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Our thugs are getting bolder by the day.
simonkabz
#81 Posted : Wednesday, August 27, 2014 5:18:06 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/2/2007
Posts: 8,776
Location: Cameroon
Alba wrote:
simonkabz wrote:



You are the kind who throw around big words like unemployment sijui corrupt govt missing the crux of the matter by a kilometre. Any youth wielding a gun should be shot on sight.

FYI, there is more poverty in TZ and Ethiopia, not much crime to write home about. Your twisted theory evaporates pap! They have worse governments in all honesty, worse systems!

If our culture is the one producing criminals, shoot them dead till kingdom come! Mambo ya sirikali oh unemployment you can whine till the end of the world, they will never end. Ata huko kwenu kwa kina Kiash we see the stats. To pick a gun to go n steal is purely by CHOICE, apana tetea hawa watu.




This is such nonsense. We have been shooting thieves dead for the last 20 years and has it reduced crime.

I mean seriously tell us. has shooting thugs dead reduced crime ?

No crime keeps increasing as we shoot thugs on a daily basis. The reason is that we are not addressing the root causes of crime.

I have already explained above that Ethiopia and Tanzania do not have a culture of crime. But Kenya and South Africa do.

I believe it has something to do with the fact that the first president of Tanzania, Nyerere created a culture where stealing and ammassing huge wealth was not acceptable nor expected.

In Kenya we have the opposite situation. Our presidents have all created a culture where public officials routinely steal. In fact our leaders look down on public officials who dont enrich themselves by stealing. This behaviour eventually trickles down to the youth.


Care to explain how that culture is CREATED so that we can coerce Jubilee to start creating one immediately? And how was the second part enforced? Giving thugs a massage?
TULIA.........UFUNZWE!
maka
#82 Posted : Wednesday, August 27, 2014 5:18:40 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
urstill1 wrote:
Alba wrote:
Angelica _ann wrote:
@Alba which Kenyan policians would we have elected who is not a thief? In one way or the other all were thieves including Dida?



Thats exactly the point. We should have higher standards. In Kenya the standard for being elected to most posts is to be a tribal chief.

If we voted on issues, it would be possible for a person to win based on track record and ideas. In 2008 Obama was elected mostly based on his ideas. he was a nobody as recently as 2006. But people liked his ideas. Thats why Africa is a black hole. Our priorities are twisted.

It will take a massive cultural shift. But it must start somewhere. Or else this is a wasted generation of tribalism.


Utaongoja sana that cultural shift.


So in short we will never have good leadership in Kenya,free from corruption...
possunt quia posse videntur
simonkabz
#83 Posted : Wednesday, August 27, 2014 5:22:35 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/2/2007
Posts: 8,776
Location: Cameroon
maka wrote:
urstill1 wrote:
Alba wrote:
Angelica _ann wrote:
@Alba which Kenyan policians would we have elected who is not a thief? In one way or the other all were thieves including Dida?



Thats exactly the point. We should have higher standards. In Kenya the standard for being elected to most posts is to be a tribal chief.

If we voted on issues, it would be possible for a person to win based on track record and ideas. In 2008 Obama was elected mostly based on his ideas. he was a nobody as recently as 2006. But people liked his ideas. Thats why Africa is a black hole. Our priorities are twisted.

It will take a massive cultural shift. But it must start somewhere. Or else this is a wasted generation of tribalism.


Utaongoja sana that cultural shift.


So in short we will never have good leadership in Kenya,free from corruption...

The very culture that makes a kenyan highly competitive amongst peers from our neighborhood gives us the undesired side-effect of greedy youth. There will be no culture shift, unless he wants us to be as lazy and sleepy as the Tanzanians.
TULIA.........UFUNZWE!
urstill1
#84 Posted : Wednesday, August 27, 2014 5:26:22 PM
Rank: User


Joined: 9/6/2013
Posts: 1,446
Location: In a house
Alba wrote:
urstill1 wrote:
Alba wrote:
Angelica _ann wrote:
@Alba which Kenyan policians would we have elected who is not a thief? In one way or the other all were thieves including Dida?



