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Confusion in God?
Rank: Member Joined: 5/31/2013 Posts: 109
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symbols wrote:Ante_Christa wrote:Meduza, this is quite interesting.
Imagine a horizontal line.
At the extreme left at the start of the line is Adam.
At the extreme right at the end of the line is us today.
Moving from us today and going back in time as it were, you can put marks or branches along this line showing the start of different religions and churches etc.
Then you have Islam branching out and as you move further back you have christian, then as you go even further you have jewry and so on.
The Christian branch has sub branches and sub sub branches etc. The christian branch is the branch with most twigs.
There is a continuum that I am trying to trace because not all the twigs of this branch are true.
All the other religions are fairly straight forward. There has got to be truth in the christian mish-mash.
It seems no one has given it thought and when I try I am laughed at about searching things of God.
Symbols, what are you trying to say? your post is blank. Please repeat.
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Rank: Member Joined: 5/31/2013 Posts: 109
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guru267 wrote:Ante_Christa wrote:guru267 wrote:Ante_Christa wrote:Surely the remnant exists. I just want it, none else.
Who can direct me to it?
The original organization was the Catholic religion... But this as we all know was Satans tool to divide Gods chosen people! Alright! I now have something to work on. If Catholic is now the remnant organization if I trace it backwards it will be consistent with the apostles, Jesus, Nehemiah and so on? Is there any Catholic here in Wazua to guide me here? By the way, if division in Gods chosen people is a tactic of satan, then logically Gods chosen people must be among these divided peoples right? This rules out Islam as not among Gods chosen people. Just because God's chosen ones were led astray does not mean that no one else can enter the kingdom of heaven. All it means is that Satan was focused on getting God's chosen people to chill with him in hell and in the process left out the Muslims Another argument could be since the world super powers run on Christianity then it would be easy to corrupt the rest. Guru267, God does not change. If his chosen ones were led astray, he will bring them back first to himself then take them onward to heaven. He is merciful remember? Are you saying Muslims are out of bounds for satan? Are you saying satan gives Muslims a wide berth while he mercilessly bugs the rest of humanity? Why should satan do this? What does he hope to achieve? If everybody were to be Muslim to avoid being bugged is this his end game?
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Rank: Member Joined: 5/31/2013 Posts: 109
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tycho wrote:Ante_Christa wrote: You are all misunderstanding me, except Meduza. Tycho is off in a tangent and he is just gone.
I can change the title.
Muganda, I am thinking that if I can find these people, they will help me in my walk with God. A singular brand soon ceases to burn while a bunch of them burns longer.
I need the company hence my search for these elusive people.
Mukiri, I can find God alright. That is not my issue. I can even find Tychos christ if I want to but I dont.
I only want people to associate with not christs.
Meduza says a lot of original christians beliefs have been distorted to suit certain needs in particular periods but isnt there any group of people who at least attempt to preserve these beliefs even with these shortcomings of historical destruction?
Muganda, isnt your church one of them, what about you Mukiri and Meduza? I can come.
Tycho, even to you I can come and chill with you if you are one of them I am looking for.
Hehehe! Tangent? There's no Tycho's Christ. There cannot be. This is where you go off the mark. So whose Christ are you seeking? Of the Church fathers? Were they more pious than the Essenes? Encouragement? Lol. The path is Sparta. But I am slowly becoming an ascetic, a Zen monk perhaps, in the massive Kibra. Tycho, wow me with your knowledge. What if I say I am looking for todays Essenes? While you are morphing and moulting care to point me to his house?
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Rank: Member Joined: 5/31/2013 Posts: 109
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investorinpple wrote:tycho wrote:Ante_Christa wrote:I cannot find the place to change the topic.
I wanted it to read confusion of man in search of Christians. Same implications. Its a futile search. Just seek God. Christians are and will always be human, prone to err and confusion. In fact if you manage to get the true Christians (those who are perfectly on the way) do not join them because you may infect them with your confusion. If it is fellowship that you seek, fellowship with fellow seekers for no single group has the bragging rights of being the 'truly compliant Christians'. Word of advise... Pentecostals are closer to what you are seeking. Keep your search around there... Investorinpple, even if I do not join them for fear of infecting them with my confusion, they will invite me to be with them. Isnt it? They will seek me whether I want to be found or not. I want to make it easier for both of us. There is no playing hard-to-get stuff here. Pentecostals? I can go through them eliminating one by one. They are so many. Care to help?
