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UAP Group set to enter OTC shares market
Rank: Elder Joined: 1/21/2010 Posts: 6,675 Location: Nairobi
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Aguytrying wrote:My question is are these buildings, just UAP offices or they will be rent out or part sold. If its the later, then its ok. If its the former, its worrying. They have made it very clear that the buildings are for rent! Mark 12:29
Deuteronomy 4:16
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Rank: Chief Joined: 5/31/2011 Posts: 5,121
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Aguytrying wrote:mwekez@ji wrote:NBV - KES 38.72
EPS - KES 7.40
at the price of KES 60 we get:
P/B - 1.55x (compares well with industry)
P/E - 8.11x (expensive than industry but cheaper than CIC) add the extra shares of convertible bond and the EPS is diluted further. "The company disclosed that the convertible bonds held by the private equity funds will be converted into shares when the public offer is completed" Post-money valuationNBV - KES 44.31 EPS - KES 4.43 at the price of KES 60 we get: P/B - 1.35x (compares well with industry) P/E – 13.5x (very expensive compared with industry) Estimates show that post money, the earliest UAP can return to an EPS of KES 7.40 is FY2014 (2014 coincides with their listing in NSE by introduction)
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Rank: Chief Joined: 5/31/2011 Posts: 5,121
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Association of Kenya Insurers (AKI), has the following numbers on underwriting profit for 2011 1.UAP - 501,226,000 (2010; 105,062,000) – (Huge reap in 2011 courtesy of industrial fire & motor insurance classes) 2.Britam - 414,590,000 (2010; 152,411,000) - (Huge reap courtesy of commercial motor & personal accident insurance classes) 3.Jubilee - 376,601,000 (2010; 335,598,000) 4.CIC - 359,750,000 (2010; 163,339,000) – (Huge reap courtesy of commercial motor insurance class) 5.AIG - 201,595,000 (2010; 230,681,000) 6. …. Check AKI 2011 and 2010 Annual Reports at wazua@googlegroups.com
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Rank: Chief Joined: 5/31/2011 Posts: 5,121
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guru267 wrote:Aguytrying wrote:My question is are these buildings, just UAP offices or they will be rent out or part sold. If its the later, then its ok. If its the former, its worrying. They have made it very clear that the buildings are for rent! It’s expected that the allocation for property investments will lead to KES 600 M increase in annual rental income. That’s good return
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Rank: Chief Joined: 1/3/2007 Posts: 18,131 Location: Nairobi
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mwekez@ji wrote:Association of Kenya Insurers (AKI), has the following numbers on underwriting profit for 2011 1.UAP - 501,226,000 (2010; 105,062,000) – (Huge reap in 2011 courtesy of industrial fire & motor insurance classes) 2.Britam - 414,590,000 (2010; 152,411,000) - (Huge reap courtesy of commercial motor & personal accident insurance classes) 3.Jubilee - 376,601,000 (2010; 335,598,000) 4.CIC - 359,750,000 (2010; 163,339,000) – (Huge reap courtesy of commercial motor insurance class) 5.AIG - 201,595,000 (2010; 230,681,000) 6. …. Check AKI 2011 and 2010 Annual Reports at wazua@googlegroups.com Seems to me most Insurance Firms are 'massaging' the Underwriting Profits before listing! Jubilee (for whom I have great respect) is the only listed entity that is not manipulating numbers. AIG is not listed & doesn't play in the mud. For now. Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
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Rank: Elder Joined: 1/21/2010 Posts: 6,675 Location: Nairobi
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mwekez@ji wrote:Association of Kenya Insurers (AKI), has the following numbers on underwriting profit for 2011 1.UAP - 501,226,000 (2010; 105,062,000) – (Huge reap in 2011 courtesy of industrial fire & motor insurance classes) 2.Britam - 414,590,000 (2010; 152,411,000) - (Huge reap courtesy of commercial motor & personal accident insurance classes) 3.Jubilee - 376,601,000 (2010; 335,598,000) 4.CIC - 359,750,000 (2010; 163,339,000) – (Huge reap courtesy of commercial motor insurance class) 5.AIG - 201,595,000 (2010; 230,681,000) 6. …. Check AKI 2011 and 2010 Annual Reports at wazua@googlegroups.com Aren't these numbers for the Kenyan companies excluding regional subsidiaries?? Mark 12:29
Deuteronomy 4:16
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Rank: Member Joined: 2/8/2007 Posts: 808
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Either way avoid a composite insurance company that is heavily skewed to short term insurance. Short term insurance is a 1-5% operating margin business and this gets wiped up easily when the USD, YEN strengthening easily (spare parts increse in value, price of medicine) or medical inflation (increases in consultation and bed charges). A good portion of the Gross premiums is typically stuck in debtors suggesting limited funds for investment. Only AIG has a decent short term insurance business. Heritage comes close. The likes of Jubilee and Britam have done well because of life insurance which is what is a the insurance business to invest in, in kenya. The products are weak (non competitive returns), policyholders not too demanding meaning shareholders have shitloads of cash and margins to work with to grow their wealth.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 10/11/2009 Posts: 1,223
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UAP Public Offer details: Price: Ksh 60 per share The minimum number of shares for an individual is 2000 shares while for corporate is 10,000 shares. This Public Offer will not involve a listing of securities on the Nairobi Securities Exchange (NSE). However, it is intended that the Shares of UAP will be listed on the NSE within a period of 12 to 18 months. In the interim, UAP to be traded through an over the counter (OTC) market. History will not remember you for your IQ. It will remember you for what you did. “Genius is 1 percent inspiration, 99 percent perspiration.” Thomas Edison
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/6/2010 Posts: 289
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@BGL what is your opinion...
