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How do you really help people?
akowally
#1 Posted : Wednesday, January 16, 2013 11:01:35 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 5/20/2008
Posts: 1,126
Location: Nairobi
I was doing my bible study today and came across this verse:

James 1:27

New International Version (NIV)

27 Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world.


There are many orphans and widows on the street everyday. 90% of people pass them and don't even take the time to tell them: "pole si leo".

I am not a saint but I do my best to help at least those who ask me, or those who look really desperate.

I know it is also great to fund charity organizations and pay your offerings in church (some churches use it to help the poor).

In your opinion, how can these guys be helped? I am asking from an individual point of view before guys start shouting "serikali" or church or pointing someone else.
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Annti_Christy
#2 Posted : Wednesday, January 16, 2013 11:48:39 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 8/27/2012
Posts: 320
How to help yourself manual;

1. tell people you read the bible
2. quote a verse or two to illustrate
3. give an interpretation to further illustrate
4. solicit, preferably start only with opinions, there is room for growth
Light Bearer
Kaka M
#3 Posted : Wednesday, January 16, 2013 12:02:15 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 4/18/2011
Posts: 459
deleted
Robinhood
#4 Posted : Wednesday, January 16, 2013 12:04:08 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/11/2008
Posts: 2,306
Annti_Christy wrote:
How to help yourself manual;

1. tell people you read the bible
2. quote a verse or two to illustrate
3. give an interpretation to further illustrate
4. solicit, preferably start only with opinions, there is room for growth


Auntie - Akowally has asked a useful question and this is your contribution? Nktest!
Great men are not always wise, neither do the aged understand judgement...
Kaka M
#5 Posted : Wednesday, January 16, 2013 12:04:36 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 4/18/2011
Posts: 459
akowally wrote:
I was doing my bible study today and came across this verse:

James 1:27

New International Version (NIV)

27 Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world.


There are many orphans and widows on the street everyday. 90% of people pass them and don't even take the time to tell them: "pole si leo".

I am not a saint but I do my best to help at least those who ask me, or those who look really desperate.

I know it is also great to fund charity organizations and pay your offerings in church (some churches use it to help the poor).

In your opinion, how can these guys be helped? I am asking from an individual point of view before guys start shouting "serikali" or church or pointing someone else.


Reminds me of a time I told a street boy, "Siku nyingine." Then he responded," Sio ati hakuna, ni uchoyo!"
Meanwhile one thing you will realise is that every case looks more needy than the previous.
If I can answer you in a few words, "You are supposed to help to the best of your ability."
A kind word, prayer, food if you have, etc etc.
As you do the same remember Charity begins at home, meaning that your spouse, children brothers & Sisters etc come first. Don get me wrong, My point is If you can find some spare time to be with orphans etc then fine but this is not supposed to be at the expense of your family. May be if you family will be ok with it, take some 45 minutes to pass by the children's home with family during the Sunday outing.
It should also help the children to learn not to take some things for granted.



akowally
#6 Posted : Wednesday, January 16, 2013 12:18:48 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 5/20/2008
Posts: 1,126
Location: Nairobi
Kaka M wrote:
Reminds me of a time I told a street boy, "Siku nyingine." Then he responded," Sio ati hakuna, ni uchoyo!"
Meanwhile one thing you will realise is that every case looks more needy than the previous.
If I can answer you in a few words, "You are supposed to help to the best of your ability."
A kind word, prayer, food if you have, etc etc.
As you do the same remember Charity begins at home, meaning that your spouse, children brothers & Sisters etc come first. Don get me wrong, My point is If you can find some spare time to be with orphans etc then fine but this is not supposed to be at the expense of your family. May be if you family will be ok with it, take some 45 minutes to pass by the children's home with family during the Sunday outing.
It should also help the children to learn not to take some things for granted.





I totally agree with your point. You help to the best of your ability and begin at home.

Maybe I can also add if you have aunties and relatives who are widows or orphans, you can make it a point to be more responsive to their issues.

Why do people avoid giving street people money?

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Behemoth
#7 Posted : Wednesday, January 16, 2013 12:22:23 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 8/7/2012
Posts: 180
Kaka M wrote:
akowally wrote:
I was doing my bible study today and came across this verse:

James 1:27

New International Version (NIV)

27 Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world.


There are many orphans and widows on the street everyday. 90% of people pass them and don't even take the time to tell them: "pole si leo".

I am not a saint but I do my best to help at least those who ask me, or those who look really desperate.

I know it is also great to fund charity organizations and pay your offerings in church (some churches use it to help the poor).

