Rank: Member Joined: 11/18/2010 Posts: 194 Location: Kenya
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Hi good people....
Of late I have been
watching this 'CHEATERS' program on kiss tv(IN PROTEST AGAINST THE SOAPS ON TV BEFORE PRIME NEWS)
Just wondering if this program is real or stage managed.
Is it workable in kenya?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 11/27/2007 Posts: 3,604
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80 percent stage mananaged but the rest is based on a story collected. That is my feeling. African parents don't know how to say sorry.. the closest you will get to a sorry is a 'have you eaten'
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/2/2009 Posts: 26,328 Location: Masada
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To me this is only possible in a movie... Its more or less similar to WWE Smackdown/Wrestling. Portfolio: Sold
You know you've made it when you get a parking space for your yatcht.
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Rank: Member Joined: 1/22/2011 Posts: 322 Location: Chicago, IL, USA
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Most Cheaters stories are fully stage managed... there isn't enough material to have a full show every time.
Some are real, however, they are very careful to edit the end result to remove violence and also their own interference in the outcomes. Their security has to intervene very quickly and long before the other party shows up- and this you don't see. The producer can be found liable civilly and even criminally liable if they instigate a fight, destruction of property, or worse... a murder.
People can pull guns and shoot in such highly-emotional situations, so you can see clearly why one would stage-manage or "re-enact" such situations carefully.
Either way, both the cheater and the one being cheated on get about $1000 to $3000 to either calm down or add more drama, and, they sign a non-disclosure agreement, waiver of rights, and also a broadcast agreement before they get the cash. They also get a US IRS 1099 so they have to pay taxes on the money.
There have been cases where things went bad, people got maced, and the episode didn't air... so it's easier to stage-manage as long as it looks authentic.
It works the same with court TV shows.
Yes it would work in Kenya, though I'm not sure what the networks will pay for such shows... I haven't looked into it. I don't know if television and music production pays well enough in EA for it to be worth my time personally.
But it would be BETTER in Kenya, because there isn't so much of a worry about liability, and Kenyans are far less violent than Americans, and, there are far less guns on the street. You'd see more fist-fighting and slapping than gun-play, so you could stage-manage less and have a real, exciting, visceral product... for only a few shillings per episode.
What would you call it? Chipsers?
A few Canon D5s on steadicams, a couple Sennheiser boom mics with deadcats and poles, a Tascam multichannel recorder, a MacBook Pro with Final Cut Pro and some battery-powered portable LED lighting rigs, and you are in business!
Kenya has new local content percentage laws, so there is certainly a market.
I've worked in domestic television production at Paramount Pictures, so if you are seriously interested in doing such productions in Kenya, let me know.
Best,
Hill
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/18/2011 Posts: 12,069 Location: Kianjokoma
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There was a wazuan who wanted to start his version of cheaters, hope he reads @jasonhills post.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 8/11/2010 Posts: 1,588
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Jason Hill should watch 'cobra squad'. 
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Rank: Elder Joined: 11/27/2007 Posts: 3,604
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jasonhill wrote:Most Cheaters stories are fully stage managed... there isn't enough material to have a full show every time.
Some are real, however, they are very careful to edit the end result to remove violence and also their own interference in the outcomes. Their security has to intervene very quickly and long before the other party shows up- and this you don't see. The producer can be found liable civilly and even criminally liable if they instigate a fight, destruction of property, or worse... a murder.
People can pull guns and shoot in such highly-emotional situations, so you can see clearly why one would stage-manage or "re-enact" such situations carefully.
Either way, both the cheater and the one being cheated on get about $1000 to $3000 to either calm down or add more drama, and, they sign a non-disclosure agreement, waiver of rights, and also a broadcast agreement before they get the cash. They also get a US IRS 1099 so they have to pay taxes on the money.
There have been cases where things went bad, people got maced, and the episode didn't air... so it's easier to stage-manage as long as it looks authentic.
It works the same with court TV shows.
