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Oil prices will stay high
Mainat
#1 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 7:29:00 AM
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Joined: 11/21/2006
Posts: 1,590
In case you've been wondering (I doubt...),oil prices won't ever touch below $50 per barrel. Reasons being lower reserves than previously thought and the emerging econo mies where car ownership hasn't even reached peak. What does this eman for an economy like Kenya's where dependency on oil is a key economy driver?




www.mjengakenya.blogspot.com
Sehemu ndio nyumba
VituVingiSana
#2 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 7:39:00 AM
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Joined: 1/3/2007
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Location: Nairobi
Geothermal = Electricity = Hybrid (with electric batts that can be charged with an external source) vehicles

Greedy when others are fearful,Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase WB
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
Mainat
#3 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 7:44:00 AM
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Joined: 11/21/2006
Posts: 1,590
Which company is successfully producing those cars vvs/ And u forget that in Kenya we also use oil-based electricity (thermal something)...

www.mjengakenya.blogspot.com
Sehemu ndio nyumba
VituVingiSana
#4 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 8:30:00 AM
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I was just providing an (underfunded,underutilized) alternate to Kenya's generation needs...
**BVD of China (one of WB's investments) is into electric cars...
*** If Kenya can get geothermal up & running in 5 years... I have a strong feeling by 2015,there will be electric/hybrid cars available...
**** The latest generation Prius is a huge improvement over the 1st gen hybrids... & its a matter of time before hybrids (or maybe 100% electric cars) become available...

Greedy when others are fearful,Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase WB
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
VituVingiSana
#5 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 8:34:00 AM
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Posts: 18,221
Location: Nairobi
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BYD_Auto

Greedy when others are fearful,Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase WB
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
VituVingiSana
#6 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 8:41:00 AM
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Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 18,221
Location: Nairobi
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chevrolet_Volt

Greedy when others are fearful,Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase WB
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
VituVingiSana
#7 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 8:44:00 AM
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Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 18,221
Location: Nairobi
http://en.wikipedia.org/..._Plug-In_Hybrid_Concept

Greedy when others are fearful,Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase WB
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
kizee
#8 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 9:24:00 AM
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Joined: 1/9/2008
Posts: 537
with VVS

watch the documentary...who killed the electric vehicle...u wil see that an electric existed as early as the early 90s..however car companies realized that an electric car isnt very gud for business so GM pulled production..now strangely,most electric car batteries are owned by oil companies!
Kaigangio
#9 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 9:43:00 AM
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Joined: 2/27/2007
Posts: 2,768
the kenyan economy is sustantially dependent on oil in virtually all the sectors,be it manufacturing,agriculture,energy,transportation etc....any change in oil prices in the international market has a parralel effect on the economy....the saddest thing is that 25% of our energy requirements are purely oil based!

@ vitu,

i wonder how we would run our electric vehicles in a unreliable-power environment....similar scenarion to having no petro/diesel to run our vehicles.....


NEVER TALK OF A RHINO IF THERE IS NO TREE NEAREBY - ZULU PROVERB
...besides, the presence of a safe alone does not signify that there is money inside...
drake
#10 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 1:43:00 PM
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Joined: 8/8/2009
Posts: 170
With that in mind,perhaps the next question as an investor/trader or consumer would be how to profit from or hedge against it. To this regard,I doubt buying KNL &/or TTL is an optimal strategy if you're looking purely at oil/petroleum related companies.




http://www.cmegroup.com/...-day_quotes_globex.html






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Wally5
#11 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 2:31:00 PM
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Posts: 23
In the short term,yes,oil prices will remain high. However in the long term thing may change because oil fields that were previously uneconomical to exploit (deep sea rigs,tar sands) begin to make economic sense and supply and demand eventually balance out. By the way,diesel motis have crazy performance these days,fuel conscious maskinis such as myself should consider them.

1000%
VituVingiSana
#12 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 4:30:00 PM
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@kizee - which oil firms own which car firms?

Greedy when others are fearful,Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase WB
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
Mainat
#13 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 9:57:00 PM
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Joined: 11/21/2006
Posts: 1,590
VVS-still waiting for an answer. Who is commercially manufacturing these vehicles (and siyo hybrid or the electrical version as both are unsustainable)?
Oil prices simply have no reason to fall below $50 short of a combined US/China economic collapse.
Those oil fields were abandoned for a singular reason. They are uneconomic to either drill into or the refining process was too expensive. Yes prices may rise to levels that make the fields economic,but then we are talking last year's peaks.
Between now and whenever quantitative easing is slowed down or reversed,prices will be driven up artificially (i.e. bubble). Beyond that,world economic demand will logically take up the slack.
Kenyan oil companies (specifically NOCK) can buy more quantity now as a hedge for the economy or take an outright hedge on prices (lakini not KQ-style)...

www.mjengakenya.blogspot.com
Sehemu ndio nyumba
VituVingiSana
#14 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 11:37:00 PM
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Location: Nairobi
@mainat - Go read my answers... I will not re-post... And who said hybrids & electricals are 'unsustainable'? At a point either the cost of crude will rise or better/cheaper manufacturing kicks in... the price of hybrids/electric cars will be 'cheaper' to run than conventional cars...

