only son he had with him was Isaac.Isaac's age is not specified. Those with googles are the ones accusing others Ishmael was there before IsaacGenesis 17:24 - Abraham was circumcised at age of 90 together with his son Ishmael. Genesis 17:25 - Ishmael was 13 years old when both were circumcised Birth of Isaac came laterGenesis 18:9 - And he said, ...and lo, Sarah thy wife shall have a son. Genesis 21:1 - And the Lord visited Sarah as he had said, and the Lord did unto Sarah as he had spoken. Genesis 21:2 - Sarah conceived, and bare Abraham a son Genesis 21:3 - Abraham called the name of his son, Isaac. Let me ask you questions:1. if you send away your wife to another plot you own, Barsheba, does she stop being your wife? 2. Explain why in Chapter 22 when God tested Abraham, the Bible says "the only son Isaac", yet there was another son Ishmael. We know the Bible says Ishmael and Isaac buried Abraham, when did Ishmael stopped being Abraham's son? Genesis 17:24 wrote:And Abraham was ninety years old and nine, when he was circumcised in the flesh of his foreskin. 1. Ishmael and Hagar sent away.Which other plot and which wife?Genesis 16:2-3 wrote:And Sarai said unto Abram, Behold now, the Lord hath restrained me from bearing: I pray thee, go in unto my maid; it may be that I may obtain children by her. And Abram hearkened to the voice of Sarai.
3 And Sarai Abram's wife took Hagar her maid the Egyptian, after Abram had dwelt ten years in the land of Canaan, and gave her to her husband Abram to be his wife. Genesis 16:5 wrote:And the angel of the Lord said unto her, Return to thy mistress, and submit thyself under her hands Genesis 21:10 wrote: Wherefore she said unto Abraham, Cast out this bondwoman and her son: for the son of this bondwoman shall not be heir with my son, even with Isaac. Genesis 21:12 wrote:And God said unto Abraham, Let it not be grievous in thy sight because of the lad, and because of thy bondwoman; in all that Sarah hath said unto thee, hearken unto her voice; for in Isaac shall thy seed be called. Genesis 21:14 wrote: And Abraham rose up early in the morning, and took bread, and a bottle of water, and gave it unto Hagar, putting it on her shoulder, and the child, and sent her away: and she departed, and wandered in the wilderness of Beersheba. Genesis 21:21 wrote: And he dwelt in the wilderness of Paran: and his mother took him a wife out of the land of Egypt. 2. Isaac the promised son of the covenant after Ishmael was sent away.
Genesis 22:1 wrote: Some time later God tested Abraham... AlphDoti wrote:So we are going to analyze Abraham issue. Starting from a bit back genesis 12. So big question is which book is telling the truth? If you're looking for truth, you need to look closely.
Ecclesiastes 7:27 - Behold, this have I found, saith the preacher, counting one by one, to find out the account:
Lo, this only have I found, that God hath made man upright; but they have sought out many inventions. Ignoring the obvious to seek out your inventions? You're not able to answer to your inventions. I'm not the one who put those things in the Bible my friend
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/19/2009 Posts: 3,142
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AlphDoti wrote:Muriel wrote:Alphdoti,
I am glad to note you are discussing Abraham.
You do know I have unfinished business with you about Abraham, the boy and the sacrifice.
I will not let that matter rest no matter what you do.
I'm glad you are running after a non-issue when the elephant contradictions above are staring in your eyes Non-issue? The Qur'an is a non-issue? Well, well, well! Like brother has pre-empted one of the 'elephant contradictions' we must discuss is where in the Qur'an is Ishmael fingered to be boy we are talking about? You are quick to talk about the bible. I bring the Qur'an to this fight. The Qur'an and nothing but the Qur'an!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/19/2013 Posts: 2,552
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AlphDoti wrote:symbols wrote:AlphDoti wrote:symbols wrote:@Jus Blazin has highlighted your goggles.
She was visited in chapter 18.
Birth of Isaac in chapter 21 then Ishmael and Hagar were sent away by Abraham.
Chapter 22 is where God tested Abraham and the only son he had with him was Isaac.Isaac's age is not specified. Those with googles are the ones accusing others Ishmael was there before IsaacGenesis 17:24 - Abraham was circumcised at age of 90 together with his son Ishmael. Genesis 17:25 - Ishmael was 13 years old when both were circumcised Birth of Isaac came laterGenesis 18:9 - And he said, ...and lo, Sarah thy wife shall have a son. Genesis 21:1 - And the Lord visited Sarah as he had said, and the Lord did unto Sarah as he had spoken. Genesis 21:2 - Sarah conceived, and bare Abraham a son Genesis 21:3 - Abraham called the name of his son, Isaac. Let me ask you questions:1. if you send away your wife to another plot you own, Barsheba, does she stop being your wife? 2. Explain why in Chapter 22 when God tested Abraham, the Bible says "the only son Isaac", yet there was another son Ishmael. We know the Bible says Ishmael and Isaac buried Abraham, when did Ishmael stopped being Abraham's son? Genesis 17:24 wrote:And Abraham was ninety years old and nine, when he was circumcised in the flesh of his foreskin. 1. Ishmael and Hagar sent away.Which other plot and which wife?Genesis 16:2-3 wrote:And Sarai said unto Abram, Behold now, the Lord hath restrained me from bearing: I pray thee, go in unto my maid; it may be that I may obtain children by her. And Abram hearkened to the voice of Sarai.