In your opinion, how can these guys be helped? I am asking from an individual point of view before guys start shouting "serikali" or church or pointing someone else.


Reminds me of a time I told a street boy, "Siku nyingine." Then he responded," Sio ati hakuna, ni uchoyo!"
Meanwhile one thing you will realise is that every case looks more needy than the previous.
If I can answer you in a few words, "You are supposed to help to the best of your ability."
A kind word, prayer, food if you have, etc etc.
As you do the same remember Charity begins at home, meaning that your spouse, children brothers & Sisters etc come first. Don get me wrong, My point is If you can find some spare time to be with orphans etc then fine but this is not supposed to be at the expense of your family. May be if you family will be ok with it, take some 45 minutes to pass by the children's home with family during the Sunday outing.
It should also help the children to learn not to take some things for granted.





Good piece. On the same strength, Isaiah 58: 6-11 -

“Is not this the kind of fasting I have chosen:
to loose the chains of injustice and untie the cords of the yoke, to set the oppressed free and break every yoke?

Is it not to share your food with the hungry and to provide the poor wanderer with shelter— when you see the naked, to clothe him, and not to turn away from your own flesh and blood?

Then your light will break forth like the dawn, and your healing will quickly appear; then your righteousness d will go before you, and the glory of the LORD will be your rear guard.

Then you will call, and the LORD will answer; you will cry for help, and he will say: Here am I.
“If you do away with the yoke of oppression, with the pointing finger and malicious talk, and if you spend yourselves in behalf of the hungry and satisfy the needs of the oppressed, then your light will rise in the darkness, and your night will become like the noonday.

The LORD will guide you always; he will satisfy your needs in a sun-scorched land and will strengthen your frame.
Eagles don't flock, you have to find them one at a time.
AlphDoti
#8 Posted : Wednesday, January 16, 2013 1:06:19 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/20/2008
Posts: 6,275
Location: Kenya
There is a solution: Look at the value in Islam.

I'll give you an example of Somalia.
The problem with Somalia, the drought is disaster.
The reason it is a disaster is not because of resources. Do you know we have enough calories in this universe to feed about 12 billion people in this planet?

Why do 10million people in America die from obesity?
But in Somalia they die because of lack of food!
The issue is about distribution.
That is the number one economic problem.

And Islam gives solution for this in a humble way.
It says look:
1. We have the zakat system: 2.5% of the wealth of people and distribute to the poor.
2. Sadaga, give charity
3. Removal of interest, because interest is the impediment to the distribution of wealth.
- Because if you put too much interest compounded on an individual, then they have less money in their hands.
- But if they have more money by removing the interest, then they have more money in their hands to engage in the society enterprenuirships.
So this creates a unique model.
4. Resources in Islamic paradym belong to the people, not to the government.
It is said: natural resources are people not the government
The government delegate the authority to use the resources and give it back to the people.

This is why Saudi Arabia is very unjust!
Because in Saudi Arabia, goverment takes the whole for themselves.
But their own traditions say give it back to people.

So Islam has so much to say about economics
So much and economic values originating from Islamic traditions are actually solving some of these issues.

Example 1:
if you look into Islamic banking, when credit crash happened, they are th eonly banks that came out strongly! And you saw many banks introducing or started talking about Sharia compliant products to show the stability of Islamic systems.

Example 2:
If you look at money in capital model, money is free floating and is not in gold and silver.
Therefore, if you have more money in the society, does not mean you have more wealth. But in Islamic tradition, money has to be contingent in gold or silver or something substantial.
This stabilizes money.

Example 3:
Take Otoman period between 14th and 15th century (read book "Constantinople" by Philip Mansel).
He wrote a letter to some brethren in Europe inviting them land of Islam.

Example 4:
If you look at a story from Turkey. There is big beautiful mosque. When you go inside, you will see two huge baskets made out of marbles.
What used to happen is, they used to fill in with Gold.
So people used to dip their hands really deep, and if you're rich you leave money, if you are poor you take money.
So people do not know if you are taking or you are leaving.
And majority of the time, the baskets were always filled with gold in there.
And this was the first time in history where people had food, shelter and clothing because of this economic porinciple.

And these are values I think we can see in Islamic societies.

But come back to secular societies like ours, the rich take all the resources. They control 80% of the resources Pray
Mukiri
#9 Posted : Wednesday, January 16, 2013 1:28:21 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/11/2012
Posts: 5,222
The Bible talks about 'Where two or three are gathered...' Yes, you can do something as an individual, maybe you can do more as a group? Isn't it the reason you are here asking for ideas?

