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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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@Mtu biz, I have no appetite for a truce with you. Draw out your sword, sir.
Only let the trophy be truth, and the supremacy of heaven, where relations are mutual and free.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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What would happen if both knowledge and facts were relative and subjective? And that in such a case, knowledge of facts is possible?
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 1/16/2007 Posts: 1,320
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tycho wrote:@Mtu biz, I have no appetite for a truce with you. Draw out your sword, sir.
Only let the trophy be truth, and the supremacy of heaven, where relations are mutual and free.  So be it!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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symbols wrote:tycho wrote:Muriel, is the statement that there are absolutes, logical?
I believe it's not. Why? It can't be negated without self contradiction. 'There are no absolutes' is equivalent to 'there are absolutes'. Hence both of these statements are logically useless but useful in a political and ideal sense.
Talk about absolutes is a refusal to talk and coexist due to selfish political interest. If both statements are useless,then what is your point? If both are logically useless then it means there's no conversation yet. Only a defense of personal taste and preference.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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Mtu Biz wrote:tycho wrote:@Mtu biz, I have no appetite for a truce with you. Draw out your sword, sir.
Only let the trophy be truth, and the supremacy of heaven, where relations are mutual and free. So be it! Or you surrender the city.
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/19/2009 Posts: 3,142
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danas10 wrote:Muriel wrote:I want to disagree with Danas position that knowledge is subjective. Not knowing a fact does not change or negate that fact. It still remains as fact. For example, the fallacy of 'no absolutes' remains whether my matatu driver knows it or not.
Opinion, on the other hand, is subjective and fluid. Knowledge is objective and constant.
Opinion about knowledge changes with advance. Absolute is absolute. From known to unknown. Not knowing the known is indeed knowing nothing. Death. Life comes with knowing. @Muriel, am basing my reasoning on the understanding that there is a difference between facts and knowledge. Facts are absolutes and not all facts constitute knowledge. E.g. the fact that you said you are a man does not constitute my knowledge that you are a "man"  So long as absolutes exist I am fine with that, Danas. For example knowledge of truth, an absolute & a fact, brings life & freedom. But this absolute & fact does not constitute the body of knowledge that an individual necessarily has. So I now agree. Hiyo story ingine mimi niliwacha ,,,,,, Brother, conversation can still take place even with the logically useless - the absolutes. This is proof.
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/19/2009 Posts: 3,142
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tycho wrote:What would happen if both knowledge and facts were relative and subjective? And that in such a case, knowledge of facts is possible?
You are late. Danas and I have already agreed that facts and knowledge are different and that facts are absolutes. We have not left room for speculation.
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/19/2009 Posts: 3,142
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tycho wrote:Mtu Biz wrote:tycho wrote:@Mtu biz, I have no appetite for a truce with you. Draw out your sword, sir.
Only let the trophy be truth, and the supremacy of heaven, where relations are mutual and free. So be it! Or you surrender the city. Reminisce. How brother and I started. When I was still 'new'.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/19/2013 Posts: 2,552
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tycho wrote:symbols wrote:tycho wrote:symbols wrote:Who can escape life? You remind me of a haiku. What are the clouds but an excuse for the sky? What is death, but an escape from life? P.s. @quicksand, am coming. Death is something you encounter in life but who has escaped life? Symbols, 'who' implies 'life'. So you're asking if life can escape from itself. It's not a question that you're asking. But what is it? No one can defeat life.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/19/2013 Posts: 2,552
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Muriel wrote:tycho wrote:What would happen if both knowledge and facts were relative and subjective? And that in such a case, knowledge of facts is possible?
You are late. Danas and I have already agreed that facts and knowledge are different and that facts are absolutes. We have not left room for speculation. I think you're both right but that presents a challenge.We can look at the same object from different sides and have facts and knowledge yet they both remain relative and subjective to our respective positions.The absolute would be the object.
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