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Women in Iran taking off the Hijab
McReggae
#31 Posted : Wednesday, May 14, 2014 3:58:17 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 6/17/2008
Posts: 23,365
Location: Nairobi
quicksand wrote:
AlphDoti wrote:
Mtu Biz wrote:
@alphdoti

Islam is in agreement with the creation account in Genesis right ?

Was there anything wrong with adam and eve being naked in the garden of eden as per God's original design ?

Please answer yes or no to the first question.

Thanks.

Are Muslim women the only ones who cover their hair? No, this is a common misconception. Is it true that Islam is the only religion whose most women follow its teachings to cover their hair? Mostly yes. Is it true that Islam is the only religion to have such instructions? No.

1. Mary mother of Jesus wore the hijab (peace be upon them both)
2. the nuns practice hijab for the same reason as the devout Muslim woman

So no need for me to go into long debate about it.

The simple answer is here! Open your Bible 1 Corinthians 11:3-10:
"...every woman praying or prophesying with her head uncovered disgraces her head.."
"...let her cover her head.."

The big question is: Do any Christian women today cover their heads?
They do not, and many don't even believe in the teachings of the Bible against pre-marital sex, adultery and others

Meeeh. Most people don't care. You are too focused with what Christians do and don't do - what their Bible says or doesn't say. The important thing is this: Kenya is a secular state. A person's freedoms should be inviolate, as long as they are not breaking the law. A person should be free to reject God. An individual and God is a personal, private thing. The God of Christianity gives the person the choice to follow the righteous path or not - a path not encumbered with rituals and rules but one of the heart, as per the New Testament. This point, my friend, you seem to miss entirely. For the same reason, I find governing countries by religious laws to be absurd. Where this happens, the order dominated by men, presumed to know what women, or what women think. Deviation is met by harsh punishment. If you ever visit Garissa you will see Muslim men jump women on queues in banks etc etc ....it is quite surprising.
So,..@Alph ...you are just another man. You are part of a system that pretends it knows what women want, feel or think, suppresses them, does not allow them free, unfettered speech. It is why these Iranian women protest. Because they feel oppressed.


Here here!!!
..."Wewe ni mtu mdogo sana....na mwenye amekuandika pia ni mtu mdogo sana!".
tycho
#32 Posted : Wednesday, May 14, 2014 4:17:51 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi

@AlphDoti, which of the two chicken won't end on the dinner plate?

Clearly, your conception of a woman, necessarily robs her of freedom. Otherwise the analogy you've provided wouldn't be.

Mtu Biz
#33 Posted : Wednesday, May 14, 2014 4:30:06 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 1/16/2007
Posts: 1,320
AlphDoti wrote:
Mtu Biz wrote:
@alphdoti

Islam is in agreement with the creation account in Genesis right ?

Was there anything wrong with adam and eve being naked in the garden of eden as per God's original design ?

Please answer yes or no to the first question.

Thanks.

Are Muslim women the only ones who cover their hair? No, this is a common misconception. Is it true that Islam is the only religion whose most women follow its teachings to cover their hair? Mostly yes. Is it true that Islam is the only religion to have such instructions? No.

1. Mary mother of Jesus wore the hijab (peace be upon them both)
2. the nuns practice hijab for the same reason as the devout Muslim woman

So no need for me to go into long debate about it.

The simple answer is here! Open your Bible 1 Corinthians 11:3-10:
"...every woman praying or prophesying with her head uncovered disgraces her head.."
"...let her cover her head.."

The big question is: Do any Christian women today cover their heads?
They do not, and many don't even believe in the teachings of the Bible against pre-marital sex, adultery and others


Ok?

Lets take this again... answer the first part yes or no.

Iam very suprised that you have quoted and show solidarity with Paul's first letter to the corinthians!

But please step by step.. answer my question, im driving at something.
Sola Scriptura


Lolest!
#34 Posted : Wednesday, May 14, 2014 4:46:20 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 3/18/2011
Posts: 12,069
Location: Kianjokoma
rryyzz wrote:

My thinking is that it was the culture and traditions of that society that women cover their hair. Nothing to do with religion per se.

exactly @rryzz!! Some guys have refused to go beyond the reason why things are the way they are in religions. Most of it is cultural and shoukd apply in certain contexts only!