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Rank: Member Joined: 5/31/2013 Posts: 109
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kiterunner wrote:what if I am not convinced in the supremacy of this Europeanor Jewish god? Does that Count as ignorance? Please answer without quoting some random Verse. Does that mean since most of India did not receive this religion from missionaries they will still go to heaven? What is the objective of Christianity? is it to go to heaven Or to prosper on earth and receive blessings ? I find it all very confusing' this religion arrived fairly recently <100 yrs ago and it has literally wiped out anything Africans believed in before that r Africans are even better at it than the originators What if Martians Came today with a new religion ' I beg the same mad b religious Africans will embrace it more than anyone else '
Kiterunner, we know so little about our ancestors. The much we know about them is hardly 200 years old. We do not know what they worshipped or how they worshipped except what the white man has told us. So for all we know they could have worshipped this same God we worship today after all! You cannot definitively say they did not worship God unless you have bought the white guys stories. The white guys said we the black guys did not worship God the creator of heaven and earth. As if they are the ones who determined what we worshipped. See my response to Lolest above.
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Rank: Member Joined: 5/31/2013 Posts: 109
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AlphDoti wrote:Ante_Christa wrote:I cannot find the place to change the topic.
I wanted it to read confusion of man in search of Christians. I know you've been upset with what you're seeing in Christianity. I was a Christian too. I used to get more upset after church service. The things I see them doing does not match what their book says. The things the preach, does not match they do... Let me tell you what you should be seeking:I believe in God After that obey the commandments, and abandon the things that are forbidden. So the question is: "What is Islam?"Islam is abstinence & Obedience to God When you read history..you realize that God Has sent among every community and nation a Messenger. These messengers told the people: "Worship God (Alone), and avoid (or keep away from) all false idols, etc. They told them do not worship other beings besides God. But some of them were guided correctly, and some of them strayed from the correct teachings. They even changed the scripture:Read about Constantine the Great and Nicene Creed (Nicea Creed). You can see in the land what has been the end of those who denied the truth. Surely, the true religion is the one the asks people to submit to God. You can see those who were given the Scripture Jews and Christians have differed out of jealousy. Yet knowledge had come to them. You can see the proofs, evidences, verses, signs, revelations of God. Then surely, you can see for yourself what is right among all these religions. God has provided to people the same religion which He ordained to Noah, the same He inspired in Muhammad (pbuh). And the same which He ordained for Abraham, Moses and Jesus. God told them they should establish religion, to do what He order them to do practically. And not to start divisions in the religion i.e. various sects in religion. Alphdoti, I am upset with what I am seeing in christianity today. But I will not chicken out and be a quitter like you. kwa kwa kwa kwa kwa. The standard I use is not what I see a fellow humans doing. My standard is bible. If one wants to talk bible but do anti-bible thats upon him, not me. But it would be nice to meet those who talk bible and do bible. If i find them, I will make it my task to invite you to see them. Then your displeasure and mine will dissipate and you will return as I get content.
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Rank: Member Joined: 5/31/2013 Posts: 109
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Meduza wrote:The answers you seek only lies in the Holy book you read. Christians dwell more on the New Testaments. The teachings of Jesus are really good. Even prophet Mohamed did recognise that indeed Jesus was a true teacher. Dont dig too much to what might or might not have been. Even the Vatican will never allow you to discover that truth. So many have searched the Ark of the Covenant, others for the Grail they have never found them. Meduza, you have referred me to the holy book which I read. That holy book talks of a remnant people of God (a small part or portion that remains after the main part no longer exists). There remains just the simple matter of finding them. Do not discount history. I disagree with you there. Its our duty to dig into the past if we are to know and understand the present and future. Failure to find the ark or grail shows better use could have been made of time and resources, like sticking to the faith instead of changing and modifying it. Its not too late to learn from them and major on the majors instead of major on the minors.
