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Co-operative Bank Kenya 2.6bn insider trading scandal
Gathige
#31 Posted : Monday, December 09, 2013 12:37:53 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 3/29/2011
Posts: 2,242
Bachuma Gate wrote:
The truth of the matter is that the MD, Directors and senior staff borrowed from the bank and bought shares BEFORE the IPO. It is a against the law to lend money for purchase of your own shares.

1.The fact is they bought shares before the IPO, before the share split and at different price than the IPO price. The fact that they did this knowing that the bank would be doing an IPO is what is called insider trading.

2. The rest of the staff bought during the IPO. This what you would call ESOP.

If you are a member of a co-op that is a shareholder of the bank, just know that you are the one who was played games otherwise who owns coops? It is you and me.

Ask yourself how came the rest of the staff did not make hundreds of millions yet they were also made to borrow and buy the shares.
The trick was with the share split. Anyone who had one share, was given 100.

This is how it was done

1. Before the IPO allocate each of yourself lots of shares. MD gets say 680,000 shares. OTC price was between shs60 and 80. So he borrows says 50m from the bank and buys the shares. Pls note that the share were acquired before the IPO. They never bought them during the IPO.

2. Carry a share split of 1:100. So he ends up with 68,000,000 shares.

3. AT the IPO with a price of 9.50. The man is already worth 646,000,000.00. At the current price of 18 the man is worth 1.2b.

4. The rest of the staff are made to buy the shares at IPO. So say a staff buys same number of shares as the MD. 680,000 shares. IPO price 9.50. Therefore 680,000*9.50=6.4m. At the current price, the follow is worth 680,000*18=12.2m. I hope the clever guys here can see the connection between the 12.2m and the 1.2b. IT IS THE SHARE SPLIT BEFORE THE IPO.


The same game was played at CIC. Just check their financials and see how many shares the Co-op MD and CIC MD. That is why Co-op Bank has heavily invested in CIC more than other co-ops because of this monkey business.

As for the coffee written-off thing, the evidence is there. IT will come out one day.

The thing about the media not covering the story out of compromise; The former MDs PA knows how he was able to achieve this all along.

And in a clearly choreographed move; Ruto's wife is give 5 million by the bank the other day for her foundation. Basically continue buying protection. And nothing will happen to you. Let people make noise.



@Bachuma Gate, Quite insightful. My coop ( name withheld) made made almost 100m after the listing. The "owners" as u have noted made much more. Hii Kenya ina wenyewe kweli.
"Things that matter most must never be at the mercy of things that matter least." Goethe
bird_man
#32 Posted : Monday, December 09, 2013 12:54:44 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 11/2/2006
Posts: 1,206
Location: Nairobi
@Bachuma Gate ..... I am not defending anyone but please explain to me whats illegal about an MD taking a loan of say 50M to buy shares of the company before IPO?
I also bought CIC shares before listing & on listing at the NSE I made about 5 times what I had borrowed.
Formally employed people often live their employers' dream & forget about their own.
Bachuma Gate
#33 Posted : Monday, December 09, 2013 1:04:03 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 3/26/2012
Posts: 280
bird_man wrote:
@Bachuma Gate ..... I am not defending anyone but please explain to me whats illegal about an MD taking a loan of say 50M to buy shares of the company before IPO?
I also bought CIC shares before listing & on listing at the NSE I made about 5 times what I had borrowed.


He is only allowed to borrow from another organization. Not from company that is raising the capital. CBK banking Regulations.

The issue about insider info is that they had prior knowledge. Clearly even the decision to split of 1:100 was done by them knowing how it favour them.
DOH
FRM2011
#34 Posted : Monday, December 09, 2013 1:05:31 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 11/5/2010
Posts: 2,459
Let me first declare my interest in this matter. I made a tidy sum from the listing of coop shares. I also made a tidy sum with equity listing in 2006, ditto CIC in 2010.