Yes it would work in Kenya, though I'm not sure what the networks will pay for such shows... I haven't looked into it. I don't know if television and music production pays well enough in EA for it to be worth my time personally.
But it would be BETTER in Kenya, because there isn't so much of a worry about liability, and Kenyans are far less violent than Americans, and, there are far less guns on the street. You'd see more fist-fighting and slapping than gun-play, so you could stage-manage less and have a real, exciting, visceral product... for only a few shillings per episode.
What would you call it? Chipsers?
A few Canon D5s on steadicams, a couple Sennheiser boom mics with deadcats and poles, a Tascam multichannel recorder, a MacBook Pro with Final Cut Pro and some battery-powered portable LED lighting rigs, and you are in business!
Kenya has new local content percentage laws, so there is certainly a market.
I've worked in domestic television production at Paramount Pictures, so if you are seriously interested in doing such productions in Kenya, let me know.
Best,
Hill  cant agree more African parents don't know how to say sorry.. the closest you will get to a sorry is a 'have you eaten'
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Rank: Chief Joined: 8/24/2009 Posts: 5,909 Location: Nairobi
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Lolest! wrote:There was a wazuan who wanted to start his version of cheaters, hope he reads @jasonhills post. Yeah, been wondering where he disappeared to and whether his services were hired by the ladies....
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Rank: Member Joined: 1/22/2011 Posts: 322 Location: Chicago, IL, USA
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Well, I just watched the Cobra Squad trailer, as well as Episode 6 and 12, on YouTube... And... uh... Well... There were... uh... How should I say this kindly...  There are good ideas there. Some decent action sequences. And I like that the storylines feel relevant and "local". And I will say that there are some interesting choices of cinematography for each scene... uhhhhhhhhh.... Well ok... first, it seems to play out in soap-opera/TV Novela fashion, form, and style, which I think is inappropriate for an action/drama crime series. Second, I see that there is behind-the-camera talent, however, I will say flatly that the audio is low quality... there has to be more ADR and basic dialog replacement where audio isn't exactly pristine, and we always need to hear dialog clearly... just a small tip... When shooting outside, use a deadcat on the mics. When doing ADR, use a pop filter. Use a De-esser. They are $200. This always shocked me about even KTN and NTV... I can hear wind, breath, and "P" and "S" noises... plosives in the audio... but anyway... Third, the actors... well, I can't fault the actors because the camera keeps panning CONSTANTLY, even when there is dialog that should clearly frame in on actor's faces. Fourth, is this shot on video or film? If it's video, it needs to be at least 720p 24 frames, not 30fps interlaced standard def. Fifth, the score is good. But why is it constant? Where are the environmental sound effects and backing tracks? Sixth, is this an English show or a Swahili one? If it's English, then put subtitles in Swahili (and have a version for our French-speaking EAC partners). If it's Swahili, have English subtitles, where needed. Seventh... well, I could go on and on... I think that the show has potential, and that there is certainly talent in the show, but there is a lot of work that will have to take place in order to get the show mainstream and ready for primetime. But I can appreciate the work that has gone into it, and can appreciate the fact that it is a truly local, Kenyan show. But that doesn't excuse the fact that it could truly be a crossover, global hit IF the production chops were taken seriously. No one in the diaspora went to UCLA or NYU film school? Full Sail even? (not that I recommend Fool Sell) Or are they all shooting music videos... What is needed is that absolutely stunning, beautiful Kenyan television executive on this... uh whats-her-name? Lupita Nyongo... she'd get the production up to snuff. Whatever she wants to be paid, pay it. She's worth it. It's not even a factor of money... these changes can be done with some production discipline. Ah... uh... hmmm.... this probably isn't the forum for this, and I don't want go get too deep into it here... this is Wazua, and here, we talk money, so before I go any further... What are the networks paying production companies for a 13 Ep season? Ratings? Schedules? We can build a Kenyan Hollywood to rival Bollywood and Nollywood, but... Is it fiscally feasible? Best, Hill
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/18/2010 Posts: 194 Location: Kenya
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jasonhill wrote:Most Cheaters stories are fully stage managed... there isn't enough material to have a full show every time.