Thats exactly the point. We should have higher standards. In Kenya the standard for being elected to most posts is to be a tribal chief.

If we voted on issues, it would be possible for a person to win based on track record and ideas. In 2008 Obama was elected mostly based on his ideas. he was a nobody as recently as 2006. But people liked his ideas. Thats why Africa is a black hole. Our priorities are twisted.

It will take a massive cultural shift. But it must start somewhere. Or else this is a wasted generation of tribalism.


Utaongoja sana that cultural shift.


Thats why I said "wasted generation".

I dont expect it to happen soon. Maybe not even in my lifetime. But if Kenya is ever lucky to find a transformative charismatic, brave leader like Lyndon Johnson (see the civil rights movement) then maybe.

It will take a leader with no ties to past governments who is dedicated to eradicating corruption. A leader who has never benefited from thievery.


No ties to the past govt! Our tycoons are tied to past govts and are either the campaign 'funders' or candidates themselves. The sad bit is, they keep multiplying their wealth. Only a well protected and strong willed leader will change all these. Otherwise, change of culture will be a pipe dream. It doesn't matter what kind of infrastructure we put up.
urstill1
#85 Posted : Wednesday, August 27, 2014 5:29:26 PM
Rank: User


Joined: 9/6/2013
Posts: 1,446
Location: In a house
maka wrote:
urstill1 wrote:
Alba wrote:
Angelica _ann wrote:
@Alba which Kenyan policians would we have elected who is not a thief? In one way or the other all were thieves including Dida?



Thats exactly the point. We should have higher standards. In Kenya the standard for being elected to most posts is to be a tribal chief.

If we voted on issues, it would be possible for a person to win based on track record and ideas. In 2008 Obama was elected mostly based on his ideas. he was a nobody as recently as 2006. But people liked his ideas. Thats why Africa is a black hole. Our priorities are twisted.

It will take a massive cultural shift. But it must start somewhere. Or else this is a wasted generation of tribalism.


Utaongoja sana that cultural shift.


So in short we will never have good leadership in Kenya,free from corruption...


As long as a majority of the populace make their voting decisions based on what politicians say, we'll never have culture shift.
simonkabz
#86 Posted : Wednesday, August 27, 2014 5:34:18 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/2/2007
Posts: 8,776
Location: Cameroon
urstill1 wrote:
maka wrote:
urstill1 wrote:
Alba wrote:
Angelica _ann wrote:
@Alba which Kenyan policians would we have elected who is not a thief? In one way or the other all were thieves including Dida?



Thats exactly the point. We should have higher standards. In Kenya the standard for being elected to most posts is to be a tribal chief.

If we voted on issues, it would be possible for a person to win based on track record and ideas. In 2008 Obama was elected mostly based on his ideas. he was a nobody as recently as 2006. But people liked his ideas. Thats why Africa is a black hole. Our priorities are twisted.

It will take a massive cultural shift. But it must start somewhere. Or else this is a wasted generation of tribalism.


Utaongoja sana that cultural shift.


So in short we will never have good leadership in Kenya,free from corruption...


As long as a majority of the populace make their voting decisions based on what politicians say, we'll never have culture shift.

Democracy! People get what they deserve. They get the leader they want.
TULIA.........UFUNZWE!
murchr
#87 Posted : Wednesday, August 27, 2014 5:35:46 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 2/26/2012
Posts: 15,980
Which country do you live in alba where there are no thieves
"There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
.
simonkabz
#88 Posted : Wednesday, August 27, 2014 6:02:09 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/2/2007
Posts: 8,776
Location: Cameroon
murchr wrote:
Which country do you live in alba where there are no thieves

He lives with Kiash and Corporal Kirk
TULIA.........UFUNZWE!
harrydre
#89 Posted : Wednesday, August 27, 2014 6:35:54 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/10/2008
Posts: 9,131
Location: Kanjo
Impunity wrote:
FRM2011 wrote:
Impunity wrote:
2012 wrote:
These guys look like cops. Have you noticed how the guy is not even bothered to look behind like he so sure that nothing is coming?


