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HIGH BLOOD PRESSURE
Muriel
#21 Posted : Wednesday, September 04, 2013 10:25:18 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 11/19/2009
Posts: 3,142
tycho wrote:
Wanjy wrote:

Got this problem of High blood pressure for 3yrs now, I have been under drugs for an year + not forgetting I have been using insulin three times a day for 20 yrs +, I weigh 54 Kgs.

Please, I need your advise on handling pressure


To put your BP under control you need to:

1. Conduct your own investigation and research on this condition

2. Engage in a dialogue with a practitioner who has a syncretic approach to medicine and develop a plan of treatment and management that suits you

3. Integrite the plan of treatment into your worldview. Worldviews are etiological factors.

@Kusadikika, yes, blood pressure may rise due to position, activity and the like. But the story doesn't end there. Pressure has effects like 'confusion'. Heart failure is a confusion of the heart in relation to other organ 'states'.

It follows that a normal must be sought by doctors.


'Own investigation and research' implies taking personal control of ones body including what one ingests and what one does, literally, physically etc.

Personal responsibility of ones health hence cannot be diluted.

Kusadikika is giving it in a concentrated form.

Its hence upto the reader to mix it for himself right. Others will thoroughly dilute it till it looses value and taste.

jguru
#22 Posted : Wednesday, September 04, 2013 10:33:02 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 10/25/2007
Posts: 1,574
Kusadikika wrote:
Wanjy wrote:

Got this problem of High blood pressure for 3yrs now, I have been under drugs for an year + not forgetting I have been using insulin three times a day for 20 yrs +, I weigh 54 Kgs.

Please, I need your advise on handling pressure


Stop taking that Blood Pressure medicine immediately!!! High blood pressure is the biggest hoax in medicine. One persons blood pressure changes at all times, you lie down your blood pressure lowers, you stand up it goes up, you walk around it or run it goes up, you get scared or worried it goes up.

Now this is all on the same person at different times and situations in the day, now take into consideration that there are different people of different ages, height, race, weight and body types and guess what normal blood pressure is just one number 120/80 which the medical community keeps lowering and adjusting to create imaginary diseases like prehypertension etc so that now starting from numbers as low as 115/75 doctors will start suggesting to you that you are unwell. Let nobody cheat you, it is not in the best interests of doctors for you to be well. What better way to create a customer than to create worry about something that needs to be monitored regularly yet they know it changes every minute.

If you are otherwise healthy and are feeling well I would say stop worrying about what your blood pressure is. Maybe your normal is higher than other peoples normal, but once you start taking medicine you will never stop and the doctors will not be complaining about that.

Let the wazua doctors start throwing stones.


I will throw the first stone.

Do not, ever, in a public forum, disapprove an universally distinguished ailment such as hypertension without research, published facts or medical evidence.

Hypertension exists.

Most people don't notice it or get treatment early for it because, just like diabetes, it is painless. It can simply be diagnosed by repeatedly taking blood pressure readings either at home, or at a health facility near you.

Fact: The effects of 5-10 years of a blood pressure higher than 140/100 mm Hg will definitely lead to targeted organ damage (to blood vessels, the heart, kidneys, eyes and the brain).

The "imaginary" condition you sneer at called prehypertension is the starting point of hypertension. It starts early (30years or less), is asymptomatic, and ends up as established/complicated hypertension. The healthcare world is moving to a phenomenon where we are seeking to prevent diseases and factors that cause disease, rather than treating diseases.

I'm sure you have heard of a female relative or friend who has had to deliver a baby early due to high BP. Preeclampsia/eclampsia is the number 2 reason we have preterm deliveries.
Set out to correct the world's wrongs and you will most certainly wind up adding to them.
jguru
#23 Posted : Wednesday, September 04, 2013 10:40:58 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 10/25/2007
Posts: 1,574
Kusadikika wrote:
This is how many young educated people will start killing their parents. Your parents are active, healthy people, sio wagonjwa but they are now just starting to get old. So you think now that you have insurance let me take them to the doctors to get a checkup, big mistake.

