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SK not bothered with draft constitution?
McReggae
#31 Posted : Wednesday, November 18, 2009 8:47:00 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 6/17/2008
Posts: 23,365
Location: Nairobi
Njung'e,

You can download a copy from either the Nation or Standard websites,quite fast!!!!!


The chief value of money lies in the fact that one lives in a world in which it is overestimated.
..."Wewe ni mtu mdogo sana....na mwenye amekuandika pia ni mtu mdogo sana!".
Njunge
#32 Posted : Wednesday, November 18, 2009 11:12:00 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 2/7/2007
Posts: 11,935
Location: Nairobi
@Mcreggae,
Thanks pal.......and this thing is damn big.....Nitamaliza in 29 days?.MK should declare a 29 day holiday....-:)

Old man about town....
Nothing great was ever achieved without enthusiasm.
sokomjinga
#33 Posted : Wednesday, November 18, 2009 11:30:00 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 4/5/2008
Posts: 183
There is too much emphasis being given to affirmative action,especially regarding the representation of women.

Why? This only leads to bloated assemblies!

The majority of Kenyans are women. Who has prevented them from electing women to parliament? Why do they elect men to parliament and then expect the same men to pass such laws to protect their rights. Are they not to blame in the first place?

Women should be educated about their rights and they should then exercise those rights the way they deem it fit.

Stop discriminating against men in the guise of protecting women's rights! They are not making use of their rights.



All beginnings are difficult ..... ..... everything has an end,only a sausage has two.
Taunet Neelel ..... New Beginning .....
Njunge
#34 Posted : Wednesday, November 18, 2009 2:15:00 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 2/7/2007
Posts: 11,935
Location: Nairobi
Just curious........I am hadly quarter way through this draft but i am seeing this phrase for the upteenth time,......'Parliament shall enact'......I am certain i will meet many more of this ahead.Simply said,much of the draft is not ready to be used once adopted.......Can this Mpigs be trusted not to twist what might be initially very good intention of CoE for their benefits?Are they likely to bring all this bills to parliament before 2050 given how slow they conduct business?.....Is there no way of getting this clauses entrenched in the constitution without involving parliament??.....Over to those in the know.

Old man about town....
Nothing great was ever achieved without enthusiasm.
miser
#35 Posted : Wednesday, November 18, 2009 6:59:00 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 7/7/2008
Posts: 124
And these are not capitals...capsules.....capulets......kofias....the works!!!Let us keep on dreaming about a new constitution!!!!

These are those big hardcover books with yellowing pages explaining those brief summaries in the draft.Lawyers in the house... akina skylat,tell us if its possible to have these caps for this draft in the next ten years!Only minimum reforms can save this nation.

And who said that we want a president and a prime minister?It should be one of them not both!So give us two drafts and we choose what kind of governance we want.....but am hallucinating!!

Share ideas for a better Kenya!!
Kusadikika
#36 Posted : Wednesday, November 18, 2009 8:07:00 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/22/2008
Posts: 2,721
Njung'e,
The biggest headache in constitution making is never so much the content but the process by which it has to be made. It is almost impossible to have a constitution without going through parliament.

Remember the reason why we never had the enactment of the Bomas Draft was because at the very beginning the Bomas Process itself was never entrenched in the constitution. The late Mirugi Kariuki and Koigi Wamwere tried to raise the issue at Bomas trying to urge the members to stop the process and go back to parliament and entrench the process in the constitution first but they were booed down as people who wanted to derail the process. That is how the case ended up in court and the Ringera ruling that ruled that the only way to get a new constitution is by voting for it in a referendum.

Parliament,however is still the supreme authority as far as constitution making is concerned. It has the powers to amend any part of the constitution. The catch is,in order to amend it two thirds of ALL MPs must agree. That is a 145 members. Remember other bills pass by majority vote of members present so that if there are 40 members in the house you need only 21 and you are through.

As I understand it all we have now is a draft that will be subjected to debate and modified accordingly before its final submission to the public vote in a referendum.

Weusi wa nywele za mshtakiwa zaonyesha ujinga alio nao
Kusadikika
#37 Posted : Thursday, November 19, 2009 12:55:00 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/22/2008
Posts: 2,721
Maoni Yangu

I will reject and will advice anybody who seeks my opinion to reject any document that has any mention of the position of Prime Minister. It is naive of us to think that we have political parties (i.e. political organisations with fundamentally different ideologies on issues of governance). What we have are tribal groupings.

The objective of curtailing presidential abuse of power can be achieved by subjecting his appointments to a vetting process by parliament and strengthening the parliamentary watchdog committees but creating 2 centres of power is in my opinion dangerous. When the electorate votes in a president they are appointing the 'buck stopper'. This is where the 'buck stops'. A situation in which we don't know who to hold responsible for what is breeding crowd for anarchy.

Introducing all those other houses ati sijui Senate and that kind of thing is to me unnecessary and wasteful. We will just be stratifying the current parliament and creating more expensive structures. The leaner the government the better. I don't see the point of abolishing the current provincial administration only to replace it with other structures with different names.

All this can be achieved with just amendments to the current constitution and no need for a new one. All the other nice things in the new constitution like dual citizenship and limiting cabinet positions can also be amended into the old one.

It looks like what am saying is: MIMI SITAKI KATIBA MPYA. NATAKA MABADILIKO FULANI KWA KATIBA ILIYOKO.



Weusi wa nywele za mshtakiwa zaonyesha ujinga alio nao
Ezzo
#38 Posted : Thursday, November 19, 2009 1:51:00 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 3/17/2009
Posts: 7
I know we Kenyans are religious and all that,even the pre-amble to the new Constitution aptly says ' we the people of Kenya acknowledge the supremacy of Almighty God...' Are we just assuming that everybody believes in God? i.e Hindus have many gods. Then again it comes back to say that the religion should be separate from the state. Duh? How can that be?

BMW
Ezzo
#39 Posted : Thursday, November 19, 2009 1:55:00 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 3/17/2009
Posts: 7
i kinda like it. But whats with the senate? We do not have to do everything the U.S way. Am concerned with the cost of supporting such largesse? Or is this just a 'creation' of jobs for the 'youth'

BMW
Magigi
#40 Posted : Thursday, November 19, 2009 6:14:00 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 3/31/2008
Posts: 7,081
Location: Kenya
...why are there no definitions in the constitution? Who is a child,youth,elderly,man,woman etc Aren't these definitions important?
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