wazua Fri, Apr 3, 2026
Welcome Guest Search | Active Topics | Log In

3 Pages123>
List of companies that conspire to defraud shareholders
Sure
#1 Posted : Thursday, November 24, 2011 9:42:20 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 9/9/2010
Posts: 546
Location: Garissa
CMC is under investigation. So, we are yet to see the last of it.

Which other quoted companies at the stock market do we need to be wary of?

Someone suggested Sasini, Sameer and Neveready either because they share a common leading shareholder or he had vested interest in them. But some adequate data or information needs to be discussed before a clearer picture emerges.

Audit firms which have dealt with conniving companies should also be named and shamed. Deloitte has already lost its reputation for not seeing the rot in CMC. They received payments yr in yr out for incompetent auditing jobs at the company either because they were sharing in the loot or turned a blind eye in order to retain the contract with the company.

Holy shit, why would anyone pay millions of shillings to an auditor who cannot even smell a rat? It means the firm is a rat itself. Hopeless case.

In the history of the stock market, has any auditor ever blown the whistle to warn shareholders that the company under scope is being bled by directors or management?

Pricewaterhouse failed to warn shareholders about Uchumi's demise. I have been trying to get the last Financial report to see if they stated that Uchumi was a going concern for the next one or so years. Anyone with a copy?

One suspect I have to present a case against is KK. With Bicholas having initially been a serious owner of the company (that guy could be as dirty as the bull of Auckland) and current duo Chairmanship and CEO status of one Sacob Jegman, they must be having a Vise Grip on the company and no shareholder can know who pees in the corner office.

CMA, you have to wake up like yesterday. But with Gatabaki pretending to be a strict enforcer, (Remember he was ousted from HF for inefficiency and strong headedness) nothing much will come out of it as he is part and parcel of the baggage that is the dirty old men of corporate Kenya.
Wisdom to detect when share prices hit rock bottom.
When interest on bonds keep going up, you know the bear run is on high street. When interest on bonds start leveling, the bear has met the bull and they have hit rock bottom. When the interest rates on bonds start coming down, the bull has overpowered the bear and you better be riding the bull.
accelriskconsult
#2 Posted : Thursday, November 24, 2011 10:02:17 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 4/2/2011
Posts: 629
Location: Nai
Sure wrote:
CMC is under investigation. So, we are yet to see the last of it.

Which other quoted companies at the stock market do we need to be wary of?

Someone suggested Sasini, Sameer and Neveready either because they share a common leading shareholder or he had vested interest in them. But some adequate data or information needs to be discussed before a clearer picture emerges.

Audit firms which have dealt with conniving companies should also be named and shamed. Deloitte has already lost its reputation for not seeing the rot in CMC. They received payments yr in yr out for incompetent auditing jobs at the company either because they were sharing in the loot or turned a blind eye in order to retain the contract with the company.

Holy shit, why would anyone pay millions of shillings to an auditor who cannot even smell a rat? It means the firm is a rat itself. Hopeless case.

In the history of the stock market, has any auditor ever blown the whistle to warn shareholders that the company under scope is being bled by directors or management?

Pricewaterhouse failed to warn shareholders about Uchumi's demise. I have been trying to get the last Financial report to see if they stated that Uchumi was a going concern for the next one or so years. Anyone with a copy?

One suspect I have to present a case against is KK. With Bicholas having initially been a serious owner of the company (that guy could be as dirty as the bull of Auckland) and current duo Chairmanship and CEO status of one Sacob Jegman, they must be having a Vise Grip on the company and no shareholder can know who pees in the corner office.

CMA, you have to wake up like yesterday. But with Gatabaki pretending to be a strict enforcer, (Remember he was ousted from HF for inefficiency and strong headedness) nothing much will come out of it as he is part and parcel of the baggage that is the dirty old men of corporate Kenya.