It works in a very straightforward manner. A private company's AGM authorises the mgt to pursue listing at the nse. For both equity and coop we went to the villages and offered a premium from the existing individual shareholders. For coop we were offering between 300 to 500 Bob per share. Majority of the shareholders were holding 50 shares of class B shares only. For equity, I have a friend whose life was transformed instantly.

For CIC, the public was invited to participate in the private placement. Many bought because it had been stated clearly that the company would be listed at a future date.

Now @siringi and others are using very strong words to refer to people who made their money during the coop IPO.

The public knew the bank would be listed. The bank's shareholders authorised the creation of additional shares to be allotted to the top mgt as an ESOP. ALL THIS INFO WAS IN THE IM. Nobody is even mentioning that the IM had clearly indicated that these shares would be locked for at least two years after the IPO.

@siringi et.all, I don't think its right to hide under the web to besmirch people's characters.
King G
#35 Posted : Monday, December 09, 2013 1:09:49 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 6/20/2012
Posts: 3,855
Location: Othumo
Bachuma Gate wrote:
bird_man wrote:
@Bachuma Gate ..... I am not defending anyone but please explain to me whats illegal about an MD taking a loan of say 50M to buy shares of the company before IPO?
I also bought CIC shares before listing & on listing at the NSE I made about 5 times what I had borrowed.


He is only allowed to borrow from another organization. Not from company that is raising the capital. CBK banking Regulations.


And by the way the loans were held in central accounts and treated as advances. processing was centralised in finance but this things still leak. Anyway all in all he has made money through these deals.
Thieves
Bachuma Gate
#36 Posted : Monday, December 09, 2013 1:13:16 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 3/26/2012
Posts: 280
FRM2011 wrote:
Let me first declare my interest in this matter. I made a tidy sum from the listing of coop shares. I also made a tidy sum with equity listing in 2006, ditto CIC in 2010.

It works in a very straightforward manner. A private company's AGM authorises the mgt to pursue listing at the nse. For both equity and coop we went to the villages and offered a premium from the existing individual shareholders. For coop we were offering between 300 to 500 Bob per share. Majority of the shareholders were holding 50 shares of class B shares only. For equity, I have a friend whose life was transformed instantly.

For CIC, the public was invited to participate in the private placement. Many bought because it had been stated clearly that the company would be listed at a future date.

Now @siringi and others are using very strong words to refer to people who made their money during the coop IPO.

The public knew the bank would be listed. The bank's shareholders authorised the creation of additional shares to be allotted to the top mgt as an ESOP. ALL THIS INFO WAS IN THE IM. Nobody is even mentioning that the IM had clearly indicated that these shares would be locked for at least two years after the IPO.

@siringi et.all, I don't think its right to hide under the web to besmirch people's characters.


My question is " Did they buy the shares during the IPO or before?" Second was any other member of public able to buy similar number of shares freely before the IPO if he wanted. Third what was the need for the IPO if people could buy shares before the IPO. Finally Where did the over 70m shares originate from before IPO.? There was no private placement at Coop.
DOH
bird_man
#37 Posted : Monday, December 09, 2013 1:18:57 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 11/2/2006
Posts: 1,206
Location: Nairobi
Bachuma Gate wrote:
bird_man wrote:
@Bachuma Gate ..... I am not defending anyone but please explain to me whats illegal about an MD taking a loan of say 50M to buy shares of the company before IPO?
I also bought CIC shares before listing & on listing at the NSE I made about 5 times what I had borrowed.


He is only allowed to borrow from another organization. Not from company that is raising the capital. CBK banking Regulations.

The issue about insider info is that they had prior knowledge. Clearly even the decision to split of 1:100 was done by them knowing how it favour them.


Please paste that CBK Banking Regulation nijionee.

You might take 50M loan & at IPO you make a serious loss.It can happen.So there is no insider trading there since everyone (who cared to know) knew there would be an IPO soon, employees & directors I guess could buy freely (they took a leap of faith).

