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Is Monogamy Natural?
bkismat
#1 Posted : Thursday, June 09, 2011 8:19:42 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 10/23/2009
Posts: 2,375
Too many 'Perfect Family Gentlemen' falling like a stack of dominoes.
It is better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you are a fool than to open it and remove all doubt...
-Mark Twain
dasany
#2 Posted : Thursday, June 09, 2011 8:55:47 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 7/25/2007
Posts: 58
From what I have seen and heard, it is proving un-natural.
McReggae
#3 Posted : Thursday, June 09, 2011 9:02:48 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/17/2008
Posts: 23,365
Location: Nairobi
All along I thought the question was if mahogany is natural!!!!
..."Wewe ni mtu mdogo sana....na mwenye amekuandika pia ni mtu mdogo sana!".
jasonhill
#4 Posted : Thursday, June 09, 2011 9:07:51 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 1/22/2011
Posts: 322
Location: Chicago, IL, USA
Men:

If you are a deacon or a bishop it is. 1 Timothy 3:12

Otherwise:

Genesis 1:28
Exodus 21:10
Deuteronomy 21:15
2 Samuel 5:13
1 Chronicles 3:1-9
1 Chronicles 14:3
1 Kings 11:3
2 Chronicles 11:21

Because you don't want this:

1 Corinthians 6:9-10
1 Thessalonians 4:3-5
Ephesians 5:1-3, 5

So, marry as many as you need to in order to avoid burning.

Besides, what CEO only has ONE direct report?


Women:

Monogamy always.


All:

I make no apologies for being a Christian that reads his bible.

You have to ask yourself:

Do you want to be like these great men that God himself chose in the bible,

or be "watered down and bound" by the West (monogamy is THEIR culture) that has condemned God's plan?

A West that would rather see abortion and gayism under the guise of "rights" and "progression" but refuses God's way? That embraces fornication and adultery in their music and movies all day every day, but condemns God's institution of marriage!

A West that would like to see "population control" and "family (destruction) planning" while they take fertility pills and use 14 times the resources of everyone else.

Do you believe in God or in man? Why put undue limits on yourself? Men are wired one way, and have their roles. Women another way and have their roles. The man is the CEO. The wife(s) are the CFO, COO, CSO, CAO, General Counsel, etc. just like in any successful organization.

This is controversial I know. So, I'm waiting for this to turn into a fiery discussion! But it is what it is, and successful, powerful men have their wives, publicly or privately.

Think LEGACY.

Best,

Hill
radio
#5 Posted : Thursday, June 09, 2011 9:33:46 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 11/9/2009
Posts: 2,003
jasonhill wrote:
Men:

If you are a deacon or a bishop it is. 1 Timothy 3:12

Otherwise:

Genesis 1:28
Exodus 21:10
Deuteronomy 21:15
2 Samuel 5:13
1 Chronicles 3:1-9
1 Chronicles 14:3
1 Kings 11:3
2 Chronicles 11:21

Because you don't want this:

1 Corinthians 6:9-10
1 Thessalonians 4:3-5
Ephesians 5:1-3, 5

So, marry as many as you need to in order to avoid burning.

Besides, what CEO only has ONE direct report?


Women:

Monogamy always.


All:

I make no apologies for being a Christian that reads his bible.

You have to ask yourself:

Do you want to be like these great men that God himself chose in the bible,

or be "watered down and bound" by the West (monogamy is THEIR culture) that has condemned God's plan?

A West that would rather see abortion and gayism under the guise of "rights" and "progression" but refuses God's way? That embraces fornication and adultery in their music and movies all day every day, but condemns God's institution of marriage!

A West that would like to see "population control" and "family (destruction) planning" while they take fertility pills and use 14 times the resources of everyone else.

Do you believe in God or in man? Why put undue limits on yourself? Men are wired one way, and have their roles. Women another way and have their roles. The man is the CEO. The wife(s) are the CFO, COO, CSO, CAO, General Counsel, etc. just like in any successful organization.

This is controversial I know. So, I'm waiting for this to turn into a fiery discussion! But it is what it is, and successful, powerful men have their wives, publicly or privately.

Think LEGACY.