They should be arrested and get executed at Nyayo stadium, all citizen should be given guns too. We should be a gun-country; no thug will attempt such stupid action if they knew you were also armed.


@impunity am with you on this one 105%. I have a number of friends who are licensed and they do jua Kali business where they turnover millions everyday. They carry the cash in a very reckless way. Picture a guy walking out of a bank with 3m cash in a paper bag.

Now in the last ten years, no robbery attempt has ever been made on these guys. Kumbe word goes out even to the thugs.

When I become chumed enough, I am getting one. 300k is all it costs for everything.


We should not even be talking about pistols, but M16s and above, carry it openly and it will serve as a deterrent.
Kila mtu ajitafutie.

ION: In UG hakuna hizi petty robberies of business premises coz all askari kangas have guns, hata kama ni 1930s hunting riffles they still send fear in to the veins of these infidels.

Shame on you Shame on you


This is a delicate situation that needs a lot of thought before being implemented. Things like road rage would have people shooting each other like chickens esp mathree drivers!
i.am.back!!!!
Impunity
#90 Posted : Wednesday, August 27, 2014 7:07:52 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/2/2009
Posts: 26,328
Location: Masada
harrydre wrote:
Impunity wrote:
FRM2011 wrote:
Impunity wrote:
2012 wrote:
These guys look like cops. Have you noticed how the guy is not even bothered to look behind like he so sure that nothing is coming?


They should be arrested and get executed at Nyayo stadium, all citizen should be given guns too. We should be a gun-country; no thug will attempt such stupid action if they knew you were also armed.


@impunity am with you on this one 105%. I have a number of friends who are licensed and they do jua Kali business where they turnover millions everyday. They carry the cash in a very reckless way. Picture a guy walking out of a bank with 3m cash in a paper bag.

Now in the last ten years, no robbery attempt has ever been made on these guys. Kumbe word goes out even to the thugs.

When I become chumed enough, I am getting one. 300k is all it costs for everything.


We should not even be talking about pistols, but M16s and above, carry it openly and it will serve as a deterrent.
Kila mtu ajitafutie.

ION: In UG hakuna hizi petty robberies of business premises coz all askari kangas have guns, hata kama ni 1930s hunting riffles they still send fear in to the veins of these infidels.

Shame on you Shame on you


This is a delicate situation that needs a lot of thought before being implemented. Things like road rage would have people shooting each other like chickens esp mathree drivers!


Initially people will kill each at a higher rate then it will settle as discipline will finally find its way.
Portfolio: Sold
You know you've made it when you get a parking space for your yatcht.

mawinder
#91 Posted : Wednesday, August 27, 2014 7:09:33 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/30/2008
Posts: 6,029
urstill1 wrote:
Alba wrote:
Angelica _ann wrote:
@Alba which Kenyan policians would we have elected who is not a thief? In one way or the other all were thieves including Dida?



Thats exactly the point. We should have higher standards. In Kenya the standard for being elected to most posts is to be a tribal chief.

If we voted on issues, it would be possible for a person to win based on track record and ideas. In 2008 Obama was elected mostly based on his ideas. he was a nobody as recently as 2006. But people liked his ideas. Thats why Africa is a black hole. Our priorities are twisted.

It will take a massive cultural shift. But it must start somewhere. Or else this is a wasted generation of tribalism.


Utaongoja sana that cultural shift.