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 10/11/2009 Posts: 1,223
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gesowan wrote:@BGL what is your opinion... Well, i got no opinion on matters financial what i know is that i got some 120k to put in the public offer. As for cranking the numbers i can seek an opinion of @Hunderwear @mwekezaji or @the deal...hao ndio wanajua uhasibu. As long as Wambugu the UAP- kenya CEO is at the helm my money will yield a return. Mr Wambugu also happens to be the Chairman of MICL. History will not remember you for your IQ. It will remember you for what you did. “Genius is 1 percent inspiration, 99 percent perspiration.” Thomas Edison
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Rank: Elder Joined: 9/29/2006 Posts: 2,570
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BGL wrote:UAP Public Offer details:
Price: Ksh 60 per share
The minimum number of shares for an individual is 2000 shares while for corporate is 10,000 shares.
This Public Offer will not involve a listing of securities on the Nairobi Securities Exchange (NSE). However, it is intended that the Shares of UAP will be listed on the NSE within a period of 12 to 18 months. In the interim, UAP to be traded through an over the counter (OTC) market.
I hope it doesn't go TCL way which 'debutted' at 50. Hope coz I intend to put my 150k there. The opposite of courage is not cowardice, it's conformity.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 10/11/2009 Posts: 1,223
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The PO is on and all the info can be downloaded on their website. http://www.uap-group.com/po/prospectus.html
History will not remember you for your IQ. It will remember you for what you did. “Genius is 1 percent inspiration, 99 percent perspiration.” Thomas Edison
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/21/2007 Posts: 152 Location: Nairobi
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What is the current price of UAP shares at the OTC?
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 10/11/2009 Posts: 1,223
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Ilikeyou wrote:What is the current price of UAP shares at the OTC?
70bob History will not remember you for your IQ. It will remember you for what you did. “Genius is 1 percent inspiration, 99 percent perspiration.” Thomas Edison
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/21/2007 Posts: 152 Location: Nairobi
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BGL wrote:Ilikeyou wrote:What is the current price of UAP shares at the OTC?
70bob @BGL, Thanks so much
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Rank: Elder Joined: 9/29/2006 Posts: 2,570
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Ilikeyou wrote:BGL wrote:Ilikeyou wrote:What is the current price of UAP shares at the OTC?
70bob @BGL, Thanks so much that's abt 16% rise. cum baby cum! The opposite of courage is not cowardice, it's conformity.
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Rank: Member Joined: 6/26/2008 Posts: 384
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jerry wrote:Ilikeyou wrote:BGL wrote:Ilikeyou wrote:What is the current price of UAP shares at the OTC?
70bob @BGL, Thanks so much that's abt 16% rise. cum baby cum! What is the current price? Where can I get them?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 9/29/2006 Posts: 2,570
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xtina wrote:jerry wrote:Ilikeyou wrote:BGL wrote:Ilikeyou wrote:What is the current price of UAP shares at the OTC?
70bob @BGL, Thanks so much that's abt 16% rise. cum baby cum! What is the current price? Where can I get them? Alleged 90/= on another thread. What we need now is an IPO or a rights issue. The opposite of courage is not cowardice, it's conformity.
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Rank: Member Joined: 1/2/2008 Posts: 268 Location: Nairobi
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Where and how can one buy the UAP shares and what is the current price?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 9/29/2006 Posts: 2,570
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icecube wrote:Where and how can one buy the UAP shares and what is the current price? Lastly heard 86/=(43% above private offer of 60/=?) as "current" price, can't remember when. Can you realy buy OTC if not already in?! Go UNAITAS instead. The opposite of courage is not cowardice, it's conformity.
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UAP Group set to enter OTC shares market
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