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Thanking God
2012
#1 Posted : Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:20:01 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/9/2009
Posts: 6,592
Location: Nairobi
This tragedy at the Westgate made me wonder and maybe if there's a religious scholar here he/she could clarify.

Now should we thank God that we were nowhere near Westgate? I ask this because I know the people who passed were probably not at the wrong place. Did God save the rest of us or we were just lucky not to have been there?

BBI will solve it
:)
simonkabz
#2 Posted : Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:35:24 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/2/2007
Posts: 8,776
Location: Cameroon
Tycho.......go
TULIA.........UFUNZWE!
Impunity
#3 Posted : Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:49:28 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/2/2009
Posts: 26,328
Location: Masada
@AlphaDoti.
Portfolio: Sold
You know you've made it when you get a parking space for your yatcht.

tycho
#4 Posted : Wednesday, September 25, 2013 5:07:33 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
2012 wrote:
This tragedy at the Westgate made me wonder and maybe if there's a religious scholar here he/she could clarify.

Now should we thank God that we were nowhere near Westgate? I ask this because I know the people who passed were probably not at the wrong place. Did God save the rest of us or we were just lucky not to have been there?


I was just beginning a study of 'the evil that men do' when westgate happened. And trying to comprehend the human mind led me to frightening paths.

For example, should one consider himself lucky because a child had died in his stead? To every action there's an opposite and equal reaction. After all, isn't there a hint of guilt in such celebrations? How can such rationality be justified?

It's then that one realizes that all this celebration is in fact, 'devil worship'. If there's anything to celebrate about then it's victory over death, and living under the 'mandate of heaven' as Confucius, or Christ put it.

Then there's only pure being. No thanking or demanding. Only giving with a cheerful heart.
Mukiri
#5 Posted : Wednesday, September 25, 2013 5:07:58 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/11/2012
Posts: 5,222
2012 wrote:
This tragedy at the Westgate made me wonder and maybe if there's a religious scholar here he/she could clarify.

Now should we thank God that we were nowhere near Westgate? I ask this because I know the people who passed were probably not at the wrong place. Did God save the rest of us or we were just lucky not to have been there?

The fact that we were born automatically means we'll die. Its a guarantee. Its only a question of when and how.

When you ask such soul searching questions, you are bound to end up with 'Then whats the meaning of life?' A question whose answer has been sought after by people from all schools of thought.

I believe that it is when you get your answer, that life truly starts.

Are you afraid of death? And if so, why?

Proverbs 19:21
simonkabz
#6 Posted : Wednesday, September 25, 2013 5:24:34 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/2/2007
Posts: 8,776
Location: Cameroon
tycho wrote:
2012 wrote:
This tragedy at the Westgate made me wonder and maybe if there's a religious scholar here he/she could clarify.

Now should we thank God that we were nowhere near Westgate? I ask this because I know the people who passed were probably not at the wrong place. Did God save the rest of us or we were just lucky not to have been there?


I was just beginning a study of 'the evil that men do' when westgate happened. And trying to comprehend the human mind led me to frightening paths.

For example, should one consider himself lucky because a child had died in his stead? To every action there's an opposite and equal reaction. After all, isn't there a hint of guilt in such celebrations? How can such rationality be justified?

It's then that one realizes that all this celebration is in fact, 'devil worship'. If there's anything to celebrate about then it's victory over death, and living under the 'mandate of heaven' as Confucius, or Christ put it.

Then there's only pure being. No thanking or demanding. Only giving with a cheerful heart.


Sijakuelewa bro Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly
TULIA.........UFUNZWE!
accelriskconsult
#7 Posted : Wednesday, September 25, 2013 5:26:10 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 4/2/2011
Posts: 629
Location: Nai
Today at the office, I spoke to a man who has cancer. He told me that he hates people who speak slowly. I perfectly understood what he meant.
Magigi
#8 Posted : Wednesday, September 25, 2013 5:28:42 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/31/2008
Posts: 7,081
Location: Kenya
accelriskconsult wrote:
Today at the office, I spoke to a man who has cancer. He told me that he hates people who speak slowly. I perfectly understood what he meant.