3 And Sarai Abram's wife took Hagar her maid the Egyptian, after Abram had dwelt ten years in the land of Canaan, and gave her to her husband Abram to be his wife. Genesis 16:5 wrote:And the angel of the Lord said unto her, Return to thy mistress, and submit thyself under her hands Genesis 21:10 wrote: Wherefore she said unto Abraham, Cast out this bondwoman and her son: for the son of this bondwoman shall not be heir with my son, even with Isaac. Genesis 21:12 wrote:And God said unto Abraham, Let it not be grievous in thy sight because of the lad, and because of thy bondwoman; in all that Sarah hath said unto thee, hearken unto her voice; for in Isaac shall thy seed be called. Genesis 21:14 wrote: And Abraham rose up early in the morning, and took bread, and a bottle of water, and gave it unto Hagar, putting it on her shoulder, and the child, and sent her away: and she departed, and wandered in the wilderness of Beersheba. Genesis 21:21 wrote: And he dwelt in the wilderness of Paran: and his mother took him a wife out of the land of Egypt. 2. Isaac the promised son of the covenant after Ishmael was sent away.
Genesis 22:1 wrote: Some time later God tested Abraham... AlphDoti wrote:So we are going to analyze Abraham issue. Starting from a bit back genesis 12. So big question is which book is telling the truth? If you're looking for truth, you need to look closely.
Ecclesiastes 7:27 - Behold, this have I found, saith the preacher, counting one by one, to find out the account:
Lo, this only have I found, that God hath made man upright; but they have sought out many inventions. Ignoring the obvious to seek out your inventions? You're not able to answer to your inventions. I'm not the one who put those things in the Bible my friend I must be very old and wise if the Bible is my invention
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/20/2008 Posts: 6,275 Location: Kenya
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symbols wrote:AlphDoti wrote:symbols wrote:AlphDoti wrote:symbols wrote:@Jus Blazin has highlighted your goggles.
She was visited in chapter 18.
Birth of Isaac in chapter 21 then Ishmael and Hagar were sent away by Abraham.
Chapter 22 is where God tested Abraham and the only son he had with him was Isaac.Isaac's age is not specified. Those with googles are the ones accusing others Ishmael was there before IsaacGenesis 17:24 - Abraham was circumcised at age of 90 together with his son Ishmael. Genesis 17:25 - Ishmael was 13 years old when both were circumcised Birth of Isaac came laterGenesis 18:9 - And he said, ...and lo, Sarah thy wife shall have a son. Genesis 21:1 - And the Lord visited Sarah as he had said, and the Lord did unto Sarah as he had spoken. Genesis 21:2 - Sarah conceived, and bare Abraham a son Genesis 21:3 - Abraham called the name of his son, Isaac. Let me ask you questions:1. if you send away your wife to another plot you own, Barsheba, does she stop being your wife? 2. Explain why in Chapter 22 when God tested Abraham, the Bible says "the only son Isaac", yet there was another son Ishmael. We know the Bible says Ishmael and Isaac buried Abraham, when did Ishmael stopped being Abraham's son? Genesis 17:24 wrote:And Abraham was ninety years old and nine, when he was circumcised in the flesh of his foreskin. 1. Ishmael and Hagar sent away.Which other plot and which wife?Genesis 16:2-3 wrote:And Sarai said unto Abram, Behold now, the Lord hath restrained me from bearing: I pray thee, go in unto my maid; it may be that I may obtain children by her. And Abram hearkened to the voice of Sarai.
3 And Sarai Abram's wife took Hagar her maid the Egyptian, after Abram had dwelt ten years in the land of Canaan, and gave her to her husband Abram to be his wife. Genesis 16:5 wrote:And the angel of the Lord said unto her, Return to thy mistress, and submit thyself under her hands Genesis 21:10 wrote: Wherefore she said unto Abraham, Cast out this bondwoman and her son: for the son of this bondwoman shall not be heir with my son, even with Isaac. Genesis 21:12 wrote:And God said unto Abraham, Let it not be grievous in thy sight because of the lad, and because of thy bondwoman; in all that Sarah hath said unto thee, hearken unto her voice; for in Isaac shall thy seed be called. Genesis 21:14 wrote: And Abraham rose up early in the morning, and took bread, and a bottle of water, and gave it unto Hagar, putting it on her shoulder, and the child, and sent her away: and she departed, and wandered in the wilderness of Beersheba. Genesis 21:21 wrote: And he dwelt in the wilderness of Paran: and his mother took him a wife out of the land of Egypt. 2. Isaac the promised son of the covenant after Ishmael was sent away.