My take, take time and scout around, look at the groups doing something for the poor and needy. When you identify one, ask to join them. Not just to contribute money but time, skills and your wisdom.

Proverbs 19:21
Lolest!
#10 Posted : Wednesday, January 16, 2013 2:52:25 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/18/2011
Posts: 12,069
Location: Kianjokoma
Kaka M wrote:

As you do the same remember Charity begins at home, meaning that your spouse, children brothers & Sisters etc come first. Don get me wrong, My point is If you can find some spare time to be with orphans etc then fine but this is not supposed to be at the expense of your family. May be if you family will be ok with it, take some 45 minutes to pass by the children's home with family during the Sunday outing.
It should also help the children to learn not to take some things for granted.




@Kaka, actually this is in the Bible

1 Tim 5:8

Anyone who does not provide for their relatives, and especially for their own household, has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.
Laughing out loudly smile Applause d'oh! Sad Drool Liar Shame on you Pray
tycho
#11 Posted : Wednesday, January 16, 2013 3:59:22 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
When you truly care about the other person, you are free to use your judgment and act accordingly.

This is because matters are not so straight forward. Or rather, the only straight forward thing is to live in God's presence. For there lies wisdom, discernment, and judgment.

I am saying this out of my own experience and reflection. Like there was this dark night when I was sent to the shops. I was probably seven or less, and my father gave me a 'spotlight' to use. I took the 'torch' and it lit my path all the way to the shop.

But my return journey wasn't so uneventful. There was someone else ahead, and moving in the same direction as I was. That meant being with him for longer! Should I light our path? I wondered.

I decided not to, but then only for a short while. For I saw the man stumble, and neither was my walk smooth.

'Why allow the two of us to stumble, and probably fall, while I have the light?' I wondered.

'But I can also lose the 'torch'!

I switched it on. Upon seeing the light, the man turned around, and when he saw me he said, 'Wee umetoka wapi? Lete hii!' And that was the end of light for me.

And so is it that a brother can turn against the other, or a mother eats her child when the city is besieged.

And of course, all suffering is illusion!

The remedy is to seek the light, and your suffering will end; and with wisdom and judgment light the other's path.

As for giving money and gifts one should be frugal and austere, yet full of compassion.
Mukiri
#12 Posted : Wednesday, January 16, 2013 5:31:32 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/11/2012
Posts: 5,222
You were not an intelligent 7 year old. Why didn't you turn and run?d'oh! You had the light, running would have been easier for you. Think

Proverbs 19:21
tycho
#13 Posted : Wednesday, January 16, 2013 6:03:12 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
Mukiri wrote:
You were not an intelligent 7 year old. Why didn't you turn and run?d'oh! You had the light, running would have been easier for you. Think


Hehehe! Maybe!

I rushed home to get my 'nunchaku' instead!

It's not that easy to break from a man's grip.

But then, for how long can one run with the light? Does it make sense to hide the light under the table?

AlphDoti
#14 Posted : Wednesday, January 16, 2013 6:15:06 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/20/2008
Posts: 6,275
Location: Kenya
tycho wrote:
Mukiri wrote:
You were not an intelligent 7 year old. Why didn't you turn and run?d'oh! You had the light, running would have been easier for you. Think

Hehehe! Maybe!

I rushed home to get my 'nunchaku' instead!

It's not that easy to break from a man's grip.

But then, for how long can one run with the light? Does it make sense to hide the light under the table?

@Mukiri give us a break, do not pretend as if you do not understand what goes on in the mind of 7 year old. You can pretend to be this brave man, but we all know that kids are always kids. You say you should have run, run where? There is no way a 7 year old can outrun a fully grown man in a sprint, especially at night. Intelligent or not.

Back to our discussion:
- there is there is so much money around, but you know what, there are millions of people starving!
- The systems we have in secular soieties are faulty.
- We lack the systems of wealth that focuses on meeting the needs of the people.
tycho
#15 Posted : Wednesday, January 16, 2013 6:34:04 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
True. Our systems have failed. Or maybe we've lost understanding of them.

Everything is moving so fast. Information coming in is too much!

And pleasures perhaps too overwhelming.
Drunkard
#16 Posted : Wednesday, January 16, 2013 6:59:35 PM
Rank: User


Joined: 5/3/2011
Posts: 559
I think helping is something we need to rethink in Africa because we seem not to find best ways to help or atleast we are so preoccupied with our own lifes to even think about the plight of people living around us or atleast our own plight.

