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Liv
#21 Posted : Monday, November 26, 2012 2:27:18 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 11/14/2006
Posts: 1,311
eboomerang wrote:


Is it so difficult to comprehend that the parliamentarians AND NOT the citizens voted to have these cases sent to the Hague at their own volition? Some of those suspects are on public record saying that they chose to have the cases handled at the Hague? so why is it then a surprise that the cases ended up in the Hague and now we want to bring down the entire country to "bring" back the cases to home courts?


@Eboomerang,
I think you should not just yap without facts.

1) The constitution amendment bill of 12th February 2009 to establish a local tribunal for PEV required 145 MPs to pass.

Only 101 supported the bill and 93 rejected it.

Uhuru and Ruto were among those who supported this bill. Others included Kibaki and Raila. But they still could not get the 145 votes required.

2) Most of those MPs that voted against this bill actually thought that ICC was purely a justice court (all rulings are based on real and proved evidence like other courts of law) and not a political court as it has turned out to be.... reading from their utterances. They opposed the local tribunal because they thought then that it will result in a lot of witch hunting and justice would not be delivered.
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  | | Edit by user: Monday, November 26, 2012 2:52 PM | Reason: Not specified
Tebes
#22 Posted : Monday, November 26, 2012 2:39:35 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 11/26/2008
Posts: 2,097
Liv wrote:
For once in the last 20 years they will be on one side and this could be the start of the healing process and reconciliation in Rift valley, the hotspot of tribal crashes and this will be better for Kenya.
.


Wachana na threats and tribal politics
"Never regret, if its good, its wonderful. If its bad, its experience."
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  | | Edit by user: Monday, November 26, 2012 2:42 PM | Reason: Not specified
Liv
#23 Posted : Monday, November 26, 2012 2:43:22 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 11/14/2006
Posts: 1,311
Tebes wrote:
Liv wrote:
For once in the last 20 years they will be on one side and this could be the start of the healing process and reconciliation in Rift valley, the hotspot of tribal crashes and this will be better for Kenya.
.


Wachana na threats and tribal politics


Hahaha,
Jaduong, if you have nothing to say... don't say it here.
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  | | Edit by user: Monday, November 26, 2012 2:49 PM | Reason: Not specified
nostoppingthis
#24 Posted : Monday, November 26, 2012 2:45:01 PM
Rank: Chief

Joined: 8/24/2009
Posts: 5,909
Location: Nairobi
Tebes wrote:
Liv wrote:
For once in the last 20 years they will be on one side and this could be the start of the healing process and reconciliation in Rift valley, the hotspot of tribal crashes and this will be better for Kenya.
.


Wachana na threats and tribal politics


Peace comes to the heart through justice!!! It is not the absence of war!!!...or political unions of kingpins....

More than 62% of Kenyans were with Kibaki (2002) on one side....look at where we are now?
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  | | Edit by user: Monday, November 26, 2012 2:46 PM | Reason: Not specified
accelriskconsult
#25 Posted : Monday, November 26, 2012 3:07:21 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 4/2/2011
Posts: 629
Location: Nai
Liv wrote:
eboomerang wrote:


Is it so difficult to comprehend that the parliamentarians AND NOT the citizens voted to have these cases sent to the Hague at their own volition? Some of those suspects are on public record saying that they chose to have the cases handled at the Hague? so why is it then a surprise that the cases ended up in the Hague and now we want to bring down the entire country to "bring" back the cases to home courts?


@Eboomerang,
I think you should not just yap without facts.

1) The constitution amendment bill of 12th February 2009 to establish a local tribunal for PEV required 145 MPs to pass.

Only 101 supported the bill and 93 rejected it.

Uhuru and Ruto were among those who supported this bill. Others included Kibaki and Raila. But they still could not get the 145 votes required.

2) Most of those MPs that voted against this bill actually thought that ICC was purely a justice court (all rulings are based on real and proved evidence like other courts of law) and not a political court as it has turned out to be.... reading from their utterances. They opposed the local tribunal because they thought then that it will result in a lot of witch hunting and justice would not be delivered.



Boss where have you been living? Ruto led the MPs who opposed the bill
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WWW
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digitek1
#26 Posted : Monday, November 26, 2012 3:10:17 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 2/3/2010
Posts: 1,797
Location: Kenya
has @liv been hacked
I may be wrong..but then I could be right
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simonkabz
#27 Posted : Monday, November 26, 2012 3:12:21 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 3/2/2007
Posts: 8,776
Location: Cameroon
huyu liv ako na mashida jo.....unawesmake jamaa.
TULIA.........UFUNZWE!
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  | | Edit by user: Monday, November 26, 2012 3:13 PM | Reason: Not specified
Liv
#28 Posted : Monday, November 26, 2012 3:15:38 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 11/14/2006
Posts: 1,311
nostoppingthis wrote:

Peace comes to the heart through justice!!! It is not the absence of war!!!...or political unions of kingpins....

More than 62% of Kenyans were with Kibaki (2002) on one side....look at where we are now?


When a country has internal conflict, peace does not come through Justice in most cases.

If you read history, People came together and agreed to have peace. e.g. For the IRA conflict to be resolved one of the conditions was to have all prisoners released (These are people who had killed others through violence... but had to be freed for the peace agreement to hold.... never mind that they had killed so many people through "terrorism").

There are so many examples in History where people preferred to have peace at the expense of justice.
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Liv
#29 Posted : Monday, November 26, 2012 3:17:30 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 11/14/2006
Posts: 1,311
accelriskconsult wrote:



Boss where have you been living? Ruto led the MPs who opposed the bill
[/quote]

You are wrong.... please confirm through the parliamentary hansard.
WR has even said this so many times
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  | | Edit by user: Monday, November 26, 2012 3:20 PM | Reason: Not specified
tycho
#30 Posted : Monday, November 26, 2012 3:44:52 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
Liv wrote:
nostoppingthis wrote:

Peace comes to the heart through justice!!! It is not the absence of war!!!...or political unions of kingpins....

More than 62% of Kenyans were with Kibaki (2002) on one side....look at where we are now?


When a country has internal conflict, peace does not come through Justice in most cases.

If you read history, People came together and agreed to have peace. e.g. For the IRA conflict to be resolved one of the conditions was to have all prisoners released (These are people who had killed others through violence... but had to be freed for the peace agreement to hold.... never mind that they had killed so many people through "terrorism").

There are so many examples in History where people preferred to have peace at the expense of justice.



But can we say that such decisions have been deemed unfair by the people involved?

If that is not the case, then justice must have been met.
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  | | Edit by user: Monday, November 26, 2012 3:48 PM | Reason: Not specified
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