They are not my theories, I simply rephrased them. Please read up on consonant drift, there is plenty online.

As for the Agikuyu and the Kamba, I refer you to Professor Godfrey Muriuki's work and, partly Professor Kabeeca Mwaniki. They are better authorities than you or I.

Finally, allow me to repeat myself "A language is a dialect with an army." I suspect the chief reason you can make such an "off hand" dismissal is because you come from the dominant group.

Where is Magigi? My in-lwas and I need to go back to the bush.

hakuna kitu kama jajejijoju.....J doesn't stand alone at least in the alphabet that I was taught. Refer to Clown's post. In fact, no kikuyu name has a stand alone J, but NJ eg, Wanja, Wanjau, Njau, Njarana, Njaramba...as for the spoken version hehehe

I think we can close this debate by disagreeing to disagree.

To summarize my points:

1. Consonant drift - clearly indicates that Kamba, being more 'phonetically degraded' than Gikuyu must be older.

2. There is even more persuasive evidence from anthropology to show that it is the Agikuyu who borrowed from the Kamba, not the reverse

3. Finally, more controversial, there is evidence that Gikuyu is a recently invented tribe (just like Kalenjin, Luyia etc). Its myth of origin, clan structure, military organization, leadership and philosophy are largely borrowed from neighboring tribes.

Language and ethnic identity are deeply emotive and political issues and it is hard to debate them without seeming like I am threatening the hegemony of the house of Mumbi.

Nevertheless you have given me a lot to think about. I thank you.

P.S. as a BTW, do you realize the Gikuyu translation of your handle is the exact opposite of its meaning in English? In Gikuyu Money whisperer would be "Muhuhi wa mbia" descended from "Muhuhi wa mbura" who is a rain stopper.

I told you my reasons. They are close to @whisperers. I understand a bit of each of the Mt Kenya languages, and with my layman's knowledge and bit of history can't just get how a more complicated language is derived from a less complicated one.

And scholars will sometimes get over innovative. Like trying to link everyone to Egypt. Makes us feel good, right?

I am yet to read 'Facing Mt Kenya' but wazuans who've quoted it here say Kenyatta had issues with mzungu's Kikuyu alphabet.

There is no single j in current Kikuyu which we were taught back then.

The book must be Wirute Guthoma by Fred Kago. Haven't seen it in bookshops but Mithomere ya Agikuyu is available at Bookpoint