Pray Probably wants to hear a lot before he goes!
Wendz
#9 Posted : Wednesday, September 25, 2013 5:49:32 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/19/2008
Posts: 4,268
And i get tired reading such threads.... aren't we supposed to be thankful for the opportunity to live? We would argue, there are many who have died in road accidents and we didn't, there are many who have cancer and we don't, and for some, they just had a headache and died... but we are alive... and we are not supposed to celebrate? even angles in heaven celebrate! If i die, i die, if i live, i thank God and celebrate the gift of life! Devil worship someone's big toe!(because it's not "MY" toe!) NKT!
Wendz
#10 Posted : Wednesday, September 25, 2013 5:53:36 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/19/2008
Posts: 4,268
Mukiri wrote:
[quote=2012]This tragedy at the Westgate made me wonder and maybe if there's a religious scholar here he/she could clarify.

Now should we thank God that we were nowhere near Westgate? I ask this because I know the people who passed were probably not at the wrong place. Did God save the rest of us or we were just lucky not to have been there?

The fact that we were born automatically means we'll die. Its a guarantee. Its only a question of when and how.

When you ask such soul searching questions, you are bound to end up with 'Then whats the meaning of life?' A question whose answer has been sought after by people from all schools of thought.

I believe that it is when you get your answer, that life truly starts.

Are you afraid of death? And if so, why?[/quote]

My biggest fear of my death is how wendzlets will survive when i am gone.... And when i pray, i always request God to give me many years to see them through life until they are grown up and can take care of themselves.... Just like one guy requested that God keeps him until he sees his saviour. when he did, then he said he could then die in peace....
2012
#11 Posted : Wednesday, September 25, 2013 5:55:46 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/9/2009
Posts: 6,592
Location: Nairobi
Is it fair to say that the people who survived escaped because of God's intervention and mercy? Would that then imply that He had favoured some over others or is it that others had already done their time? Anyway, we all have hard probably unanswerable questions at this time. I still trust in God 1000%.

BBI will solve it
:)
Mukiri
#12 Posted : Wednesday, September 25, 2013 5:57:05 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/11/2012
Posts: 5,222
Wendz wrote:
Mukiri wrote:
[quote=2012]This tragedy at the Westgate made me wonder and maybe if there's a religious scholar here he/she could clarify.

Now should we thank God that we were nowhere near Westgate? I ask this because I know the people who passed were probably not at the wrong place. Did God save the rest of us or we were just lucky not to have been there?

The fact that we were born automatically means we'll die. Its a guarantee. Its only a question of when and how.

When you ask such soul searching questions, you are bound to end up with 'Then whats the meaning of life?' A question whose answer has been sought after by people from all schools of thought.

I believe that it is when you get your answer, that life truly starts.

Are you afraid of death? And if so, why?[/quote]

My biggest fear of my death is how wendzlets will survive when i am gone.... And when i pray, i always request God to give me many years to see them through life until they are grown up and can take care of themselves.... Just like one guy requested that God keeps him until he sees his saviour. when he did, then he said he could then die in peace....

1. God has not given us a spirit of fear but of ......(alama ya dukuduku)

2. What is it that you think you do for them right now that you are alive?

3. What are your priorities in life?

Proverbs 19:21
tycho
#13 Posted : Wednesday, September 25, 2013 6:36:47 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
simonkabz wrote:
tycho wrote:
2012 wrote:
This tragedy at the Westgate made me wonder and maybe if there's a religious scholar here he/she could clarify.

Now should we thank God that we were nowhere near Westgate? I ask this because I know the people who passed were probably not at the wrong place. Did God save the rest of us or we were just lucky not to have been there?