If I had borrowed 50M for CIC placement I'd have 0.25Billion.....unfortunately I only invested 150K.Should I be charged with insider trading as well?I know kawaida Coop Bank employees who made 9times what they spent back then.Why not charge them too?
Formally employed people often live their employers' dream & forget about their own.
Bachuma Gate
#38 Posted : Monday, December 09, 2013 1:23:38 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 3/26/2012
Posts: 280
bird_man wrote:
Bachuma Gate wrote:
bird_man wrote:
@Bachuma Gate ..... I am not defending anyone but please explain to me whats illegal about an MD taking a loan of say 50M to buy shares of the company before IPO?
I also bought CIC shares before listing & on listing at the NSE I made about 5 times what I had borrowed.


He is only allowed to borrow from another organization. Not from company that is raising the capital. CBK banking Regulations.

The issue about insider info is that they had prior knowledge. Clearly even the decision to split of 1:100 was done by them knowing how it favour them.


Please paste that CBK Banking Regulation nijionee.
Boss you might take 50M loan & at IPO you make a serious loss.It can happen.So there is no insider trading there since everyone (who cared to know) knew there would be an IPO soon & the terms.Please search CIC listing here on Wazua.

If I had borrowed 50M for CIC placement I'd have 0.25Billion.....unfortunately I only invested 150K.Should I be charged with insider trading as well?


About CBK rule you can google.

The point is that if this was allowed; A company that needed to raise capital would simply borrow from itself other than go to the public.
DOH
mukiha
#39 Posted : Monday, December 09, 2013 1:26:56 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 6/27/2008
Posts: 4,114
Suppose you buy a cow at sh20,000. The following day I come and steal it, slaughtered it and sell the meat for Sh50,000.

What amount would you sue me for: 20k or 50k?

You know that this MARS report is propaganda because of its focus on the 50k instead of the 20k!!
Nothing is real unless it can be named; nothing has value unless it can be sold; money is worthless unless you spend it.
mukiha
#40 Posted : Monday, December 09, 2013 1:32:53 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 6/27/2008
Posts: 4,114
obiero wrote:
murchr wrote:
the deal wrote:
murchr wrote:
the deal wrote:
Mega fraud...unbelievable the same thiefs are still running the bank...what else are this thiefs hiding? but this is Kenya mega corruption must be a way of life now....look at responses above LMAO.


Instead of LYAO why dont you explain to these Kenyans how this is "Insider Trading", who these
"thieves" stole from and why the responses here don't make sense. Make sure you furnish us with evidence apart from these "reports" from Mwalimu Mati who thinks everyone is a thief (probably he'd call you one too)


1. By logging in here...I will assume you are literate.

2. So go and read the report...the report is clear on the issues you have raised above...why should I recite something that somebody has already raised?

3. After reading the report...google what an ESOP is? And what is insider trading? You will get your answers.

4. I will ask you again...did you read the report? The english is simple & plain...the evidence is well laid out.

5. I seriously dont understand your argument...I think you are the type who argue for the sake of arguing....rather the word FOOL is appropriate LOL.




I may be a FOOL as you call me but am not gullible These IPO happened more than 5 years ago and i know Kenyans are not stupid tho may be I am. In the case of mobitelea (safaricom) Kenyans asked questions. Its clear you are not able to answer my questions and you'd rather engage in insults (just like the most "drunk" man in the market). My friend you have alot to learn about Kenya dont get over excited when yu see reports from Mars group. They do this for a living.

Yenyewe mobitelea was worse


In the case of Mobitelea, Kenyans did not lose a single cent! It was not a scandal!

Mobitelea did not own any shares in SCOM! It was a partner with Vodafone PLC in Vodafone Kenya. Vodafone Kenya owns a part of SCOM. When the IPO was done, the Vodafone Kenya shares did NOT come into the equation at all!!

If anyone was justified to complain about Mobitelea, it would have been Vodafone PLC, but as it was, they weren't! To me, it was a case of "pilipili usio ila, yakuwashiani?"

Another propaganda battle between politicians!
Nothing is real unless it can be named; nothing has value unless it can be sold; money is worthless unless you spend it.
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