Kwanza from the people @King G's signature described as thieves!!!!!!!!!!!
Alba
#92 Posted : Wednesday, August 27, 2014 7:39:03 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/27/2012
Posts: 2,256
Location: Bandalungwa
simonkabz wrote:


Care to explain how that culture is CREATED so that we can coerce Jubilee to start creating one immediately? And how was the second part enforced? Giving thugs a massage?


Please read your history

In Kenya, kenyatta not only grabbed land and wealth, he actually laughed at those who did not participate in the looting such as Bildad Kaggia. Then he expelled, jailed, assisinated and demonized those who spoke out againt looting.

In tanzania, Nyerere did the exact opposite. For starters, when he retired, his monthly salary was the equivalent of KES 5000 which is what secretaries were making in Kenya at the time.

Nyerere discouraged amassing huge amounts of wealth. He stressed sharing aka UJAMAA.



Look Moi did nothing to address corruption and insecurity and he won two elections. Kibaki never did anything to address any issues and he still received unequivocal blind support based on tribe. This is why Kenya is in such a mess.

I am not saying we should coerce jubilee into anything. We need to vote for people based on how they address important issues. What Kenyans ought to do is judge the current government based on how they resolve these pressing issues. If they do not address these issues then lets vote for a different person such as any of the governors whose work is shining or any other leaders. .

Ideally What we need in Kenya is a leader who has not participated or benefited from looting. One who will set an example by taking a strong no-nonsense stance against corruption and the kitu kidogo culture. One who actually jails people who engage in corruption. This way he sets an example for the youth. But fighting corruption also enhances job creation.

The standard had an article about how corruption kills job creation

read it here
http://www.the-star.co.k...job-corruption-annually

If we aggressively tackle job creation, many youth will have opportunities and not resort to crime.

Since corruption is killing job creation, we need to be voting for candidates who might actually fight corruption aggressively.

Above all we need to vote for leaders based on what they can do to address critical issues like unemployment, insecurity. Kenyans do not do such things.

So when you vote tribally, dont act surprised when muggings and carjackings make life hell for Kenyans,
murchr
#93 Posted : Wednesday, August 27, 2014 7:57:19 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 2/26/2012
Posts: 15,980
Even the most developed country in this world has maggings, robberies and corruption incidences because all that is brought about by GREED. Every tribal chieftan is waiting to get into Gov so that they can steal "for their people" so that attitude of serikali saidia, tunaomba serikali bla bla should get out of our heads. The reason you go to sch is so that you become something, not to wait to be employed worse still by the Gov.
"There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
.
tycho
#94 Posted : Wednesday, August 27, 2014 8:00:25 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
@Alba, I find the best place to look isn't simply the leadership, but in the institutions meant to help the state reflect and develop intelligence. For example, in a country like America issues related to improvement and development have already been a subject of much research and development under diverse disciplines. And one such discipline has been in systems science, and especially as articulated by writers like Churchman West. In an interesting book titled 'Challenge to reason' he shows how systems can be scientifically understood and actions optimized accordingly. Such systems can spur the needed cultural shift.

In an environment like ours, scientific research and implementation needs entrepreneurial thinking by private citizens and corporations. So like in this case there are opportunities to create wealth from the very challenges posed by unemployment,crime, and corruption.

PeterReborn
#95 Posted : Wednesday, August 27, 2014 8:02:39 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 1/3/2014
Posts: 1,063
urstill1 wrote:

Police shoot suspected thugs in Gigiri
Consistency is better than intensity
mkenyan
#96 Posted : Wednesday, August 27, 2014 8:20:03 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 4/1/2009
Posts: 1,883
simonkabz wrote:
littledove wrote:

you are damned if you dont have and you are more damned if you have one because they wount threaten you and then steal, they will gun you down and with accuracy because they know if they miss they are dead, there are some cases i know where suspected gun owners are short dead either for the gun or before robbery while those who dont have guns are just ordered to lie down, hijacked or tied before robbery.


You hit it, though owning a gun should be a very private/secret affair.