If you are not sick DO NOT go seeing a doctor for a checkup. Doctors see sick people, they see all people through the goggles of disease and all things they can treat.

Eat well, take care of yourself and if you feel sick then go see a doctor to treat your sickness but DO NOT go seeing a doctor to ask him if you are healthy because that is when they start being creative with things like High Blood Pressure.

So @Maka, ask your mzee how the medicines make him feel. If he feels better when he is on them than when he is off them then he should continue taking them lakini akikwambia how bad he feels when taking them and he is fine without them mwambie azitupe kwa choo na asizitumie tena.


If we were to stand by and watch as our parents suffer an ailment, all our parents would be in heaven right now.

Losartan-H when taken well reduces peripheral vascular resistance, and the work the heart does. It reduces chances of damage to the kidneys and the eyes.

Doctors see both the healthy and the sick. They bring life to this world, and watch it as it ebbs away at the end of days.
Set out to correct the world's wrongs and you will most certainly wind up adding to them.
jguru
#24 Posted : Wednesday, September 04, 2013 10:59:22 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 10/25/2007
Posts: 1,574
Wanjy wrote:

Got this problem of High blood pressure for 3yrs now, I have been under drugs for an year + not forgetting I have been using insulin three times a day for 20 yrs +, I weigh 54 Kgs.

Please, I need your advise on handling pressure


Your 20yr history of diabetes led to diabetic cardiomyopathy. The high BP is a complication of the long-standing diabetes. This damage to small vessels due to high blood sugars is often irreversible.

You should see your endocrinologist/physician at least once or twice a month so that he/she can look out for other complications e.g. kidney disease or retinopathy (eyes). He/she also needs to ensure that the BP is kept within normal limits.

Your weight is ok. Stop/limit alcohol use. Stop smoking. Reduce salt use. Reduce dietary fat and cholesterols. Regulate potassium/calcium/magnesium. Ensure 30 mins of exercise each day. And take your meds + insulin as advised.

There are thousands of Central province residents with a problem similar to yours. The MoH is aggressively targeting these two non-communicable diseases with an aim to reduce the morbidity and mortality of diabetes and hypertension.

Set out to correct the world's wrongs and you will most certainly wind up adding to them.
Muriel
#25 Posted : Wednesday, September 04, 2013 11:13:12 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 11/19/2009
Posts: 3,142
Glad to note this advice. Thank you Bw. Jguru.

It reinforces what I have learnt about diabetes and HBP in my sojourns and the advices I have heard and noted from health talks and discussions in other fora.


vky
#26 Posted : Wednesday, September 04, 2013 11:13:37 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 6/17/2010
Posts: 572
my mum was found to have HBP back in 95 and since then the only time she takes meds is when the pressure goes to high and this has happened only twice in the last 17yrs the rest of the time she takes some concotion my uncle makes for her, apart from that i must say she drinks a lot of tea, eats a lot of greens with whole grain ugali and leads a highly physicall life farming, these are the things i have observed have kept her alive and going over the years otherwise after her episode in 95 the docs prognosis was grim
'One headache for famous medieval holy people was that someone might murder you to acquire your body parts for the relics trade'
Kusadikika
#27 Posted : Wednesday, September 04, 2013 1:49:47 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/22/2008
Posts: 2,702
I think Vyk's has got the clearest understanding of this thing. Everyone have their own normal blood pressure and you should only be concerned if it deviates markedly from normal. Now to establish what is normal you have to know what it has always been. One way of doing this is to have measurements of your own blood pressure every hour of every day since you were born. Now this is not possible but you know what it is not necessary because God the creator of the body did not create a sphygmomanometer to check blood pressure instead He put in a more reliable way of knowing if you are OK or not and that is how you FEEL.

At the root of this Doctors' fraud is the desire to turn healthy people into patients. They tell you, "do not rely on what you feel because it is misleading you, you should trust the numbers of our BP machines because they are telling us that you are sick and you need medication."

