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Kenya's ultimate solution
tycho
#1 Posted : Friday, August 05, 2011 4:35:49 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
The sum of all our problems is ignorance. Ignorance is the lack of knowledge of how to use time to meet our needs, for as Marx pointed out, the economic system is the base, the rest; superstructure.

We have this problem because our principal tool of thought- the English language,is very difficult to use. We take a very long time to learn it, and even longer to use it. And even more, very few of us are able to learn it.

This leaves us heavily reliant on others for technological solutions as we struggle to learn.

Since we cannot think for the starving in Turkana at all times, we need to help them get the power to name,even as we build them infrastructure.

And we can do this quickly by supporting and using sheng as the official language of technology, and constructing a new economic system centered on cyberspace.
2012
#2 Posted : Friday, August 05, 2011 5:32:26 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/9/2009
Posts: 6,592
Location: Nairobi
Forgive me but I totally disagree. The sum of all our problems the culture of laziness, greed and lack of vision - being comfortable with discomfort.

(c/p)
Japan has limited territory, 80%  mountainous, unsuitable for agriculture or farming, but is the second in worlds economy. The country is like an immense floating factory, importing raw material from the whole world and exporting manufactured products.

Switzerland, it does not grow cocoa but produces the best chocolates in the world. In her small territory she rears animals and cultivates the land only for four month in a year, nevertheless manufactures the best milk products. A small country which is an image of security which has made it the strongest world bank.

BBI will solve it
:)
tycho
#3 Posted : Friday, August 05, 2011 5:57:41 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
@2012,

Culture is about using time to meet needs.

If one cannot see how his/her needs will be met by manipulating what he has, then he/she is likely to be inactive- hence 'laziness.'

Greed comes out of insecurity. Insecurity rises with ignorance.

Lack of vision is nothing but the failure to foresee knowledge in action.

Since you say these are make the sum of our problems, and all come out of ignorance, then you agree with me totally.
2012
#4 Posted : Friday, August 05, 2011 6:19:34 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/9/2009
Posts: 6,592
Location: Nairobi
tycho wrote:
Since you say these are make the sum of our problems, and all come out of ignorance, then you agree with me totally.


No I still disagree. We're all born ignorant then life removes the ignorance from us by force. Why are people in Israel not dying and they live in a desert while Turkanas with the vast Lake Turkana are dying? The human race has been farming ever since existence so you can't tell me it's ignorance. And what might be your cure for ignorance if I may ask? Class rooms?

BBI will solve it
:)
tycho
#5 Posted : Friday, August 05, 2011 6:53:47 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
@2012,

It is difficult to show that we are born ignorant. As long as we perceive ourselves as cybernetic then we always have some knowledge.

Ignorance comes in out of alienation. That is, like in Kenya's case, people grow into ignorance.

If individuals are conscious of their needs, and in extension, they understand other people's needs, and this consciousness is mediated via communication links, then their ignorance is eliminated.

Individuals will fulfill the above if they have a language system that is easy to learn and understand, and one that is spread widely.
2012
#6 Posted : Friday, August 05, 2011 7:13:46 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/9/2009
Posts: 6,592
Location: Nairobi
tycho wrote:
@2012,
Ignorance comes in out of alienation.


Alienation by who? If you were in trouble would you sit and wait for someone who has no idea that you exist or who doesn't care about you to come and rescue you? I think there's a very thin line between stupidity and ignorance. How does your next door neighbour in the same social status as you and living in a mud hat manage to see his kids through college while yours become drunkard thugs? Just like the gospel of Jesus has gone around the earth so has information and choices.

BBI will solve it
:)
tycho
#7 Posted : Friday, August 05, 2011 7:36:25 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
@2012,

Alienation involves invalidating ones world view mostly through coercion. For example, a body politic x establishes taxation on a people y who have a different culture/world view. The people y are then forced to enter into relationships that give people x and their world view(s) priority.

True, information is all over, but our capacities to access, internalize and use this information are severely limited.

My neighbor may send her child to college while mine turns out to be a sot, but I don't think it follows that the former is better than the latter.

For example, some of our 'worst' leaders have college education.
2012
#8 Posted : Friday, August 05, 2011 7:45:08 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/9/2009
Posts: 6,592
Location: Nairobi
tycho wrote:
@2012,
Alienation involves invalidating ones world view mostly through coercion. For example, a body politic x establishes taxation on a people y who have a different culture/world view.