Genesis 22:1 wrote: Some time later God tested Abraham... AlphDoti wrote:So we are going to analyze Abraham issue. Starting from a bit back genesis 12. So big question is which book is telling the truth? If you're looking for truth, you need to look closely.
Ecclesiastes 7:27 - Behold, this have I found, saith the preacher, counting one by one, to find out the account:
Lo, this only have I found, that God hath made man upright; but they have sought out many inventions. Ignoring the obvious to seek out your inventions? You're not able to answer to your inventions. I'm not the one who put those things in the Bible my friend I must be very old and wise if the Bible is my invention So when did it become my invention? Ecclesiastes 7:27 call you "but they have sought out many inventions". " They" in his words refers to " those who follow inventions". That's you and those who don't want to see the truth.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/20/2008 Posts: 6,275 Location: Kenya
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Muriel wrote:AlphDoti wrote:Muriel wrote:Alphdoti,
I am glad to note you are discussing Abraham.
You do know I have unfinished business with you about Abraham, the boy and the sacrifice.
I will not let that matter rest no matter what you do.
I'm glad you are running after a non-issue when the elephant contradictions above are staring in your eyes Non-issue? The Qur'an is a non-issue? Well, well, well! Like brother has pre-empted one of the 'elephant contradictions' we must discuss is where in the Qur'an is Ishmael fingered to be boy we are talking about? You are quick to talk about the bible. I bring the Qur'an to this fight. The Qur'an and nothing but the Qur'an! Yes, non-issue. You'll never find any contradiction in the Quran. You'll never find any fault with Muhammad (sallallahu alayhi wa sallam). You'll only find envy and false accusations towards him. Even Some of the famous contemporary personalities who read the biography of the Messenger say Muhammad was a great man. And you'll never find any Muslim accuse any prophet of God all the way from Adam to Noah to Moses to David to Jesus to Muhammad (peace upon them all). We love and respect them all. BUT WE DON'T WORSHIP ANY PF THEM. It is only those who are ignorant who hate on Islam and the Messenger. They say small knowledge is very dangerous. And money and education makes one very arrogant and proud. That's why we have people like you who seek small non-issues while ignoring the big faults in their own beliefs.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/19/2013 Posts: 2,552
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AlphDoti wrote:Muriel wrote:AlphDoti wrote:Muriel wrote:Alphdoti,
I am glad to note you are discussing Abraham.
You do know I have unfinished business with you about Abraham, the boy and the sacrifice.
I will not let that matter rest no matter what you do.
I'm glad you are running after a non-issue when the elephant contradictions above are staring in your eyes Non-issue? The Qur'an is a non-issue? Well, well, well! Like brother has pre-empted one of the 'elephant contradictions' we must discuss is where in the Qur'an is Ishmael fingered to be boy we are talking about? You are quick to talk about the bible. I bring the Qur'an to this fight. The Qur'an and nothing but the Qur'an! Yes, non-issue. You'll never find any contradiction in the Quran. You'll never find any fault with Muhammad (sallallahu alayhi wa sallam). You'll only find envy and false accusations towards him. Even Some of the famous contemporary personalities who read the biography of the Messenger say Muhammad was a great man. And you'll never find any Muslim accuse any prophet of God all the way from Adam to Noah to Moses to David to Jesus to Muhammad (peace upon them all). We love and respect them all. BUT WE DON'T WORSHIP ANY PF THEM. It is only those who are ignorant who hate on Islam and the Messenger. They say small knowledge is very dangerous. And money and education makes one very arrogant and proud. That's why we have people like you who seek small non-issues while ignoring the big faults in their own beliefs. Start here and this ISIS Lists Out 5 Islamic Reasons to Justify Beheading Alan Henning and other Captivesand this The Quran's Verses of Violence
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/19/2009 Posts: 3,142
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AlphDoti wrote:
Yes, non-issue. You'll never find any contradiction in the Quran.
Leave that to me to find out for myself, will you? AlphDoti wrote:You'll never find any fault with Muhammad (sallallahu alayhi wa sallam). Still, leave that observation for me to make. I will if you answer my question. AlphDoti wrote:You'll only find envy and false accusations towards him. Let the evidence speak for itself, will you? AlphDoti wrote:Even Some of the famous contemporary personalities who read the biography of the Messenger say Muhammad was a great man. Only that I do not care what 'famous contemporary personalities' say about Mohammed because they do not read or think for me.
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/19/2009 Posts: 3,142
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AlphDoti wrote:And you'll never find any Muslim accuse any prophet of God all the way from Adam to Noah to Moses to David to Jesus to Muhammad (peace upon them all). Then let the muslims rise up to defend Mohammed and / or his teachings from these charges I bring against him and / or his teachings. AlphDoti wrote:We love and respect them all. BUT WE DON'T WORSHIP ANY PF THEM. What is 'worship'? Do you know 'worship'? Clearly you do not know worship. Worship is not only about bowing down facing Mecca. Its more than that. AlphDoti wrote:It is only those who are ignorant who hate on Islam and the Messenger. My 'hate' is well reasoned and intelligently articulated. But its not 'hate' in the true meaning of the word 'hate' but more of ,,,,,,,, examination.
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