There is almost no research in medicine now that is done to establish normal. I will dare all doctors here in Wazua to quote studies that have been done on healthy people who are on no medication to try and establish what is normal. This would be important so that you can have normal readings for different ages, weights, race, tribe and gender. Everyone is supposed to have the same number, have you ever heard such upuzi?!

And if you are curious to know where this number 120 that we all are supposed to have came from here is a excerpt from a paper titled, "A short History of Blood Pressure Measurement"

"The first truly accurate estimation of the blood pressure in man was made by the surgeon Faivre, in 1856; he connected an artery to a mercury manometer at operation and was thus able to obtain direct readings. He found the femoral artery blood pressure to be 120 mm Hg and the brachial artery pressure to be between 115 and 120 mm Hg. These, and other direct readings, were
of great value in establishing a normal range for blood pressure."

Research ya 1856 using crude instruments on a handful of people and that became the standard for every human being on earth. Upuzi mtupu!!!!

Here is the rest of that article for anyone interested:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih....procrsmed00089-0065.pdf
a4architect.com
#28 Posted : Wednesday, September 04, 2013 4:20:51 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 1/4/2010
Posts: 1,668
Location: nairobi
Best method to reduce HBP for a healthy adult is through diet, exercise and avoidance of stress-full events.
I think the daily HBP meds to a healthy adult could result in further complications in future.
As Iron Sharpens Iron, So one Man Sharpens Another.
Mukiri
#29 Posted : Wednesday, September 04, 2013 7:13:52 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/11/2012
Posts: 5,222
jguru wrote:
Wanjy wrote:

Got this problem of High blood pressure for 3yrs now, I have been under drugs for an year + not forgetting I have been using insulin three times a day for 20 yrs +, I weigh 54 Kgs.

Please, I need your advise on handling pressure


Your 20yr history of diabetes led to diabetic cardiomyopathy. The high BP is a complication of the long-standing diabetes. This damage to small vessels due to high blood sugars is often irreversible.

You should see your endocrinologist/physician at least once or twice a month so that he/she can look out for other complications e.g. kidney disease or retinopathy (eyes). He/she also needs to ensure that the BP is kept within normal limits.

Your weight is ok. Stop/limit alcohol use. Stop smoking. Reduce salt use. Reduce dietary fat and cholesterols. Regulate potassium/calcium/magnesium. Ensure 30 mins of exercise each day. And take your meds + insulin as advised.

There are thousands of Central province residents with a problem similar to yours. The MoH is aggressively targeting these two non-communicable diseases with an aim to reduce the morbidity and mortality of diabetes and hypertension.


Doc, what is it about Central Province residents that makes them highly susceptible?

Proverbs 19:21
Rankaz13
#30 Posted : Wednesday, September 04, 2013 7:47:51 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 5/21/2013
Posts: 2,841
Location: Here
Mukiri wrote:
jguru wrote:
Wanjy wrote:

Got this problem of High blood pressure for 3yrs now, I have been under drugs for an year + not forgetting I have been using insulin three times a day for 20 yrs +, I weigh 54 Kgs.

Please, I need your advise on handling pressure


Your 20yr history of diabetes led to diabetic cardiomyopathy. The high BP is a complication of the long-standing diabetes. This damage to small vessels due to high blood sugars is often irreversible.

You should see your endocrinologist/physician at least once or twice a month so that he/she can look out for other complications e.g. kidney disease or retinopathy (eyes). He/she also needs to ensure that the BP is kept within normal limits.

Your weight is ok. Stop/limit alcohol use. Stop smoking. Reduce salt use. Reduce dietary fat and cholesterols. Regulate potassium/calcium/magnesium. Ensure 30 mins of exercise each day. And take your meds + insulin as advised.

There are thousands of Central province residents with a problem similar to yours. The MoH is aggressively targeting these two non-communicable diseases with an aim to reduce the morbidity and mortality of diabetes and hypertension.


Doc, what is it about Central Province residents that makes them highly susceptible?


