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Overpopulation - the fallacy
Rank: Elder Joined: 8/11/2010 Posts: 1,588
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I saw this thread by eboomerang http://wazua.com/forum.a...&t=14535#post209735
and on that interesting article ‘Plan your family or we will halt free primary education project’Of course I topped it by reading the usual charlatans and observed their favorite cartoon  So I got on calculating and came with interesting results. world population estimated at 6.94 billion. Round off to 7 billion people. Assuming each person is to be given a generous 50x50 square metres = 2500 sq m, then 7 billion people would occupy approximately 17,500,000,000,000 sq meters. That would mean each person, his wife (or her husband) each of their children, each of their brothers you get the drift, all persons even the new born gets a 50x50 sq metres piece of land for life. I think that is a reasonable size, its no use having extra land you dont need...... Converting that to sq kilometres all the world population today would occupy only 17,500,000 sq kilometres. Africa alone is 30,221,532 sq kilometres. If everybody was to stay in Africa today each person in his house on his given 50x50 sq metre plot, all the world population would not fill Africa, even after giving generous allowance for the rivers and lakes, mountain tops and deserts and perhaps al shabaab. And the other continents Australia, Asia, Europe, North, Central and South America will lie empty and fallow to be used entirely for food or other suitable entreprise if desired. Not counting Arctic and Antarctica.... and of course the still free land in Africa and the area being freed up by death......... So where is this 'over population' hype coming from? Something is seriously wrong with the way the world is currently set up. Somebody is complicating things somewhere. This is definitely not how our creator created this world to be. I beg to be corrected, maybe I am wrong!
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 12/23/2010 Posts: 1,229
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Bring the argument home. Tell us that Kenya is in no danger of overpopulation - down to the household level. If I live in the country with the best economy in the world, does it mean that I can go ahead and bring forth many children because my country is rich? It boils down to what resources you have at your disposal and what population you can afford to sustain with those resources. I cant budget with what Bill Gates owns just because it forms part of the earth. I budget with what I have control over.
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Rank: Member Joined: 6/17/2011 Posts: 229
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Rank: Elder Joined: 8/11/2010 Posts: 1,588
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For Sport wrote:Bring the argument home. Tell us that Kenya is in no danger of overpopulation - down to the household level. If I live in the country with the best economy in the world, does it mean that I can go ahead and bring forth many children because my country is rich? It boils down to what resources you have at your disposal and what population you can afford to sustain with those resources. I cant budget with what Bill Gates owns just because it forms part of the earth. I budget with what I have control over. Yes, I know. But I dont even know where home is, lol. That is a good pin to my wishful balloon. We have to live in this world as it is....I am saying that as if we have a choice, but I believe is enough to go around for everyone. Eco, I agree, the concept is true and real, but I still believe there should be enough to go round for everyone, making do with what is available in a comfortable manner, thats all. I might be branded a socialist or worse communist! for these views.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/27/2007 Posts: 2,768
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@ yesuwangu, consider this: Earth's dry land surface area = 93,000,000sq.km Earth's surface area under forest cover = 28,000,000sq.km Earth's surface area under mountains = 19,000,000sq.km Earth's surface area under game reserve = 13,000,000sq.km Earth's surface area under roads and road reserves = 3,000,000sq.km Earth's surface area under antarctica = 9,000,000sq.km Earth's surface area under unhabitable desert = 9,000,000sq.km Earth's surface area under food cultivation= 9,000,000sq.km Earth's surface suitable for housing(uncultivated land, cities and towns) = 3,000,000sq.km = 3,000,000,000,000sq.m with a population of 7,000,000,000...the land distribution per capita is 3,000b/7b = 430sq.mso under the present circumstances, if everyone was to get a share of the earth's land surface, each would be entitled to only 430sq.m or about 70 feet by 70 feet!!!! ...besides, the presence of a safe alone does not signify that there is money inside...