As already discussed elsewhere in Wazua, there is no audit procedure that Deloitte could have carried out to uncover offshore bank accounts that were not in the CMC's books of accounts.
Kihangeri
#3 Posted : Thursday, November 24, 2011 10:18:05 AM
Rank: User

Joined: 11/10/2010
Posts: 550
Location: Junction
accelriskconsult wrote:

As already discussed elsewhere in Wazua, there is no audit procedure that Deloitte could have carried out to uncover offshore bank accounts that were not in the CMC's books of accounts.


Are you defending the thugs?

When you do auditing, the results are used to give a clear picture of the status of a company financially. For example, they should have highlighted the fact that the company was leaking cash from uncompetitive logistics and supply contracts.

If you look at the books, the obvious picture that would emerge when you sell more cars is better profits. Instead, even after selling 150 Passats, the idiots did not reflect an appreciation in profits. Why?

That is when the auditors would have informed shareholders that they could not guarantee the company to be a going concern as it was leaking from the rear end, front and under. Tell tail signs are always there. If they can steal from the source of the vehicles, what would stop them from stealing from the selling point and by extension other funds made available to them by shareholders locally?
By inference, the man is all that Mr Phantom is not: an untrustworthy radical, divisive, too many enemies, a dictator, and a persistent liar...
Gaitho dialogues.


gathinga
#4 Posted : Thursday, November 24, 2011 10:35:12 AM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 11/30/2006
Posts: 635
accelriskconsult wrote:
Sure wrote:
CMC is under investigation. So, we are yet to see the last of it.

Which other quoted companies at the stock market do we need to be wary of?

Someone suggested Sasini, Sameer and Neveready either because they share a common leading shareholder or he had vested interest in them. But some adequate data or information needs to be discussed before a clearer picture emerges.

Audit firms which have dealt with conniving companies should also be named and shamed. Deloitte has already lost its reputation for not seeing the rot in CMC. They received payments yr in yr out for incompetent auditing jobs at the company either because they were sharing in the loot or turned a blind eye in order to retain the contract with the company.

Holy shit, why would anyone pay millions of shillings to an auditor who cannot even smell a rat? It means the firm is a rat itself. Hopeless case.

In the history of the stock market, has any auditor ever blown the whistle to warn shareholders that the company under scope is being bled by directors or management?

Pricewaterhouse failed to warn shareholders about Uchumi's demise. I have been trying to get the last Financial report to see if they stated that Uchumi was a going concern for the next one or so years. Anyone with a copy?

One suspect I have to present a case against is KK. With Bicholas having initially been a serious owner of the company (that guy could be as dirty as the bull of Auckland) and current duo Chairmanship and CEO status of one Sacob Jegman, they must be having a Vise Grip on the company and no shareholder can know who pees in the corner office.

CMA, you have to wake up like yesterday. But with Gatabaki pretending to be a strict enforcer, (Remember he was ousted from HF for inefficiency and strong headedness) nothing much will come out of it as he is part and parcel of the baggage that is the dirty old men of corporate Kenya.



As already discussed elsewhere in Wazua, there is no audit procedure that Deloitte could have carried out to uncover offshore bank accounts that were not in the CMC's books of accounts.



This is not entirely factual
Every external auditor has a duty to do a industry/sector comparison of the company they are auditing. For the case of CMC, what are the industry rates for rebates/supplier discounts. If Deloitte had done this, they would have discovered that CMC has much lower margins compared with peers in the industry, indicating poor negotiation of collusion with suppliers and management.

With this line, TOTAL is the other culprit where shareholders are being shafted. How are they reporting losses while their peers(KK) is reporting supernormal profits growth even for the kenya business segment? Same operating environment. and looking at their margins, something isn't straight with TOTAL'S books. And who are their auditors?



2012
#5 Posted : Thursday, November 24, 2011 10:39:24 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 12/9/2009
Posts: 6,592
Location: Nairobi
Sure wrote:
Holy shit, why would anyone pay millions of shillings to an auditor who cannot even smell a rat?


Maybe they are paid to close their nose if you know what I mean.