About three weeks ago, I was enjoying my holiday with a bunch of good friends in a popular spot at the heart of the city and I run into two drunk beautiful white girls, both age 24 yrs and after a couple of drunk people hi5s we exchange numbers and later decide to take the drinking back to my place, me being greedy I decided to ditch my friends so that I can have two girls for myself( I have always wanted a threesome).

The night did not end in a threesome but in a complete reflection of who I am and what is really important in life. These women had spend more than 6 months of their life in poorest part of Africa, including Nairobi, Rwanda and Uganda helping. They were amazed by my life and livelyhood, infact I was embarrased because there I was and I couldn't tell them a single thing I have done to help. I was even more embarrased when they ask me how much I pay for the apartment I was staying in, yes $3500 a month they both are renting an $800 apartment in their home country so that they can travel all the way to help in my country and I am paying $3500 yet my country is starving? Something is not right.
mawinder
#17 Posted : Wednesday, January 16, 2013 9:17:43 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/30/2008
Posts: 6,029
Drunkard wrote:
I think helping is something we need to rethink in Africa because we seem not to find best ways to help or atleast we are so preoccupied with our own lifes to even think about the plight of people living around us or atleast our own plight.

About three weeks ago, I was enjoying my holiday with a bunch of good friends in a popular spot at the heart of the city and I run into two drunk beautiful white girls, both age 24 yrs and after a couple of drunk people hi5s we exchange numbers and later decide to take the drinking back to my place, me being greedy I decided to ditch my friends so that I can have two girls for myself( I have always wanted a threesome).

The night did not end in a threesome but in a complete reflection of who I am and what is really important in life. These women had spend more than 6 months of their life in poorest part of Africa, including Nairobi, Rwanda and Uganda helping. They were amazed by my life and livelyhood, infact I was embarrased because there I was and I couldn't tell them a single thing I have done to help. I was even more embarrased when they ask me how much I pay for the apartment I was staying in, yes $3500 a month they both are renting an $800 apartment in their home country so that they can travel all the way to help in my country and I am paying $3500 yet my country is starving? Something is not right.

You pay $3500 a month or it is a typo?You must have a net of $15000 a month.Kweli I am poor.
josiah33
#18 Posted : Wednesday, January 16, 2013 9:27:12 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 1/27/2011
Posts: 1,777
mawinder wrote:
Drunkard wrote:
I think helping is something we need to rethink in Africa because we seem not to find best ways to help or atleast we are so preoccupied with our own lifes to even think about the plight of people living around us or atleast our own plight.

About three weeks ago, I was enjoying my holiday with a bunch of good friends in a popular spot at the heart of the city and I run into two drunk beautiful white girls, both age 24 yrs and after a couple of drunk people hi5s we exchange numbers and later decide to take the drinking back to my place, me being greedy I decided to ditch my friends so that I can have two girls for myself( I have always wanted a threesome).

The night did not end in a threesome but in a complete reflection of who I am and what is really important in life. These women had spend more than 6 months of their life in poorest part of Africa, including Nairobi, Rwanda and Uganda helping. They were amazed by my life and livelyhood, infact I was embarrased because there I was and I couldn't tell them a single thing I have done to help. I was even more embarrased when they ask me how much I pay for the apartment I was staying in, yes $3500 a month they both are renting an $800 apartment in their home country so that they can travel all the way to help in my country and I am paying $3500 yet my country is starving? Something is not right.

You pay $3500 a month or it is a typo?You must have a net of $15000 a month.Kweli I am poor.

You are not alone @ mawinder, tuko wengi hapa.
josiah33
#19 Posted : Wednesday, January 16, 2013 9:30:29 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 1/27/2011
Posts: 1,777
tycho wrote:
Mukiri wrote:
You were not an intelligent 7 year old. Why didn't you turn and run?d'oh! You had the light, running would have been easier for you. Think


Hehehe! Maybe!

I rushed home to get my 'nunchaku' instead!

It's not that easy to break from a man's grip.

But then, for how long can one run with the light? Does it make sense to hide the light under the table?


Na hii 'nunchaku' ni nini sasa?
tycho
#20 Posted : Wednesday, January 16, 2013 9:35:51 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
josiah33 wrote:
tycho wrote:
Mukiri wrote:
You were not an intelligent 7 year old. Why didn't you turn and run?d'oh! You had the light, running would have been easier for you. Think


Hehehe! Maybe!

I rushed home to get my 'nunchaku' instead!

It's not that easy to break from a man's grip.

But then, for how long can one run with the light? Does it make sense to hide the light under the table?


Na hii 'nunchaku' ni nini sasa?


The chained thing that Bruce Lee swings in the movies.
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