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 12/23/2010 Posts: 1,229
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Kaigangio wrote:@ yesuwangu,
... so under the present circumstances, if everyone was to get a share of the earth's land surface, each would be entitled to only 430sq.m or about 70 feet by 70 feet!!!! Thank God for apartments.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 12/23/2010 Posts: 1,229
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Closer home.... "Every day, the numbers swell at the camp that was started about 19 years ago. Apart from the new arrivals from neighbouring Somalia, there are newborns, arriving faster each day, threatening to overburden the very basic resources. Indeed those born the year the camp was set up are hitting marriage age. The life cycle goes unaltered due to little intake of family planning. It is normal to encounter a woman in her early 30s with up to 12 children..." Having many children now mark of honour among refugees
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Rank: Elder Joined: 8/11/2010 Posts: 1,588
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Interesting numbers you have here, Kaigangio. Mind sharing where you obtained them? Anyway, that was what I gathered from For Sport earlier. That is the current state of the world today, I agree. But I am not sure if Antarctica is dry land. I think it should not make the list. I would then play around with your figures and adjust the available land for settlement as 3m sq km + 9m sq km = 12m sq km. The distribution would then be 12,000b / 7b = 1,714 sq m per person, 786 sq m shy of my 2,500 sq m. Be that as it may, Universe Today tells me land surface of the earth is land 149 million sq km. The total earth surface area is 510 million sq km of which water covers 361 million sq km. Therefore, there is a discrepancy in your figure of the dry land surface, a difference of 56 m sq km or 6 Antarctics.... How can I put it.....we (humankind / civilization) are in this situation because of choices we (humankind) made in the past. How different would it be if we (humankind / civilization) did not make those choices? Would all the 7b persons have a comfortable life? I think so. But let us prove or disprove.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/27/2007 Posts: 2,768
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Kaigangio wrote:@ yesuwangu,
consider this:
Earth's dry land surface area = 93,000,000sq.km
Earth's surface area under forest cover = 28,000,000sq.km
Earth's surface area under mountains = 19,000,000sq.km
Earth's surface area under game reserve = 13,000,000sq.km
Earth's surface area under roads and road reserves = 3,000,000sq.km
Earth's surface area under antarctica = 9,000,000sq.km
Earth's surface area under unhabitable desert = 9,000,000sq.km
Earth's surface area under food cultivation= 9,000,000sq.km
Earth's surface suitable for housing(uncultivated land, cities and towns) = 3,000,000sq.km = 3,000,000,000,000sq.m
with a population of 7,000,000,000...the land distribution per capita is 3,000b/7b = 430sq.m
so under the present circumstances, if everyone was to get a share of the earth's land surface, each would be entitled to only 430sq.m or about 70 feet by 70 feet!!!! @ yesuwangu, a conversion factor of 1.6 was inadvertently omitted...this is the true scenario Earth's dry land surface area = 148,800,000sq.km Earth's surface area under forest cover = 44,800,000sq.km Earth's surface area under mountains = 30,400,000sq.km Earth's surface area under game reserve = 20,800,000sq.km Earth's surface area under roads and road reserves = 4,800,000sq.km Earth's surface area under antarctica = 14,400,000sq.km Earth's surface area under unhabitable desert = 14,400,000sq.km Earth's surface area under food cultivation= 14,400,000sq.km Earth's surface suitable for housing(uncultivated land, cities and towns) = 4,800,000sq.km = 4,800,000,000,000sq.m with a population of 7,000,000,000...the land distribution per capita is 4,800b/7b = 700sq.mso under the present circumstances, if everyone was to get a share of the earth's land surface, each would be entitled to only 700sq.m or about 88 feet by 88 feet!!! thanks for the correction... for your information antarctica is considered a dry land although it is covered by ice!!! a fact....if everyone on earth lived the same kind of life and occupy an identical space as americans in the USA do, we would need 12 planets the size of earth...as for canada we would require 3 planets...!!! ...besides, the presence of a safe alone does not signify that there is money inside...
