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is it worth investing on rental flats?
kamaug
#61 Posted : Thursday, August 25, 2011 4:20:04 PM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 10/27/2010
Posts: 26
Location: NBI
Pablo wrote:
This is an argument that has been there since time in memorial.

Its all about your risk appetite.

Also without being too contraversial I can bet my A** that all those saying real estate is not worth it are likely to be below 35 or so and can only dream of Kshs. 10M. Those who have access to that type of cash am sure would jump to such an opportunity as GG has pointed out.

When I was younger I used to say why buy a house and pay an 85k mortguage while I could pay 30k for the same house and invest the rest in the stock exchange. By the way at that time my rented a 4br corner house with Sq in south C was being offered to me at 7M. Today its just unaffordable. Not only have i sank 6 yrs rent and did not buy stocks with the balance but also missed out on 8M capital gains. Mind you simmilar houses now rent for 60k.

So u choose.

you still would be paying for the house, and you will definately pay more than the asking 7m for it..
WTF
Cde Monomotapa
#62 Posted : Thursday, August 25, 2011 4:20:57 PM
Rank: Chief


Joined: 1/13/2011
Posts: 5,964
@GK. "The law is always good; just depends on which side of it you are on" ~ Cde Monomotapa a.k.a Wakili.
Mainat
#63 Posted : Thursday, August 25, 2011 4:40:08 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 11/21/2006
Posts: 1,590
Imho, buying flats especially now and particularly in high-end areas carries some risk of price falling.
Wacha kwanza if this proposed law change to allow more than 4 storeys comes into play...
Sehemu ndio nyumba
Genghis Khan
#64 Posted : Thursday, August 25, 2011 4:58:17 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 8/5/2010
Posts: 335
Location: Nairobi
Mainat wrote:
Imho, buying flats especially now and particularly in high-end areas carries some risk of price falling.
Wacha kwanza if this proposed law change to allow more than 4 storeys comes into play...

In times such as these harsh,
I would rather hold gold than cash,
Which gold does not decay with time.

And in times such as these bold,
I would rather hold property than gold,
Which property lets me take cash off others.
"I'd rather be lucky than clever... every time!" - ME
"The problem is not what we don't know... it's what we know for sure that just ain't!" - MARK TWAIN
"Space we can recover... time never!" - NAPOLEON BONAPARTE
abroaduni
#65 Posted : Friday, August 26, 2011 11:29:28 AM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 8/15/2011
Posts: 20
Location: denver
Hi,
I am going to start a new business in the canada.So,please suggest me some business tips,like which you said that invest less capital and earn more.

Waiting for your reply.

Thanks

canada visa

canada work permit
obiero
#66 Posted : Sunday, August 24, 2014 8:03:31 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 13,520
Location: nairobi
im thinking of developing a four storied flat in Nyanza

HF 90,000 ABP 3.83; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 23,800 ABP 6.45
Truebeauty
#67 Posted : Monday, August 25, 2014 7:51:20 AM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 1/16/2014
Posts: 25
And...??
ChumsQuest
#68 Posted : Thursday, August 28, 2014 9:18:26 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 1/24/2013
Posts: 325
Pablo wrote:
@Cde Monomotapa Its not personal.

90% of you younger guys will fall into this. I put this here for your benefit.

Thanks @Pablo. I guess what you are saying is, secure income flow in real estate, leave the rest to play...
Rahatupu
#69 Posted : Monday, September 01, 2014 11:29:11 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 12/4/2009
Posts: 1,982
Location: matano manne
obiero wrote:
im thinking of developing a four storied flat in Nyanza
,

@Obiero, bet you mean Kisumu. Go go for it!
mahongap
#70 Posted : Thursday, September 18, 2014 5:36:44 PM
Rank: Hello


Joined: 9/12/2014
Posts: 4
Both investments needs knowledge, whether buying shares, buying rental property or building flats.
I'm in both but rental business is the best long term and all wealthy guys are in this business.
What Genghis Khan wrote is worth reading twice or even three times.
May be to add, ten you have 10M you buy a plot that has title deed and put a flat. Asssuming the cost of the plot is 2m and the flat is 8m with monthly rental income of KKshs 70,000.
You can confortably take another loan of 10M buy a plot and put another





sparkly
#71 Posted : Thursday, September 18, 2014 6:00:39 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 9/23/2009
Posts: 8,083
Location: Enk are Nyirobi
obiero wrote:
im thinking of developing a four storied flat in Nyanza



Stop thinking and just do it! smile
Life is short. Live passionately.
icecube
#72 Posted : Thursday, September 18, 2014 6:50:29 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 1/2/2008
Posts: 268
Location: Nairobi
popat wrote:
Not forgetting the inherent risk in holding liquid assets such as stock.You can wake up one day and your 10m is worth shs.10.In real estates unless a natural calamity takes place such as tshunami(which can be covered via insurance)the trend is always upwards.

Dahatre
#73 Posted : Friday, September 19, 2014 7:21:19 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 12/21/2009
Posts: 602
Easily the best thread/quote on Wazua
Genghis Khan wrote:

WWGKD?

1. I would build the damn thing for 10m in a company name. The assumption here is that i had 10m in cash. I wouldn't get a bank loan @ 14%plus for such a project.

2. I would sell my car for 1.5m. I would then buy a company car for a similar amount and let the "employees/tenants" work to make the repayments. I would also get a post paid fuel card, and charge the company for any service, insurance etc.

3. If this is not yet 100k, I would find yet another way of expensing the income before KRA gets to it.

4. Every cent of the company money I spend, I invest (from my other income). It can be in the same company as "new capital from shareholders" or just in my personal CDS / savings account doesn't really matter as long as I DON'T spend it as well.