And that is how revolutions (peaceful or otherwise) are born.
A few examples include the slaves in America, Mau Mau in kenya, Ghandi in India, Mandela in SA etc. I really don't get how Turkanas can be staring at death every year and they cannpt all match to Nairobi and protest violently after all, what's the worst that could happen to them? Death?

BBI will solve it
:)
tycho
#9 Posted : Friday, August 05, 2011 8:37:38 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
@2012'

Revolutions? These are merely uprisings.

Even if one burnt himself outside the D.O's office, and roused anger violent and forceful enough to decapitate the President,one would still have to contend with the economic question, 'How will I meet my needs responsibly?

A failure to answer this question will lead to Robespierre's lament; 'We have failed to found freedom . . . '

Morozov sacrificing his father,but to what effect? Is Russia today as enviable as some would have wanted it to be?

But how can an one experience Revolution if there is no radical shift in consciousness?

The dearth of this consciousness is ignorance.
jasonhill
#10 Posted : Saturday, August 06, 2011 3:12:06 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 1/22/2011
Posts: 322
Location: Chicago, IL, USA
tycho wrote:
The sum of all our problems is ignorance. Ignorance is the lack of knowledge of how to use time to meet our needs, for as Marx pointed out, the economic system is the base, the rest; superstructure.

We have this problem because our principal tool of thought- the English language,is very difficult to use. We take a very long time to learn it, and even longer to use it. And even more, very few of us are able to learn it.

This leaves us heavily reliant on others for technological solutions as we struggle to learn.

Since we cannot think for the starving in Turkana at all times, we need to help them get the power to name,even as we build them infrastructure.

And we can do this quickly by supporting and using sheng as the official language of technology, and constructing a new economic system centered on cyberspace.


I completely, totally disagree with this.

English is the official language of business all over the world. And Kenyans speak English far better than much of the rest of the world, save of course for the US, UK, Australia, and Canada.

As you all know, I am very much for re-evaluating everything in our society to ensure that it is expedient as it pertains to the goal of furthering our cause and our mission, but to use sheng/slang, which even our EAC neighbors may not understand, and the rest of the global business community will certainly not understand, is beyond foolish.

If you have an issue with a subject or course that you learned since primary school, STUDY HARDER.

Our core issues are:

Confusion, Self-Doubt, and Self-Hate.

This is utter confusion. Ignore it. Just because one drops the "I" from "I am" doesn't mean that all is lost.

Best,

Hill
aemathenge
#11 Posted : Saturday, August 06, 2011 9:34:54 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 10/18/2008
Posts: 3,434
Location: Kerugoya
@2012 and @Tycho,

It is very rare these days to chance upon a thread where a good argument does not degenerate into insults and vulgarity.

I am deeply impressed. Well done gentlemen. You make me proud to be a citizen of the virtue republic of Wazua.

Well done gentlemen, well done.
tycho
#12 Posted : Saturday, August 06, 2011 10:36:27 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
@jasonhill,

I am not advocating for a substitution of English with sheng. But rather, my attempt is aimed to the many people who are not schooled enough to use english as a technological tool.

Besides, sheng has a dexterity that english does not have. 'We' can add words to the sheng dictionary, but can we do the same to an english dictionary?

Kenyans may be better english speakers than the Japanese, the Chinese, and the Indians, but this facility has surely not added much to our technological capacities.

We will speak fluent english when necessary, but we need a language of own to help us synthesize the vast amounts of information available on cyberspace, and to use it to solve our problems.

@aemathenge,

Thank you.
jasonhill
#13 Posted : Sunday, August 07, 2011 3:35:03 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 1/22/2011
Posts: 322
Location: Chicago, IL, USA
@Tycho,

Most of the internet is in English. All of the programming tools and languages are in English. The Operating systems and major software packages are in English, with usually poor translations into other mainstream languages. The fact that Kenyans have such a great grasp of the English language is what will allow Kenya, with proper vision and corporate leadership, to surpass India in Business Process Outsourcing.

To interface with the rest of the world, which is a requirement of every nation and every people now-a-days in order to remain relevant, connected, and to advance, one must use English, if for no other reason because it is a commonly-known language. If one isn't schooled in it, then one should get schooled in it if one wants to be more connected to the world.

Please give me an example of phrases that you are thinking of for which there is no English equivalent, and the context of which they absolutely must be communicated in one or two words, and cannot be effectively explained in English, and then maybe I will understand better what you mean. But solutions to our problems don't lie in the words we use, they lie in what is in our hearts and minds, and a different set of words won't allow us to trust each other, love ourselves, and to reject that which is not expedient in furthering not just our individual selves, but Kenya and the rest of East Africa. That's not words, that's ACTIONS.