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Rank: Elder Joined: 8/11/2010 Posts: 1,588
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Ok. Fair enough. But I still beg to know where the figures are from. Now, using those figures nevertheless, lets consider the superb looking Greenspan Estate in Savannah, Nairobi. A 2 bedroom apartment there measures approximately 950 sq ft while a 3 bedroom apartment measures approximately 1,200 sq ft. A 3 bedroom maisonette there measures approximately 1,500 sq ft. So a human being can live quite decently in a 1,500 sq ft dwelling. They are quite nice as you can see from that link. This is less than the 88ft x 88ft = 7,744 sq ft you give him. See? The problem is that everyone in the world wants to live as Americans do, with even hundreds of thousands of sq ft per person. Other people then obviously have to give up their space to let this happen, and this is what is happening. We would definitely need the 12 earths in that regard, very true. This is the 'over population' 'population explosion' we get to hear. We hear it from their side and we buy it and they tell us 'you must control it'. What if everyone in the world, all the 7 billion people, lived in Greenspan Estate type dwelling? (and they are quite nice dwellings) with each having a maximum of 1,500 sq ft? We would then still have 4.8m sq km under roads, 14.4m sq km under cultivation, 20.8m sq km under game reserves, 44.8m sq km under forests............all of those goodies and the land under food cultivation for once would be more than land under settlement! And with extra land to spare! Maybe I am being simplistic but I still am of the opinion that there is enough to go around all the 7 billion people in the planet and I still risk being called a socialist...lol.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 12/23/2010 Posts: 1,229
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YesuWangu wrote:...and I still risk being called a socialist...lol. Only way this would be workable is if we become. (socialists).
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/2/2011 Posts: 4,818 Location: -1.2107, 36.8831
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 Receive with simplicity everything that happens to you.” ― Rashi
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Rank: Elder Joined: 11/7/2007 Posts: 2,182
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kwani how do Americans live? such that we will require 12 planets? LOVE WHAT YOU DO, DO WHAT YOU LOVE.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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kyt wrote:kwani how do Americans live? such that we will require 12 planets? Large. They value personal space. "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore .
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Rank: Elder Joined: 11/7/2007 Posts: 2,182
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murchr wrote:kyt wrote:kwani how do Americans live? such that we will require 12 planets? Large. They value personal space. all of them? LOVE WHAT YOU DO, DO WHAT YOU LOVE.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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kyt wrote:murchr wrote:kyt wrote:kwani how do Americans live? such that we will require 12 planets? Large. They value personal space. all of them? Its a culture, space is very important to them. Then it gets exaggerated in states like Texas thats why you're seeing the Houston bit being ridiculous "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore .
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/17/2009 Posts: 3,583 Location: Kenya
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murchr wrote:kyt wrote:kwani how do Americans live? such that we will require 12 planets? Large. They value personal space. around 80% of americans live in cities, i.e suburban dwellings and appartments.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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nakujua wrote:murchr wrote:kyt wrote:kwani how do Americans live? such that we will require 12 planets? Large. They value personal space. around 80% of americans live in cities, i.e suburban dwellings and appartments. Have you been in a TYPICAL American suburb or apartment? What you call apartments here are flats or what Americans would call "projects" Those who live in the suburbs dont share walls "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore .
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/17/2009 Posts: 3,583 Location: Kenya
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murchr wrote:nakujua wrote:murchr wrote:kyt wrote:kwani how do Americans live? such that we will require 12 planets? Large. They value personal space. around 80% of americans live in cities, i.e suburban dwellings and appartments. Have you been in a TYPICAL American suburb or apartment? What you call apartments here are flats or what Americans would call "projects" Those who live in the suburbs dont share walls no I have never been to a typical american suburb or apartment, why do you ask ?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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nakujua wrote:murchr wrote:nakujua wrote:murchr wrote:kyt wrote:kwani how do Americans live? such that we will require 12 planets? Large. They value personal space. around 80% of americans live in cities, i.e suburban dwellings and appartments. Have you been in a TYPICAL American suburb or apartment? What you call apartments here are flats or what Americans would call "projects" Those who live in the suburbs dont share walls no I have never been to a typical american suburb or apartment, why do you ask ? Then you have no idea what the conversation here is all about "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore .
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