How about armoured cars? Is it still being done in Nairobi?

can try the bmw security, security plus or high security.
Alba
#97 Posted : Wednesday, August 27, 2014 11:28:54 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/27/2012
Posts: 2,256
Location: Bandalungwa
murchr wrote:
Even the most developed country in this world has maggings, robberies and corruption incidences because all that is brought about by GREED. Every tribal chieftan is waiting to get into Gov so that they can steal "for their people" so that attitude of serikali saidia, tunaomba serikali bla bla should get out of our heads. The reason you go to sch is so that you become something, not to wait to be employed worse still by the Gov.



The difference is that in developed countries, they have enough common sense to see that there is a direct correlation between unemployment and crime. So if a president or a governor does nothing to address unemployment, he does not get voted back in. Thats why they have unemployment rates as low as 5% and the crime rate is super generally low in developed countries.

In Kenya we do the exact opposite. Every single president we have had has encouraged corruption among his cronies or done nothing to prevent it. And of late they've done little to address unemployment and crime. They know they can get away with this because at election time, their job performance does not matter to Kenyans. What matters is tribal alliances.

What I am saying is that if you want crime to stop spiraling out of control then cease this blind support for leaders just because they happen to be from your tribe. Make them realize that unless crime rates starts to come down, you will stay at home and not vote. Vote on issues and not tribe and before you know it, leaders will become more accountable.

I mean really. Do you want to live the rest of your life worried sick about whether you family members will come home safe ? Is having a member of your tribe as prezzi more important than peace of mind ?

And that stuff you posted about being employed by the govt has nothing to do with the issue at hand so I did not address it.
murchr
#98 Posted : Wednesday, August 27, 2014 11:56:48 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 2/26/2012
Posts: 15,980
Alba wrote:
murchr wrote:
Even the most developed country in this world has maggings, robberies and corruption incidences because all that is brought about by GREED. Every tribal chieftan is waiting to get into Gov so that they can steal "for their people" so that attitude of serikali saidia, tunaomba serikali bla bla should get out of our heads. The reason you go to sch is so that you become something, not to wait to be employed worse still by the Gov.



The difference is that in developed countries, they have enough common sense to see that there is a direct correlation between unemployment and crime. So if a president or a governor does nothing to address unemployment, he does not get voted back in. Thats why they have unemployment rates as low as 5% and the crime rate is super generally low in developed countries.

In Kenya we do the exact opposite. Every single president we have had has encouraged corruption among his cronies or done nothing to prevent it. And of late they've done little to address unemployment and crime. They know they can get away with this because at election time, their job performance does not matter to Kenyans. What matters is tribal alliances.

What I am saying is that if you want crime to stop spiraling out of control then cease this blind support for leaders just because they happen to be from your tribe. Make them realize that unless crime rates starts to come down, you will stay at home and not vote. Vote on issues and not tribe and before you know it, leaders will become more accountable.

I mean really. Do you want to live the rest of your life worried sick about whether you family members will come home safe ? Is having a member of your tribe as prezzi more important than peace of mind ?

And that stuff you posted about being employed by the govt has nothing to do with the issue at hand so I did not address it.


People do not steal because they are unemployed. Otherwise our political thieves would never do it.

Am never worried about my family, they will live as long as fate has it, my great grand pa lived over 100 yrs, my grandpa is heading to 100 and life is not more riskier now than it was some years ago so please, cut us some slack with your long vibe and live life. Even huko majuu they die daily.
"There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
.
simonkabz
#99 Posted : Thursday, August 28, 2014 12:24:40 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/2/2007
Posts: 8,776
Location: Cameroon
murchr wrote:
Alba wrote:
murchr wrote:
Even the most developed country in this world has maggings, robberies and corruption incidences because all that is brought about by GREED. Every tribal chieftan is waiting to get into Gov so that they can steal "for their people" so that attitude of serikali saidia, tunaomba serikali bla bla should get out of our heads. The reason you go to sch is so that you become something, not to wait to be employed worse still by the Gov.