BBI will solve it
:)
simonkabz
#6 Posted : Thursday, November 24, 2011 11:58:36 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 3/2/2007
Posts: 8,776
Location: Cameroon
Define Auditing.....(I thought detection of fraud aint their objective)
TULIA.........UFUNZWE!
accelriskconsult
#7 Posted : Thursday, November 24, 2011 11:58:58 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 4/2/2011
Posts: 629
Location: Nai
gathinga wrote:
accelriskconsult wrote:
Sure wrote:
CMC is under investigation. So, we are yet to see the last of it.

Which other quoted companies at the stock market do we need to be wary of?

Someone suggested Sasini, Sameer and Neveready either because they share a common leading shareholder or he had vested interest in them. But some adequate data or information needs to be discussed before a clearer picture emerges.

Audit firms which have dealt with conniving companies should also be named and shamed. Deloitte has already lost its reputation for not seeing the rot in CMC. They received payments yr in yr out for incompetent auditing jobs at the company either because they were sharing in the loot or turned a blind eye in order to retain the contract with the company.

Holy shit, why would anyone pay millions of shillings to an auditor who cannot even smell a rat? It means the firm is a rat itself. Hopeless case.

In the history of the stock market, has any auditor ever blown the whistle to warn shareholders that the company under scope is being bled by directors or management?

Pricewaterhouse failed to warn shareholders about Uchumi's demise. I have been trying to get the last Financial report to see if they stated that Uchumi was a going concern for the next one or so years. Anyone with a copy?

One suspect I have to present a case against is KK. With Bicholas having initially been a serious owner of the company (that guy could be as dirty as the bull of Auckland) and current duo Chairmanship and CEO status of one Sacob Jegman, they must be having a Vise Grip on the company and no shareholder can know who pees in the corner office.

CMA, you have to wake up like yesterday. But with Gatabaki pretending to be a strict enforcer, (Remember he was ousted from HF for inefficiency and strong headedness) nothing much will come out of it as he is part and parcel of the baggage that is the dirty old men of corporate Kenya.



As already discussed elsewhere in Wazua, there is no audit procedure that Deloitte could have carried out to uncover offshore bank accounts that were not in the CMC's books of accounts.



This is not entirely factual
Every external auditor has a duty to do a industry/sector comparison of the company they are auditing. For the case of CMC, what are the industry rates for rebates/supplier discounts. If Deloitte had done this, they would have discovered that CMC has much lower margins compared with peers in the industry, indicating poor negotiation of collusion with suppliers and management.

With this line, TOTAL is the other culprit where shareholders are being shafted. How are they reporting losses while their peers(KK) is reporting supernormal profits growth even for the kenya business segment? Same operating environment. and looking at their margins, something isn't straight with TOTAL'S books. And who are their auditors?




Kihangeri and Gathige si kwa ubaya but I am speaking as an expert on this matter. The external auditors' sole responsibility in expressing an opinion is to state whether a company's books of accounts are free of material misstatement.

The responsibility to ensure that shareholders are not shafted rests with the board of directors. The board of directors can of course delegate this responsibility to internal auditors (who would be expected to discover that a company was being overcharged and do something about it).
gathinga
#8 Posted : Thursday, November 24, 2011 12:26:26 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 11/30/2006
Posts: 635
accelriskconsult wrote:
gathinga wrote:
accelriskconsult wrote:
Sure wrote:
CMC is under investigation. So, we are yet to see the last of it.

Which other quoted companies at the stock market do we need to be wary of?

Someone suggested Sasini, Sameer and Neveready either because they share a common leading shareholder or he had vested interest in them. But some adequate data or information needs to be discussed before a clearer picture emerges.

Audit firms which have dealt with conniving companies should also be named and shamed. Deloitte has already lost its reputation for not seeing the rot in CMC. They received payments yr in yr out for incompetent auditing jobs at the company either because they were sharing in the loot or turned a blind eye in order to retain the contract with the company.

Holy shit, why would anyone pay millions of shillings to an auditor who cannot even smell a rat? It means the firm is a rat itself. Hopeless case.