Thus, with the spread of religions, the converts are expected to copy everything from the religion's primary culture-even dressing!! Imagine dressing in a Kanzu in scandinavian countries jus coz you're MuslimShame on you
Laughing out loudly smile Applause d'oh! Sad Drool Liar Shame on you Pray
AlphDoti
#35 Posted : Wednesday, May 14, 2014 5:32:15 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 6/20/2008
Posts: 6,275
Location: Kenya
quicksand wrote:
AlphDoti wrote:
Mtu Biz wrote:
@alphdoti

Islam is in agreement with the creation account in Genesis right ?

Was there anything wrong with adam and eve being naked in the garden of eden as per God's original design ?

Please answer yes or no to the first question.

Thanks.

Are Muslim women the only ones who cover their hair? No, this is a common misconception. Is it true that Islam is the only religion whose most women follow its teachings to cover their hair? Mostly yes. Is it true that Islam is the only religion to have such instructions? No.

1. Mary mother of Jesus wore the hijab (peace be upon them both)
2. the nuns practice hijab for the same reason as the devout Muslim woman

So no need for me to go into long debate about it.

The simple answer is here! Open your Bible 1 Corinthians 11:3-10:
"...every woman praying or prophesying with her head uncovered disgraces her head.."
"...let her cover her head.."

The big question is: Do any Christian women today cover their heads?
They do not, and many don't even believe in the teachings of the Bible against pre-marital sex, adultery and others

Meeeh. Most people don't care. You are too focused with what Christians do and don't do - what their Bible says or doesn't say. The important thing is this: Kenya is a secular state. A person's freedoms should be inviolate, as long as they are not breaking the law. A person should be free to reject God. An individual and God is a personal, private thing. The God of Christianity gives the person the choice to follow the righteous path or not - a path not encumbered with rituals and rules but one of the heart, as per the New Testament. This point, my friend, you seem to miss entirely. For the same reason, I find governing countries by religious laws to be absurd. Where this happens, the order dominated by men, presumed to know what women, or what women think. Deviation is met by harsh punishment. If you ever visit Garissa you will see Muslim men jump women on queues in banks etc etc ....it is quite surprising.
So,..@Alph ...you are just another man. You are part of a system that pretends it knows what women want, feel or think, suppresses them, does not allow them free, unfettered speech. It is why these Iranian women protest. Because they feel oppressed.

@quicksand yeah I agree in Christianity, they don't really believe that the Bible is the word of God. Everything is there for adornment for beautification. Even going to church is show. Because why pretend to go to church yet you will live your own life anyway!

Things that Jesus (pbuh) said, or God said, no Christian is prepared to pay attention or follow or do that.

And now you want our women to remove their clothes. So that you can say, now we are equal?
AlphDoti
#36 Posted : Wednesday, May 14, 2014 5:40:16 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 6/20/2008
Posts: 6,275
Location: Kenya
Lolest! wrote:
rryyzz wrote:

My thinking is that it was the culture and traditions of that society that women cover their hair. Nothing to do with religion per se.

exactly @rryzz!! Some guys have refused to go beyond the reason why things are the way they are in religions. Most of it is cultural and shoukd apply in certain contexts only!

Thus, with the spread of religions, the converts are expected to copy everything from the religion's primary culture-even dressing!! Imagine dressing in a Kanzu in scandinavian countries jus coz you're MuslimShame on you

@rryyzz hijab is not culture. Covering the whole face is not Islamic. But covering the hair is islamic.

@Lolesness wearing kanzu is not Islamic. So I don't know why you bring up issue of scandinavian countries. Ignorance again?
Mtu Biz
#37 Posted : Wednesday, May 14, 2014 6:25:14 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 1/16/2007
Posts: 1,320
@alhdoti

Hautanijibu happ juu?

Sola Scriptura


AlphDoti
#38 Posted : Wednesday, May 14, 2014 6:40:04 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 6/20/2008
Posts: 6,275
Location: Kenya
Mtu Biz wrote:
@alhdoti

Hautanijibu happ juu?

@Mtu Biz you asked me whether "Islam is in agreement with the creation account in Genesis right?" Yes, in agreement to a large extent.