I think genetics.
Life is like playing a violin solo in public and learning the instrument as one goes on.
tycho
#31 Posted : Wednesday, September 04, 2013 8:25:43 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
Acupressure and massage therapy, nutrition and herbs, game and dance therapy, and general fitness are some of the alternative and or complimentary ways with which one can take a proactive stance with less financial and psychological burden, and side effects of mainstream medicine.

Sometimes sociological factors can cause low endocrine activity, and dealing with them directly can lead to cure. But this needs a traditional way of looking at the world.
Amores
#32 Posted : Wednesday, September 04, 2013 8:41:00 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 11/25/2011
Posts: 2,103
Location: Nrb
I think people should stop giving advice or recommending stuff about a topic which they know nothing about
I am happy
Kusadikika
#33 Posted : Wednesday, September 04, 2013 8:54:14 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/22/2008
Posts: 2,702
Amores wrote:
I think people should stop giving advice or recommending stuff about a topic which they know nothing about


Doctors love to have patients like you @Amores. You have swallowed the myth that is Medical care hook, line and sinker. You live with your body your whole life and then you see a doctor for 15 minutes and he convinces you that he knows everything about your body and you know nothing about yourself.

Everybody who has a body knows something........ no knows a lot about his/her own body. The more you study yourself the better you know yourself. It is the most important study you will ever undertake, study yourself so that you are not deceived.
kaka2za
#34 Posted : Wednesday, September 04, 2013 9:48:57 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 10/3/2008
Posts: 4,057
Location: Gwitu
Anyone seeking medical advice here will soon wish he hadn't.
Truth forever on the scaffold
Wrong forever on the throne
(James Russell Rowell)
Wendz
#35 Posted : Thursday, September 05, 2013 11:53:30 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/19/2008
Posts: 4,268
kaka2za wrote:
Anyone seeking medical advice here will soon wish he hadn't.


Laughing out loudly very true... all the highly qualified, not so qualified, not so ignorant and the very ignorant of the doctors live in wazua... you do not know what to take and what to leave.
Wendz
#36 Posted : Thursday, September 05, 2013 11:56:02 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/19/2008
Posts: 4,268
Kusadikika wrote:


High blood pressure is the biggest hoax in medicine.


This statement is not correct Bwana Kusadikika. These folks will be so dead before you even finish that word "hoax" if ignored!
Muriel
#37 Posted : Thursday, September 05, 2013 1:38:32 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 11/19/2009
Posts: 3,142
kaka2za wrote:
Anyone seeking medical advice here will soon wish he hadn't.


Why?

Surely you are not implying certain issues should not be talked about by the laymen, the 'ignorant'?

That is a hard standard to impose that even you will fall foul of sooner rather than later.

I think what you must be having in mind is a disclaimer such as

Quote:
.... the information should not be interpreted as medical or professional advice. All such information needs to be reviewed carefully with your own doctor before you act upon it in any way.....


tycho
#38 Posted : Thursday, September 05, 2013 2:26:21 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
Wendz wrote:
kaka2za wrote:
Anyone seeking medical advice here will soon wish he hadn't.


Laughing out loudly very true... all the highly qualified, not so qualified, not so ignorant and the very ignorant of the doctors live in wazua... you do not know what to take and what to leave.


I find it sad that one should find himself in such a position.

Perhaps an anecdote will explain it better. One day my father, showed me the results of a checkup he'd taken. I couldn't understand it. So he explained it slowly. Then finished by saying that he was glad that he had no HIV, but his blood pressure wasn't ok.

I went to my room to give it a thought and I reasoned like @Kusadikika. Months later I was given news of a stroke, and subsequent paralysis.

Then began the quest for authority. We ended up visiting some Professor who was also suffering from the same condition. The Prof. was writing some book. He also borrowed one from me. But to my poor father he gave Cozepam, or some 'am'. Something that left him shitting on himself.

So everyone that could heal was summoned, in a halting fashion as philosophy crumbled along the way. Lol. The Adventists, Legio Maria, African Divine, everyone. The taps opened when one day my father declared that the only he cared about was to be cured.