Some are real, however, they are very careful to edit the end result to remove violence and also their own interference in the outcomes. Their security has to intervene very quickly and long before the other party shows up- and this you don't see. The producer can be found liable civilly and even criminally liable if they instigate a fight, destruction of property, or worse... a murder.
People can pull guns and shoot in such highly-emotional situations, so you can see clearly why one would stage-manage or "re-enact" such situations carefully.
Either way, both the cheater and the one being cheated on get about $1000 to $3000 to either calm down or add more drama, and, they sign a non-disclosure agreement, waiver of rights, and also a broadcast agreement before they get the cash. They also get a US IRS 1099 so they have to pay taxes on the money.
There have been cases where things went bad, people got maced, and the episode didn't air... so it's easier to stage-manage as long as it looks authentic.
It works the same with court TV shows.
Yes it would work in Kenya, though I'm not sure what the networks will pay for such shows... I haven't looked into it. I don't know if television and music production pays well enough in EA for it to be worth my time personally.
But it would be BETTER in Kenya, because there isn't so much of a worry about liability, and Kenyans are far less violent than Americans, and, there are far less guns on the street. You'd see more fist-fighting and slapping than gun-play, so you could stage-manage less and have a real, exciting, visceral product... for only a few shillings per episode.
What would you call it? Chipsers?
A few Canon D5s on steadicams, a couple Sennheiser boom mics with deadcats and poles, a Tascam multichannel recorder, a MacBook Pro with Final Cut Pro and some battery-powered portable LED lighting rigs, and you are in business!
Kenya has new local content percentage laws, so there is certainly a market.
I've worked in domestic television production at Paramount Pictures, so if you are seriously interested in doing such productions in Kenya, let me know.
Best,
Hill Hapo umenena, like a guru....thanks
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Rank: Elder Joined: 8/11/2010 Posts: 1,588
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Good Jason Hill for watching bits of cobra squad. For Cheaters kenya version just might turn out to be similar.
There used to be this show by munene nyaga (hooray, I have forgotten its name) and it was the worst mathogothanio I have ever watched. He tried to copy Jay Leno and Conan O'brien.
Shirandula, Tahidi High, Changing Times and others are prime examples of good shows when hollywood is not copied.
There is no need to reinvent Joey Greco when there is already Ciku Muiruri with her 'busted' albeit just on radio.
This is not to discredit your obvious expertise with television.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/9/2009 Posts: 6,592 Location: Nairobi
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jasonhill wrote:Most Cheaters stories are fully stage managed... there isn't enough material to have a full show every time. What?! You can get enough material to have 5 shows in a day considering the advancement in technology and that it's estimated 70% of Americans in relationships cheat. If it's stage managed then the creators of this show are lazy. Btw the last time I watched this prog was like 5yrs ago. It was a total bore! Had no idea it's still airing.
BBI will solve it :)
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 4/4/2007 Posts: 1,162
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@ J Hill, how was it at Paramount? I wish we could get more quality local content on our TV's. The Nigerians seem to get it even though some of their productions are low quality. Where does Kenya not get it?