You can pay as low a tax as you are smart, just be careful to do it LEGALLY, consult a lawyer if u have to. KRA guys are not kind to smart people.

The Principal here is to spend and invest before you are taxed.

Companies pay taxes on profits (Income less expense), natural persons pay taxes on Gross Income. All tax systems are flawed this way.

The taxman will audit you but all you have to do is justify the expenses.

You can even buy airtime before paying taxes if u are smart enough.

Even booze for "clients"...

The only substantial amount of money i make in my own name is my salo which is taxed at sourceSad

wanyee
#74 Posted : Friday, September 19, 2014 9:31:54 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 7/17/2011
Posts: 627
Location: Mbui-Nzau, Kikumbulyu
Dahatre wrote:
Easily the best thread/quote on Wazua
Genghis Khan wrote:


WWGKD?

1. I would build the damn thing for 10m in a company name. The assumption here is that i had 10m in cash. I wouldn't get a bank loan @ 14%plus for such a project.

2. I would sell my car for 1.5m. I would then buy a company car for a similar amount and let the "employees/tenants" work to make the repayments. I would also get a post paid fuel card, and charge the company for any service, insurance etc.

3. If this is not yet 100k, I would find yet another way of expensing the income before KRA gets to it.

4. Every cent of the company money I spend, I invest (from my other income). It can be in the same company as "new capital from shareholders" or just in my personal CDS / savings account doesn't really matter as long as I DON'T spend it as well.

You can pay as low a tax as you are smart, just be careful to do it LEGALLY, consult a lawyer if u have to. KRA guys are not kind to smart people.

The Principal here is to spend and invest before you are taxed.

Companies pay taxes on profits (Income less expense), natural persons pay taxes on Gross Income. All tax systems are flawed this way.

The taxman will audit you but all you have to do is justify the expenses.

You can even buy airtime before paying taxes if u are smart enough.

Even booze for "clients"...

The only substantial amount of money i make in my own name is my salo which is taxed at sourceSad


Applause Applause Applause Applause Applause Brilliant!! hats off. If you attend the Wazuan's meeting i would like to meet you in person. If you have insights on nominee shareholding and examples of how tax beneficial it can be , i would like your insights too.
propertyvaluer
#75 Posted : Monday, September 22, 2014 4:38:32 PM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 5/28/2014
Posts: 20
Location: Nairobi
The maths do not add up here pretty well. You mean investing 10 million to earn 100k, what sort of property is that? whats the cost of land in this scenario?
Wendz
#76 Posted : Friday, September 26, 2014 5:40:43 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/19/2008
Posts: 4,268
propertyvaluer wrote:
The maths do not add up here pretty well. You mean investing 10 million to earn 100k, what sort of property is that? whats the cost of land in this scenario?


a block of 2 bedroomed flats (8) in total (4 ground and 4 first floor) on an 8th plot of land..... my thinking..
jerry
#77 Posted : Friday, September 26, 2014 6:25:32 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 9/29/2006
Posts: 2,570
Wendz wrote:
propertyvaluer wrote:
The maths do not add up here pretty well. You mean investing 10 million to earn 100k, what sort of property is that? whats the cost of land in this scenario?


a block of 2 bedroomed flats (8) in total (4 ground and 4 first floor) on an 8th plot of land..... my thinking..

Cost of land not answered!
The opposite of courage is not cowardice, it's conformity.
propertyvaluer
#78 Posted : Friday, September 26, 2014 11:45:06 PM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 5/28/2014
Posts: 20
Location: Nairobi
@Wendz,

Lets make several assumptions here: first, one 2-bedroom unit will be about 70 square meters, so in total you are intending to build a total area of ( 70 square meters X 8 Units X 10.74 = 6010 square feet) lets also assume that they are not so excellently furnished so we adopt a construction rate of Kshs.2500 per square foot. This brings the total cost of construction (less the cost of land) to Kshs.2500 X 6010 square feet = 15 million!!

@Wendz, this is a rough estimate of constructing the units that you have mentioned above. Sasa add on top of that the cost of land, just estimate it at 5 million and you get 20 million value for your investment!!

However, depending with the location and nature of finishes, the income could be anywhere between 120k-150k per month!!
Rahatupu
#79 Posted : Tuesday, September 30, 2014 8:39:11 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 12/4/2009
Posts: 1,982
Location: matano manne
propertyvaluer wrote:
@Wendz,

Lets make several assumptions here: first, one 2-bedroom unit will be about 70 square meters, so in total you are intending to build a total area of ( 70 square meters X 8 Units X 10.74 = 6010 square feet) lets also assume that they are not so excellently furnished so we adopt a construction rate of Kshs.2500 per square foot. This brings the total cost of construction (less the cost of land) to Kshs.2500 X 6010 square feet = 15 million!!

@Wendz, this is a rough estimate of constructing the units that you have mentioned above. Sasa add on top of that the cost of land, just estimate it at 5 million and you get 20 million value for your investment!!

However, depending with the location and nature of finishes, the income could be anywhere between 120k-150k per month!!
.

@...valuer, too optimistic. The location of the flats would have to be excellent (high end) where preference for top quality finishes is a selling point. Two the amount at hand for entire investment is 10m.
a4architect.com
#80 Posted : Tuesday, September 30, 2014 9:28:42 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 1/4/2010
Posts: 1,668
Location: nairobi
120k per month for 8 units works out to kes 15k monthly rent per unit. This is a realistic estimate for kes 2,500 per sq ft construction quality.
As Iron Sharpens Iron, So one Man Sharpens Another.
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