The difference is that in developed countries, they have enough common sense to see that there is a direct correlation between unemployment and crime. So if a president or a governor does nothing to address unemployment, he does not get voted back in. Thats why they have unemployment rates as low as 5% and the crime rate is super generally low in developed countries.

In Kenya we do the exact opposite. Every single president we have had has encouraged corruption among his cronies or done nothing to prevent it. And of late they've done little to address unemployment and crime. They know they can get away with this because at election time, their job performance does not matter to Kenyans. What matters is tribal alliances.

What I am saying is that if you want crime to stop spiraling out of control then cease this blind support for leaders just because they happen to be from your tribe. Make them realize that unless crime rates starts to come down, you will stay at home and not vote. Vote on issues and not tribe and before you know it, leaders will become more accountable.

I mean really. Do you want to live the rest of your life worried sick about whether you family members will come home safe ? Is having a member of your tribe as prezzi more important than peace of mind ?

And that stuff you posted about being employed by the govt has nothing to do with the issue at hand so I did not address it.


People do not steal because they are unemployed. Otherwise our political thieves would never do it.

Am never worried about my family, they will live as long as fate has it, my great grand pa lived over 100 yrs, my grandpa is heading to 100 and life is not more riskier now than it was some years ago so please, cut us some slack with your long vibe and live life. Even huko majuu they die daily.


he he he hizi lecture za bw. alba si zinaboo yaani! He is insulting a majority of Kenyans for making their own democratic choices.......I never voted for the current regime but im more than happy with their efforts of making Kenya better. Stop hating Kenyans for following the stupid western democracy, we owe you nothing really.

*Not even a single post of HOW the govt should create this employment that is making a few youths go bonkers, not one!
TULIA.........UFUNZWE!
wa P
#100 Posted : Thursday, August 28, 2014 9:42:22 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 5/26/2009
Posts: 326
Location: Nairobi

*Not even a single post of HOW the govt should create this employment that is making a few youths go bonkers, not one! [/quote]


It is not the government. It is the guy you see in the mirror.

'to those the gods want to destroy, they first make them think that someone owes them something'.

'...and to those that gods want to prosper, they first make them know that nobody owes you anything.'

How are jobs created? through enterprise; or industries.

Which industries? manufacturing, trading or services.

How? Kabz sets up a factory to make...toothpaste. He employs chemists to mix paste. Since he needs packaging material, Muriel puts up a packaging material manufacturing plant to serve the demand = more jobs. Toothpaste need to be distributed: Alma buys a few trucks and employs couple of drivers and loaders to deliver to Njung'e's supermarket chain where thousands are employed.

So, why are we not doing it? We used to. Think about that toothpaste (allegedly with carcinogens). They were doing all that in Kenya once upon a time. Then they figured, 'why should we create jobs for Kenyans while we can make them buy imports?'. So they moved factory to climes that deserve 'employment'. We supported them.

What do we do? Suppose we consume only what is locally made? You say - not good quality. We switch to the next locally made alternative (think airtel and safcom).

The local manufacturer is from the other tribe. Yes he is; and his son is seeing your daughter. They may get married soon. He is neighbors with your mother in Buru and he recently saved the house from burning. Some people grow up and sober up, others would rather buy from the Brazilian whose son is seeing the Chinese. We need to increase the population of 'grown ups'.

How? A strong consumer movement. We interrogate what we consume, we force local manufacturers to improve processes and quality. We make supermarkets to stock 80% Kenyan-made brands. We show middle finger to anyone who expatriates jobs and want to sell their stuff to us.

The movement starts... NOW. Wazua Admin shall be forced to start a consumer portal (can replace politics).

Trust me, we do not need politicians, or government, or governors to start a strong consumer movement.
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