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Rank: Member Joined: 1/22/2011 Posts: 322 Location: Chicago, IL, USA
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2012 wrote:jasonhill wrote:Most Cheaters stories are fully stage managed... there isn't enough material to have a full show every time. What?! You can get enough material to have 5 shows in a day considering the advancement in technology and that it's estimated 70% of Americans in relationships cheat. If it's stage managed then the creators of this show are lazy. Btw the last time I watched this prog was like 5yrs ago. It was a total bore! Had no idea it's still airing. Hello 2012, There's cheating everywhere, but, it's extremely time consuming to find the the cheaters- you'd have to have some sort of relationship with them, or to solicit emails or calls, from which you would have to sift through thousands of responses, many of which would be fake or stage managed by people wanting to get on television. Then, you'd have to follow the cheater for days or even weeks in order to learn their patterns and catch them, then find someone willing to react with drama but not extreme violence... not to mention the cost of a private investigator along with a hidden TV crew working for days is astronomical. It would blow the show's budget to do this even half of the time, when for a few grand you can just pay stupid people to do stupid things, and capture it in a few hours. Best, Hill
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Rank: Member Joined: 1/22/2011 Posts: 322 Location: Chicago, IL, USA
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majimaji wrote:
@ J Hill, how was it at Paramount? I wish we could get more quality local content on our TV's. The Nigerians seem to get it even though some of their productions are low quality. Where does Kenya not get it?
Paramount was quite interesting, but was still pretty much like any other corporate job, except there were a LOT of gays and a LOT of drugs. Once you get into the daily routine of work, it's not at all exciting to work in Television. It's a lot of hard work, on strict budgets and tight deadlines, with many egomaniacal personalities. Work environment aside, the production quality at PAR Domestic Television was very high. Even though the writing was sometimes pedestrian, the quality of the production was always top-notch. Nigeria has done well with drama. They have armed themselves with cameras, lights, and the willingness to understand that it is a volume game- keep making movies until they catch on. Some will, some wont, but keep making them. And it works. Still, the production quality leaves a lot to be desired, especially in the area of cinematography. The lighting, lens choice, etc is usually a bit off even in the best of Nollywood productions. I guess I should just be happy that they have finally stopped using standard-def interlaced 30FPS video and analog editing. *sigh* As far as Kenya is concerned, first, you have to understand that TV and motion picture are fickle as far as whether or not they make money. It's easy to spend millions of dollars and have a poor show that advertisers hate. And there you are. That's why it's not usually a good investment for private companies to make, when there are less risky, more lucrative options. But, it's necessary to have a thriving media industry for propaganda, jobs, national pride, and simply to project "Brand Kenya". And lets not forget the artistic and cultural value. So, here are the steps for Kenya to build Mwailywood: 1. There are Kenyan students in the diaspora in the USA. A small number of them are dropouts, for whatever reason, and need a job, but had very high KCSE scores- smart kids that lost their way. Find a few of them, and get them a cheap apartment in Los Angeles and send them to UCLA film school. Send someone older from Kenya to keep an eye on them. When they are finished, bring them back to Kenya. Use force if you have to. This is your production team. -or- Bring over consultants from Los Angeles for a year. 2. Get some land. Build a backlot. It will need large godowns/warehouses (start with eight) with tall ceilings, catwalks, good, clean, plentiful power (or generators). Then build a "fake city" with roads, houses, 3-story fake high rise buildings... just the front of the buildings are needed. Once again, lots of clean stima will be needed, so plan for several transformers and maybe even its own substation. 3. Build a computer lab/editing bay, along with a camera and lighting rental depot. Contact me if you need a good, affordable equipment list. A dozen Macbook Pros with 24" monitors, and the equipment I listed above will do the trick. Canon D5s with an assortment of Zeiss lenses. KinoFlo lights. Reflectors. Flags, Floppies, Fingers, Cookies, stands and rigging, tripods, jibs... it will be a couple containers of stuff, and will run at least 40 mitas. As for audio, I know that there is audio talent in Kenya- Ogopa DJs releases good quality albums, and their equipment is rather limited... THAT is talent. 4. Hire Lupita Oyongo as the studio exec. 5. Google or call me for any questions. The biggest thing to focus on is cinematography, lighting and lens choices being the most important. Secondly, audio. Third, actors... and only third because there is acting talent already there... you can vet them in theatrical productions. Everything else you can Google or pay close attention to good productions, and mimic with practice. This, of course, isn't nearly a complete rundown on how, operationally, a world-class Television and Motion Picture Studio can be built and operated. My intention was just to spark some ideas in your head if you or someone you know is truly interested in doing this. Cheers, Hill
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