Best,

Hill
tycho
#14 Posted : Sunday, August 07, 2011 4:53:34 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
@jasonhill,
I agree that the solutions to our problems lie in our minds and hearts, and that we need to trust each other, and more so, love one another.

But what lies in our hearts and minds, are beliefs,thoughts,expectations...things that are made of words.

In order to act we must first 'speak.'

There are very many Kenyans who have not gone past class 8 and are not so proficient in the use of the English language. Most of them are unemployed, and in many instances they are approaching unemployability.

Yet we need them to participate actively in making social and economic decisions that will raise their incomes, and generally improve their standards of living. How will we get access to them, without losing a lot of time taking them back to class to learn English?

Since developing Kenya needs both the 'well' educated and the 'less' educated working together, it follows that it is much easier for the former to 'bend' to the level of the latter than to have the latter rise to the level of the former; at least in the short term when costs are high and fixed.

It is very difficult to explain 'social network' to an average youth in Kibera, and it should be much harder in the 'nethers.' To do so you need metaphors that are common to him/her, and these metaphors are mostly in sheng, or can be very easily transmitted in sheng.

Finally, I think sheng as a language presents a world view. That it has been created and that it has evolved implies it's necessity. I believe that this necessity comes out of the need for a 'median world' in the context of the conflict between Western civilization, and our 'Black experience.'

By using sheng we will be getting closer to the rest of the world.
masukuma
#15 Posted : Sunday, August 07, 2011 6:02:47 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,821
Location: Nairobi
PLO summed it up in my signature! there in lies our problem.
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
masukuma
#16 Posted : Sunday, August 07, 2011 6:10:44 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,821
Location: Nairobi
jasonhill wrote:
@Tycho,

Most of the internet is in English. All of the programming tools and languages are in English. The Operating systems and major software packages are in English, with usually poor translations into other mainstream languages. The fact that Kenyans have such a great grasp of the English language is what will allow Kenya, with proper vision and corporate leadership, to surpass India in Business Process Outsourcing.

To interface with the rest of the world, which is a requirement of every nation and every people now-a-days in order to remain relevant, connected, and to advance, one must use English, if for no other reason because it is a commonly-known language. If one isn't schooled in it, then one should get schooled in it if one wants to be more connected to the world.

Please give me an example of phrases that you are thinking of for which there is no English equivalent, and the context of which they absolutely must be communicated in one or two words, and cannot be effectively explained in English, and then maybe I will understand better what you mean. But solutions to our problems don't lie in the words we use, they lie in what is in our hearts and minds, and a different set of words won't allow us to trust each other, love ourselves, and to reject that which is not expedient in furthering not just our individual selves, but Kenya and the rest of East Africa. That's not words, that's ACTIONS.

Best,

Hill

- ati!
- aterere! (in kyuk)

but we get your point, the chinese have prospered without it by simply playing using their own rules. Patents, Interlectual property, Global Warming e.t.c.
Imagine we are signing treaties to reduce carbon emissions (a problem which was caused by the industrialization on Europe and America using fossil fuels). We should use our fair share of the same fuels first before we sign or implement any of them. we should burn all the coal in kitui to make cheap power to produce things that africans will use!
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
Jaina
#17 Posted : Sunday, August 07, 2011 8:13:34 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 5/13/2008
Posts: 558
@tycho

I Totally agree with you that ignorance is the biggest problem facing kenyans. However your conclusion that sheng can help to bridge the knowledge gap is incomprehensive.

masukuma
#18 Posted : Sunday, August 07, 2011 8:57:19 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,821
Location: Nairobi
I think we should copy paste what China is doing!
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
tycho
#19 Posted : Sunday, August 07, 2011 10:24:56 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
@masukuma,

Indeed there is much for us to learn from the Chinese. And nothing will help us in our learning more than the conviction that we can solve our problems. We have what it takes!

@Jaina,

I'd love to work on the issue of using sheng more rigorously;with your help of course.
StatMeister
#20 Posted : Monday, August 08, 2011 9:23:54 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 5/23/2010
Posts: 868
Location: La Islas Galápagos
Lets try this: We have 569,140 sq. km, or 113 million acres of land.

* Sell all the land at 100k (USD 1k) per acre, fetching us a tidy 113 billion USD
* Pay off government debt USD 12 billion
* Divide the remaining money equally among 40m Kenyans = USD 2,500 per Kenyan
* Seek employment from the new owners of Kenya (we are employees anyways) or start a business located in Kenya, or better still, emigrate to Tanzania or Rwanda
A bad day fishing is better than a good day at work
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