I was just beginning a study of 'the evil that men do' when westgate happened. And trying to comprehend the human mind led me to frightening paths.

For example, should one consider himself lucky because a child had died in his stead? To every action there's an opposite and equal reaction. After all, isn't there a hint of guilt in such celebrations? How can such rationality be justified?

It's then that one realizes that all this celebration is in fact, 'devil worship'. If there's anything to celebrate about then it's victory over death, and living under the 'mandate of heaven' as Confucius, or Christ put it.

Then there's only pure being. No thanking or demanding. Only giving with a cheerful heart.


Sijakuelewa bro Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly


When you find yourself thanking God for something, just know you have alienated yourself.

Otherwise, you always have everything; even eternal life, and you need not fear death.

@Wendz speaks about asking for a long life for her children's sake; and am reminded of my own anxieties as a child, especially when my mom arrived late from work. I'd be plagued by all sorts of terror.

But years later I sat beside her on her death bed. And alas, we found that it was too soon to part ways. But the fact was we were parting.

Death should be treated as a friend rather than as an enemy, and should be let to come and go as it pleases. But that requires self knowledge; victory over death.

This is what 'maji maji' rebellion was about. The mystery of the resurrection.
tycho
#14 Posted : Wednesday, September 25, 2013 6:38:25 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
2012 wrote:
Is it fair to say that the people who survived escaped because of God's intervention and mercy? Would that then imply that He had favoured some over others or is it that others had already done their time? Anyway, we all have hard probably unanswerable questions at this time. I still trust in God 1000%.


No one survived the attack.
Pesa Nane
#15 Posted : Wednesday, September 25, 2013 6:46:27 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 5/25/2012
Posts: 4,105
Location: 08c
Wendz wrote:
Mukiri wrote:
[quote=2012]This tragedy at the Westgate made me wonder and maybe if there's a religious scholar here he/she could clarify.

Now should we thank God that we were nowhere near Westgate? I ask this because I know the people who passed were probably not at the wrong place. Did God save the rest of us or we were just lucky not to have been there?

The fact that we were born automatically means we'll die. Its a guarantee. Its only a question of when and how.

When you ask such soul searching questions, you are bound to end up with 'Then whats the meaning of life?' A question whose answer has been sought after by people from all schools of thought.

I believe that it is when you get your answer, that life truly starts.

Are you afraid of death? And if so, why?[/quote]

My biggest fear of my death is how wendzlets will survive when i am gone.... And when i pray, i always request God to give me many years to see them through life until they are grown up and can take care of themselves.... Just like one guy requested that God keeps him until he sees his saviour. when he did, then he said he could then die in peace....

Misquoting!! It wasn't @Mukiri but @2012
Pesa Nane plans to be shilingi when he grows up.
Gadaffi
#16 Posted : Wednesday, September 25, 2013 7:02:30 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 2/13/2011
Posts: 284
Location: Nairobi
Be joyful always; pray continually; give thanks in ALL circumstances, for this is God's will for you in Christ Jesus. 1 Thess 5:16-18
ecstacy
#17 Posted : Wednesday, September 25, 2013 7:06:58 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 2/26/2008
Posts: 4,449
2012 wrote:
This tragedy at the Westgate made me wonder and maybe if there's a religious scholar here he/she could clarify.

Now should we thank God that we were nowhere near Westgate? I ask this because I know the people who passed were probably not at the wrong place. Did God save the rest of us or we were just lucky not to have been there?


This exact thought struck me on Monday.

I thought the same when a 'saved' workmate told me "to thank God I wasn't there" at Westgate as I had earlier planned. "It was God's plan".

Knowing friends who were traumatically affected by this attack and and yet to heal, I put myself in the victims shoes and "No", it can't have been God. Even to the kids with their mums shot? even those hostage toddlers shot dead in front of their mums for crying? No..

Instinctively told him ,if it was God for me, was it the Devil for the innocent victims?