Then you asked me "Was there anything wrong with adam and eve being naked in the garden of eden as per God's original design?". I will answer this as follows. Please pay attention to my response.

Quran sura Ta Ha chapter 20:121 says:
In the result, they both ate of the tree, and so their nakedness appeared(see explanation below) to them: they began to sew together, for their covering, leaves from the Garden: thus did Adam disobey his Lord, and allow himself to be seduced.

Explanation
After they were created, they were naked, they were clothed in the "outfit" of innocence and knew no evil, just like babies. Now, when disobedience to God had damaged the purity of their soul and torn off the garment of their innocence, their damaged self appeared to themselves in all its nakedness and ugliness, and they had to resort to external things (leaves of the Garden) to cover the shame of their self-consciousness.

Swenani
#39 Posted : Wednesday, May 14, 2014 7:06:48 PM
Rank: User

Joined: 8/15/2013
Posts: 13,237
Location: Vacuum
Religious fanatics, are you listening to BBC radio?
If Obiero did it, Who Am I?
quicksand
#40 Posted : Wednesday, May 14, 2014 7:24:13 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 7/5/2010
Posts: 2,061
Location: Nairobi
AlphDoti wrote:
quicksand wrote:
AlphDoti wrote:
Mtu Biz wrote:
@alphdoti

Islam is in agreement with the creation account in Genesis right ?

Was there anything wrong with adam and eve being naked in the garden of eden as per God's original design ?

Please answer yes or no to the first question.

Thanks.

Are Muslim women the only ones who cover their hair? No, this is a common misconception. Is it true that Islam is the only religion whose most women follow its teachings to cover their hair? Mostly yes. Is it true that Islam is the only religion to have such instructions? No.

1. Mary mother of Jesus wore the hijab (peace be upon them both)
2. the nuns practice hijab for the same reason as the devout Muslim woman

So no need for me to go into long debate about it.

The simple answer is here! Open your Bible 1 Corinthians 11:3-10:
"...every woman praying or prophesying with her head uncovered disgraces her head.."
"...let her cover her head.."

The big question is: Do any Christian women today cover their heads?
They do not, and many don't even believe in the teachings of the Bible against pre-marital sex, adultery and others

Meeeh. Most people don't care. You are too focused with what Christians do and don't do - what their Bible says or doesn't say. The important thing is this: Kenya is a secular state. A person's freedoms should be inviolate, as long as they are not breaking the law. A person should be free to reject God. An individual and God is a personal, private thing. The God of Christianity gives the person the choice to follow the righteous path or not - a path not encumbered with rituals and rules but one of the heart, as per the New Testament. This point, my friend, you seem to miss entirely. For the same reason, I find governing countries by religious laws to be absurd. Where this happens, the order dominated by men, presumed to know what women, or what women think. Deviation is met by harsh punishment. If you ever visit Garissa you will see Muslim men jump women on queues in banks etc etc ....it is quite surprising.
So,..@Alph ...you are just another man. You are part of a system that pretends it knows what women want, feel or think, suppresses them, does not allow them free, unfettered speech. It is why these Iranian women protest. Because they feel oppressed.

@quicksand yeah I agree in Christianity, they don't really believe that the Bible is the word of God. Everything is there for adornment for beautification. Even going to church is show. Because why pretend to go to church yet you will live your own life anyway!

Things that Jesus (pbuh) said, or God said, no Christian is prepared to pay attention or follow or do that.

And now you want our women to remove their clothes. So that you can say, now we are equal?

Really,..all Christians then? There are no pious ones?
Yes,..we have bent and crooked Christians,..those who sell fake miracles and collect money from naive followers. This is not denied by anyone here, in fact you will find a few threads bashing some pastors. People sinning is not a fault of the religion itself. Muslims themselves sin quite often right here in Kenya because this state does not allow self-righteous , misguided men to go berserk and start whipping people for such mundane things as not wearing religious sanctioned clothes. The importance of separating state and religion

Anyhow, you will find that Christians have little interest in your women undressing. It is Muslim women who are undressing! The Iranians who started the FB page are Muslim, are they not? Instead of trying to explain or investigate the essence of this simple but powerful fact, you are trying to drown it in a tirade against Christianity.
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