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Rank: Member Joined: 5/31/2013 Posts: 109
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quicksand wrote:Lolest! wrote:kiterunner wrote:what will happen to our ancestors who never heard of this God you all seek? Does the god/spirits they worshipped and make sacrifices to count? What makes this European/Jewish/Arabic god better than others?
What if the Queen of England did not encourage missionaries to come to Africa (like she did for India) ? Would all you guys be seeking this same God today?
Scripture does not place any liability on the ignorant. In Acts 17:30 Peter alludes to ths while evangelizing and urging others to repent. 'in the days of ignorance God overlooked but now he commands everyone to repent' Elsewhere in Romans 10:13-14 scripture tells us that everyone who calls or believes in the name of the lord shall be saved. But then it states that those who have not been preached to cannot believe what they have not heard! So there you go, but today you must confess with your mouth and believe in your heart in Jesus and his resurrection for you to be saved  Where does the Bible say that? John 14:6 says I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me ...there doesn't seem to be any ambiguity whatsoever in that statement. Soon as Jesus was crucified, those are the words that apply. Between that time and when the first missionaries arrived, some 1900 to 2000 years had passed, and our African ancestors had never heard about Jesus. @kiterunner's question still remains unanswered. I posed this to a pastor once, and despite years of preaching experience, he could not provide an answer. Quicksand, that was a silly pastor who does not read to understand his bible. Lolest, I think scripture places liability on all people. There are none ignorant. Let me explain. Even our ancestors had a chance to know God well before Livingstone and ilk came. How? From nature. All they had to do was to observe nature and deduce that all the beauty, sophistication, variety must have been and was made by someone/something. This is the ignorance you are alluding to. From there, having recognised a creator, God would work in and through them much like he works in us today but with the back knowledge that they dont know Jesus and the atonement. Why else has folklore has (strange) stories of creation. They saw a creators hand in it somewhere. If they perverted this awarness of a creator and worshipped other things, attributing the creative power to these things then its upon them. This is from Romans chapter 1. pay attention from verse 18 onwards.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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Ante_C: 'Morphing, and moulting'. I like that.
Who cares for the Essenes? The ignorant.
The truth is accessible to all who seek it. The truth wasn't brought to us by the missionaries. Before they came they had to learn from the Egyptians. Even Pythagoras had to learn from the Egyptians.
Why aren't you inviting others to yourself?
Hautoshi?
Morphing and moulting.
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Rank: Member Joined: 2/7/2013 Posts: 447 Location: Nairobi
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Ante_Christa wrote:Meduza wrote:The answers you seek only lies in the Holy book you read. Christians dwell more on the New Testaments. The teachings of Jesus are really good. Even prophet Mohamed did recognise that indeed Jesus was a true teacher. Dont dig too much to what might or might not have been. Even the Vatican will never allow you to discover that truth. So many have searched the Ark of the Covenant, others for the Grail they have never found them. Meduza, you have referred me to the holy book which I read. That holy book talks of a remnant people of God (a small part or portion that remains after the main part no longer exists). There remains just the simple matter of finding them. Do not discount history. I disagree with you there. Its our duty to dig into the past if we are to know and understand the present and future. Failure to find the ark or grail shows better use could have been made of time and resources, like sticking to the faith instead of changing and modifying it. Its not too late to learn from them and major on the majors instead of major on the minors. By the Holy book i mean, Bible, Gita, Koran, whatever your faith is. I assume you are a Christian My understanding of the story of what the bible really is this especially in the old testament. Imagine the kikuyu community beliefs. We mostly know of the Gikuyu and Mumbi legend, nothing more because we didnt know how to write(that is a major disadvantage the African religion had)hence nothing is really recorded. You will notice that in the bible(OT), at one time Yahweh loves a certain group, and another time he totally destroys it, why? It all depended on who was giving the story. If the story teller viewed a certain community as their enemy, the writer would put in negative story about that particular community, in order to teach the people how Yahweh had destroyed the enemy and saved his people. The story of Samson and Hercules is one and the same, even in the kikuyu community we had the same legend. Some of the legends in the bible are really close to the African religion its only that the African story is never told. So to me religion is too diverse to try and collect it into one. At the moment am fascinated by the east in as much as am a staunch christian, I always want to know what else lies out there. You cant win, unless you first begin....
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