He'd rise early in the morning and call out to God to save him from his misery. Now he only wanted to die.

In all this I felt that something was amiss. Why is good health so elusive?

Now I see that our approach to healing, and consequently, disease is wanting. Healing is purely a matter of philosophy, and it's a decadent philosophy that has no cure for most, if not all disease.

Or a philosophy that leaves the human all the worse.

The Hippocratic oath is about goodness to Man, and is in essence, syncretism, and individual enlightenment. So as @Kusadikika is saying, everyone is to be his own doctor.
Muriel
#39 Posted : Thursday, September 05, 2013 4:05:07 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 11/19/2009
Posts: 3,142
tycho wrote:


To put your BP under control you need to:

1. Conduct your own investigation and research on this condition

2. Engage in a dialogue with a practitioner who has a syncretic approach to medicine and develop a plan of treatment and management that suits you

3. Integrite the plan of treatment into your worldview. Worldviews are etiological factors.

@Kusadikika, yes, blood pressure may rise due to position, activity and the like. But the story doesn't end there. Pressure has effects like 'confusion'. Heart failure is a confusion of the heart in relation to other organ 'states'.

It follows that a normal must be sought by doctors.


tycho wrote:


I find it sad that one should find himself in such a position.

Perhaps an anecdote will explain it better. One day my father, showed me the results of a checkup he'd taken. I couldn't understand it. So he explained it slowly. Then finished by saying that he was glad that he had no HIV, but his blood pressure wasn't ok.

I went to my room to give it a thought and I reasoned like @Kusadikika. Months later I was given news of a stroke, and subsequent paralysis.

Then began the quest for authority. We ended up visiting some Professor who was also suffering from the same condition. The Prof. was writing some book. He also borrowed one from me. But to my poor father he gave Cozepam, or some 'am'. Something that left him shitting on himself.

So everyone that could heal was summoned, in a halting fashion as philosophy crumbled along the way. Lol. The Adventists, Legio Maria, African Divine, everyone. The taps opened when one day my father declared that the only he cared about was to be cured.

He'd rise early in the morning and call out to God to save him from his misery. Now he only wanted to die.

In all this I felt that something was amiss. Why is good health so elusive?

Now I see that our approach to healing, and consequently, disease is wanting. Healing is purely a matter of philosophy, and it's a decadent philosophy that has no cure for most, if not all disease.

Or a philosophy that leaves the human all the worse.

The Hippocratic oath is about goodness to Man, and is in essence, syncretism, and individual enlightenment. So as @Kusadikika is saying, everyone is to be his own doctor.


Surely that is sad.

Did he:

1. Conduct his own investigation and research on this condition

2. Engage in a dialogue with a practitioner who has a syncretic approach to medicine and develop a plan of treatment and management that suits him

3. Integrite the plan of treatment into his worldview. Worldviews are etiological factors.

But the story doesn't end there. Pressure has effects like 'confusion'. Heart failure is a confusion of the heart in relation to other organ 'states'.

It follows that a normal must be sought by doctors.
jguru
#40 Posted : Thursday, September 05, 2013 4:11:52 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 10/25/2007
Posts: 1,574
Kusadikika wrote:
Amores wrote:
I think people should stop giving advice or recommending stuff about a topic which they know nothing about


Doctors love to have patients like you @Amores. You have swallowed the myth that is Medical care hook, line and sinker. You live with your body your whole life and then you see a doctor for 15 minutes and he convinces you that he knows everything about your body and you know nothing about yourself.

Everybody who has a body knows something........ no knows a lot about his/her own body. The more you study yourself the better you know yourself. It is the most important study you will ever undertake, study yourself so that you are not deceived.


Bro @Kusadikika, you are angry. Maybe from something that happened in a health institution or that a medical personnel did or did not do. Knowingly or otherwise.

Breath in. Breath out.

The advice you are giving @Wanjy (10 year diabetic on insulin, 3 year hypertensive on antihypertensives) is not suitable. And you know it.

Stop.
Set out to correct the world's wrongs and you will most certainly wind up adding to them.
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