I was just at the right place at the right time.

Even infront of God's eyes, #WeAreOne
AlphDoti
#18 Posted : Wednesday, September 25, 2013 7:13:56 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/20/2008
Posts: 6,275
Location: Kenya
2012 wrote:
Is it fair to say that the people who survived escaped because of God's intervention and mercy? Would that then imply that He had favoured some over others or is it that others had already done their time? Anyway, we all have hard probably unanswerable questions at this time. I still trust in God 1000%.

I'll speak from Quranic pespective.

Belief in destiny and fate
is one of the basic beliefs of Islam.
It means that Allah is the Knower of all things and the Creator of all things;
nothing exists outside of His will and decree.

He wrote down all things with Him
in al-Lawh al-Mahfooz (the Preserved Tablet).

Everything in the universe
every creature and the things it does, is the creation of Allah.

Whatever He wills happens
and whatever He does not will does not happen.
If something happens to a person, it could not have missed him.

And if something does not happen to him, it could not have happened to him.

A person is not forced
to obey or disobey Allah.
He has free will as befits his state, but it is subject to the will of the Creator.

There are 4 points
To keep this short, I'll post them in next explanation ...
AlphDoti
#19 Posted : Wednesday, September 25, 2013 7:30:39 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/20/2008
Posts: 6,275
Location: Kenya
There are 4 points

1. God knows everything
He has knowledge of everything, past, present and the future

2. God has written this in al-Lawh al-Mahfooz (the Preserved Tablet)
Quran sura Al Hajj 22:70
"Knowest thou not that Allah knows all that is in heaven and on earth? Indeed it is all in a Record, and that is easy for Allah."

(This is not difficult for Him from whom flows all knowledge and intelligence)

3. everything happens with the will of Allah
Quran sura Al Qasas 28:68
- "Thy Lord does create and choose as He pleases: no choice have they (in the matter):- Glory to Allah."

Quran sura Ibrahim 14:27
- Allah will establish in strength those who believe, with the word that stands firm, in this world and in the Hereafter;
- but Allah will leave, to stray, those who do wrong: Allah doeth what He willeth
.

Quran sura Al Burooj 85:16 So we learn that whatever Allah intends, he can do.

Quran sura Al Imran 3:6 - "He it is Who shapes you in the wombs as He pleases. There is no god but He, the Exalted in Might, the Wise."

4. All things happen are created by Allah
...in their sense, attributes and movement.
Quran sura Al Zumar 39:62 - "Allah is the Creator of all things, and He is the Guardian and Disposer of all affairs."
Quran sura Al Furqaan 25:2 - "Allah created all things, and ordered them in due proportions."
Quran sura Al Saaffaat 37:96 - "But Allah has created you and your handwork!
"

One important point to note
is that, just because Allah created everything, He interferes with free will. No.

People have our free will
And we know in our day to day life, we have a free will.

Quran sura Al Baqarah 2:223 - It means you have a free will.

Quran sura Al Taghaabun 64:16 - "Fear Allah as much as you can. Listen to Him and obey Him"

Quran sura Al Baqarah 2:286
- Allah Does not lay a burden greater than it can bear.
- It gets every good that it earns, and it suffers every ill that it earns.

So based on this, every human being has a free will.
And we see this in every day life.
For example:
- there are some things that go on, which He has fixed
- everything else lies on free will like if I want to lift my hand, if I want I can walk
- it is my will

Certain things for example heart beating.
It beats because of the will of Allah
I can't if I want to stop my heart from beating, I cannot do it.
Meduza
#20 Posted : Wednesday, September 25, 2013 8:50:43 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 2/7/2013
Posts: 447
Location: Nairobi
be happy, dance, rejoice, be thankful, because if you don't, the birds and the hills will still be thankful. if death pass over you, you still have your breath to thank the Lord, and be happy. because when your breath is gone...you are no more to praise or be thankful
You cant win, unless you first begin....
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