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Kenya's ultimate solution
aemathenge
#11 Posted : Saturday, August 06, 2011 9:34:54 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/18/2008
Posts: 3,434
Location: Kerugoya
@2012 and @Tycho,

It is very rare these days to chance upon a thread where a good argument does not degenerate into insults and vulgarity.

I am deeply impressed. Well done gentlemen. You make me proud to be a citizen of the virtue republic of Wazua.

Well done gentlemen, well done.
tycho
#12 Posted : Saturday, August 06, 2011 10:36:27 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
@jasonhill,

I am not advocating for a substitution of English with sheng. But rather, my attempt is aimed to the many people who are not schooled enough to use english as a technological tool.

Besides, sheng has a dexterity that english does not have. 'We' can add words to the sheng dictionary, but can we do the same to an english dictionary?

Kenyans may be better english speakers than the Japanese, the Chinese, and the Indians, but this facility has surely not added much to our technological capacities.

We will speak fluent english when necessary, but we need a language of own to help us synthesize the vast amounts of information available on cyberspace, and to use it to solve our problems.

@aemathenge,

Thank you.
jasonhill
#13 Posted : Sunday, August 07, 2011 3:35:03 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 1/22/2011
Posts: 322
Location: Chicago, IL, USA
@Tycho,

Most of the internet is in English. All of the programming tools and languages are in English. The Operating systems and major software packages are in English, with usually poor translations into other mainstream languages. The fact that Kenyans have such a great grasp of the English language is what will allow Kenya, with proper vision and corporate leadership, to surpass India in Business Process Outsourcing.

To interface with the rest of the world, which is a requirement of every nation and every people now-a-days in order to remain relevant, connected, and to advance, one must use English, if for no other reason because it is a commonly-known language. If one isn't schooled in it, then one should get schooled in it if one wants to be more connected to the world.

Please give me an example of phrases that you are thinking of for which there is no English equivalent, and the context of which they absolutely must be communicated in one or two words, and cannot be effectively explained in English, and then maybe I will understand better what you mean. But solutions to our problems don't lie in the words we use, they lie in what is in our hearts and minds, and a different set of words won't allow us to trust each other, love ourselves, and to reject that which is not expedient in furthering not just our individual selves, but Kenya and the rest of East Africa. That's not words, that's ACTIONS.

Best,

Hill
tycho
#14 Posted : Sunday, August 07, 2011 4:53:34 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
@jasonhill,
I agree that the solutions to our problems lie in our minds and hearts, and that we need to trust each other, and more so, love one another.

But what lies in our hearts and minds, are beliefs,thoughts,expectations...things that are made of words.

In order to act we must first 'speak.'

There are very many Kenyans who have not gone past class 8 and are not so proficient in the use of the English language. Most of them are unemployed, and in many instances they are approaching unemployability.

Yet we need them to participate actively in making social and economic decisions that will raise their incomes, and generally improve their standards of living. How will we get access to them, without losing a lot of time taking them back to class to learn English?

Since developing Kenya needs both the 'well' educated and the 'less' educated working together, it follows that it is much easier for the former to 'bend' to the level of the latter than to have the latter rise to the level of the former; at least in the short term when costs are high and fixed.

It is very difficult to explain 'social network' to an average youth in Kibera, and it should be much harder in the 'nethers.' To do so you need metaphors that are common to him/her, and these metaphors are mostly in sheng, or can be very easily transmitted in sheng.

Finally, I think sheng as a language presents a world view. That it has been created and that it has evolved implies it's necessity. I believe that this necessity comes out of the need for a 'median world' in the context of the conflict between Western civilization, and our 'Black experience.'

By using sheng we will be getting closer to the rest of the world.
masukuma
#15 Posted : Sunday, August 07, 2011 6:02:47 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
PLO summed it up in my signature! there in lies our problem.
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
masukuma
#16 Posted : Sunday, August 07, 2011 6:10:44 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
jasonhill wrote:
@Tycho,

Most of the internet is in English. All of the programming tools and languages are in English. The Operating systems and major software packages are in English, with usually poor translations into other mainstream languages. The fact that Kenyans have such a great grasp of the English language is what will allow Kenya, with proper vision and corporate leadership, to surpass India in Business Process Outsourcing.

To interface with the rest of the world, which is a requirement of every nation and every people now-a-days in order to remain relevant, connected, and to advance, one must use English, if for no other reason because it is a commonly-known language. If one isn't schooled in it, then one should get schooled in it if one wants to be more connected to the world.

Please give me an example of phrases that you are thinking of for which there is no English equivalent, and the context of which they absolutely must be communicated in one or two words, and cannot be effectively explained in English, and then maybe I will understand better what you mean. But solutions to our problems don't lie in the words we use, they lie in what is in our hearts and minds, and a different set of words won't allow us to trust each other, love ourselves, and to reject that which is not expedient in furthering not just our individual selves, but Kenya and the rest of East Africa. That's not words, that's ACTIONS.

Best,

Hill

- ati!
- aterere! (in kyuk)

but we get your point, the chinese have prospered without it by simply playing using their own rules. Patents, Interlectual property, Global Warming e.t.c.
Imagine we are signing treaties to reduce carbon emissions (a problem which was caused by the industrialization on Europe and America using fossil fuels). We should use our fair share of the same fuels first before we sign or implement any of them. we should burn all the coal in kitui to make cheap power to produce things that africans will use!
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
Jaina
#17 Posted : Sunday, August 07, 2011 8:13:34 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 5/13/2008
Posts: 558
@tycho

I Totally agree with you that ignorance is the biggest problem facing kenyans. However your conclusion that sheng can help to bridge the knowledge gap is incomprehensive.

masukuma
#18 Posted : Sunday, August 07, 2011 8:57:19 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
I think we should copy paste what China is doing!
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
tycho
#19 Posted : Sunday, August 07, 2011 10:24:56 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
@masukuma,

Indeed there is much for us to learn from the Chinese. And nothing will help us in our learning more than the conviction that we can solve our problems. We have what it takes!

@Jaina,

I'd love to work on the issue of using sheng more rigorously;with your help of course.
StatMeister
#20 Posted : Monday, August 08, 2011 9:23:54 AM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 5/23/2010
Posts: 868
Location: La Islas Galápagos
Lets try this: We have 569,140 sq. km, or 113 million acres of land.

* Sell all the land at 100k (USD 1k) per acre, fetching us a tidy 113 billion USD
* Pay off government debt USD 12 billion
* Divide the remaining money equally among 40m Kenyans = USD 2,500 per Kenyan
* Seek employment from the new owners of Kenya (we are employees anyways) or start a business located in Kenya, or better still, emigrate to Tanzania or Rwanda
A bad day fishing is better than a good day at work
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