Greedy when others are fearful,Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase WB
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
VituVingiSana
#15 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 11:43:00 PM
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Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 18,221
Location: Nairobi
@mainat - Yep,ur truly a diasporan... Kenya lacks any form of long-term storage beyond 60 days (I am being very generous here).
**__** KQ(like many other airlines) were caught flat-footed when the hedges went against them but I would not trust NOCK with hedges. ***** Ironically,the firm that was in the process of building new storage facilities was Triton! Since the ownership of these (half-built) tanks is under dispute/court cases... even the little hope we had is kaput...

Greedy when others are fearful,Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase WB
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
Mainat
#16 Posted : Thursday, November 12, 2009 3:52:00 AM
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Joined: 11/21/2006
Posts: 1,590
VVs- note HEVs are fuel efficient not non users of fuel. The key bit is that they still use fuel.
Larger storage facilities is only one way of hedging the fuel price. The other is buying hedges KQ style. Another is to hope we find our own oil. Lakini two of our neighbours already have oil so the best bet is to help them with refining in exchange for cheap fuel.
PS: saying so and so argues a certain way because they are Kikuyu,diasporan et al is erm pedestrian if not downright idiotic. Its no different from saying they argue that way because they are short,tall,or old...

www.mjengakenya.blogspot.com
Sehemu ndio nyumba
Ric dees
#17 Posted : Thursday, November 12, 2009 7:01:00 AM
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Joined: 3/6/2008
Posts: 632
Crude oil prices have been driven by the weakening of the U.S. dollar and rising optimism about prospects for a global economic recovery.

Oil prices have been fluctuating between $65 and $75 a barrel since the beginning of June,and many analysts saw the recent increase as a sign that prices would now fluctuate in a higher range. The rising price of oil has given a boost to oil drilling,and the rig count in the United States hit a six-month high last week.

One reason is that the dollar is incredibly weak against the euro,Because oil is priced in dollars,the cost of oil in euros or yen has changed little.


Success is not measured by what you accomplish,but by the opposition you have encountered and the courage with which you have maintained the struggle against the overwhelming odds'

The greatest danger in times of turbulence is not the turbulence; it is to act with yesterday's logic.
ispoa
#18 Posted : Thursday, November 12, 2009 7:18:00 AM
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Posts: 71
@ Ric

I would think that by the dollar having increadibly weakenedd to the Euro ( and most other major Currencies),then the Europeans or whoever would have a better purchasing power given that oil is priced in dollars?

I recall the Arabs wanting to Unpeg their currencies to the dollar sometime back as any downward spiral the USD takes,takes down their currency value & earning too.

As of Hybrid,I think Hyundai have a hybrid. By the way the Koreans are playing a leading role in the the cell technology for Hybrids / Pure electric vehicles.


When you do the common things in life in an uncommon way,you will command the attention of the world.

***********************

Indecision and delays are the parents of failure.

VituVingiSana
#19 Posted : Thursday, November 12, 2009 9:08:00 AM
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Joined: 1/3/2007
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Location: Nairobi
@mainat - The problem with (many) diasporans - I was one once - is the 'why not do this' or 'this is what you should do'... without knowing the issues/facts on the ground... Take the oil industry... I am well aware (u know what to look up) of the issues... and unless there is a MASSIVE rethinking of how to provide for our needs nothing will happen...

*** The MAXIMUM 'storage' we have is 60 days... a crude cargo 15 days late throws us into problems... KPC is a bloody mess... We can barely meet Kenya's needs & losing the growing Uganda,Rwanda,Congo market to S.Africa (Congo/Burundi) & Tanzania!

Greedy when others are fearful,Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase WB
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
Waria
#20 Posted : Thursday, November 12, 2009 9:37:00 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 10/11/2007
Posts: 213
@ All interesting topic
@ vvs very true..

The chinesse are on the verge of a major announcement from isiolo which could have significant ramifications on this discussion..Sorry to divert..but the history of oil is very interesting..before the internal combustion engine,oil was just a funny viscous stuff found in deserts. With all the funding into green energy..i think oil is on its way out..all the next gen cars,hoovercrafts etc are definately not petrol



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