In the history of the stock market, has any auditor ever blown the whistle to warn shareholders that the company under scope is being bled by directors or management?

Pricewaterhouse failed to warn shareholders about Uchumi's demise. I have been trying to get the last Financial report to see if they stated that Uchumi was a going concern for the next one or so years. Anyone with a copy?

One suspect I have to present a case against is KK. With Bicholas having initially been a serious owner of the company (that guy could be as dirty as the bull of Auckland) and current duo Chairmanship and CEO status of one Sacob Jegman, they must be having a Vise Grip on the company and no shareholder can know who pees in the corner office.

CMA, you have to wake up like yesterday. But with Gatabaki pretending to be a strict enforcer, (Remember he was ousted from HF for inefficiency and strong headedness) nothing much will come out of it as he is part and parcel of the baggage that is the dirty old men of corporate Kenya.



As already discussed elsewhere in Wazua, there is no audit procedure that Deloitte could have carried out to uncover offshore bank accounts that were not in the CMC's books of accounts.



This is not entirely factual
Every external auditor has a duty to do a industry/sector comparison of the company they are auditing. For the case of CMC, what are the industry rates for rebates/supplier discounts. If Deloitte had done this, they would have discovered that CMC has much lower margins compared with peers in the industry, indicating poor negotiation of collusion with suppliers and management.

With this line, TOTAL is the other culprit where shareholders are being shafted. How are they reporting losses while their peers(KK) is reporting supernormal profits growth even for the kenya business segment? Same operating environment. and looking at their margins, something isn't straight with TOTAL'S books. And who are their auditors?




Kihangeri and Gathige si kwa ubaya but I am speaking as an expert on this matter. The external auditors' sole responsibility in expressing an opinion is to state whether a company's books of accounts are free of material misstatement.

The responsibility to ensure that shareholders are not shafted rests with the board of directors. The board of directors can of course delegate this responsibility to internal auditors (who would be expected to discover that a company was being overcharged and do something about it).


acel. thanks for this. In today's business world, we sign all kinds of disclaimers to protect our interests. Sometimes we cant escape moral blame even by flashing those disclaimers. this case is one of those

The auditors responsibility includes 'assessing the risk of material misstatement of financial statements, whether due to fraud or error. In the CMC case, the indicators of possible misstatement in the books were so open, only the auditors could not see them.

The best way out for the auditors would have been to fall to the 'excuse' of limitation of scope in obtaining the information they required to form an opinion.

Why did they not report about the conflict of interest between the BOD and senior mgt. The CEO son was also an MD of one of the subsidiaries!
2012
#9 Posted : Thursday, November 24, 2011 12:42:58 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 12/9/2009
Posts: 6,592
Location: Nairobi
simonkabz wrote:
Define Auditing.....(I thought detection of fraud aint their objective)


So their work is to rubber stamp whatever they are told?

BBI will solve it
:)
Kihangeri
#10 Posted : Thursday, November 24, 2011 1:13:54 PM
Rank: User

Joined: 11/10/2010
Posts: 550
Location: Junction
2012 wrote:
simonkabz wrote:
Define Auditing.....(I thought detection of fraud aint their objective)


So their work is to rubber stamp whatever they are told?


And lick the directors rear end if asked to do so?

Detection and Prevention of Frauds: Frauds are always committed deliberately and intentionally to defraud the proprietors of the organization. If the frauds remain undetected, they may affect the opinion of the auditor on the financial condition and the working results of the organization. It is, therefore, necessary that the auditor should exercise utmost care to detect such frauds.

Now that Pricewaterhouse is auditing CMC records, what is the objective? Ask Bill Lay and he will tell you.

Africans are inherently disadvantaged in seeing reality for what it is.
By inference, the man is all that Mr Phantom is not: an untrustworthy radical, divisive, too many enemies, a dictator, and a persistent liar...
Gaitho dialogues.


3 Pages123>
Forum Jump  
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

Copyright © 2026 Wazua.co.ke. All Rights Reserved.