Best,

Hill


@Hill, can you give a summary!
jasonhill
#6 Posted : Thursday, June 09, 2011 9:35:44 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 1/22/2011
Posts: 322
Location: Chicago, IL, USA
@radio, sure, Here's the Radio edit:

Akuku Danger. The hero of every man.
Dia
#7 Posted : Thursday, June 09, 2011 10:37:02 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 3/30/2010
Posts: 176
@jasonhill, a leader sets an example for the follwers to follow, right? Why would a deacon be required to have one wife if his followers can have as many as they wish?

Secondly, if monogamy is western culture and not God's plan, why did God create only one wife for Adam?


jasonhill
#8 Posted : Thursday, June 09, 2011 10:56:26 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 1/22/2011
Posts: 322
Location: Chicago, IL, USA
Dia wrote:
@jasonhill, a leader sets an example for the follwers to follow, right? Why would a deacon be required to have one wife if his followers can have as many as they wish?

Secondly, if monogamy is western culture and not God's plan, why did God create only one wife for Adam?




Deacons and Bishops are to have only one wife because they are not focused on building thier own homes and organizations. They have sacrificed that to build the house of Lord; they are called to do so. For us "non-levites", we are under no such restriction according to the bible; men are to have at least one.

The Lord God made first only Adam, them from Adam he made Eve. From there, mankind was capable of procreation. There was no need for multiple Eves as man's God-given instuction would create the generations. Had God intended monogamy for all He would have said so in His word. Yet his chosen Men were blessed with wives and the instruction to multiply was and should be fulfilled.

Best,

Hill
bkismat
#9 Posted : Thursday, June 09, 2011 10:59:49 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 10/23/2009
Posts: 2,375
Dia wrote:
@jasonhill, a leader sets an example for the follwers to follow, right? Why would a deacon be required to have one wife if his followers can have as many as they wish?

Secondly, if monogamy is western culture and not God's plan, why did God create only one wife for Adam?



Are you sure Adam had only one wife?
It is better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you are a fool than to open it and remove all doubt...
-Mark Twain
For Sport
#10 Posted : Thursday, June 09, 2011 11:09:38 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 12/23/2010
Posts: 1,229
Apparently, even sleeping in the same bed with someone else is not natural.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/5197440.stm
KenyanLyrics
#11 Posted : Thursday, June 09, 2011 11:30:52 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 4/16/2010
Posts: 906
Location: Nairobi
I actually think men who are honest enough to seek a second wife are quite commendable. This thing of sneaking around helps no one.
bwenyenye
#12 Posted : Thursday, June 09, 2011 12:15:58 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 5/24/2007
Posts: 1,805
jasonhill wrote:
Men:

If you are a deacon or a bishop it is. 1 Timothy 3:12

Otherwise:

Genesis 1:28
Exodus 21:10
Deuteronomy 21:15
2 Samuel 5:13
1 Chronicles 3:1-9
1 Chronicles 14:3
1 Kings 11:3
2 Chronicles 11:21

Because you don't want this:

1 Corinthians 6:9-10
1 Thessalonians 4:3-5
Ephesians 5:1-3, 5

So, marry as many as you need to in order to avoid burning.

Besides, what CEO only has ONE direct report?


Women:

Monogamy always.


All:

I make no apologies for being a Christian that reads his bible.

You have to ask yourself:

Do you want to be like these great men that God himself chose in the bible,

or be "watered down and bound" by the West (monogamy is THEIR culture) that has condemned God's plan?

A West that would rather see abortion and gayism under the guise of "rights" and "progression" but refuses God's way? That embraces fornication and adultery in their music and movies all day every day, but condemns God's institution of marriage!

A West that would like to see "population control" and "family (destruction) planning" while they take fertility pills and use 14 times the resources of everyone else.

Do you believe in God or in man? Why put undue limits on yourself? Men are wired one way, and have their roles. Women another way and have their roles. The man is the CEO. The wife(s) are the CFO, COO, CSO, CAO, General Counsel, etc. just like in any successful organization.

This is controversial I know. So, I'm waiting for this to turn into a fiery discussion! But it is what it is, and successful, powerful men have their wives, publicly or privately.

Think LEGACY.

Best,

Hill


Applause Applause Applause Applause Applause Applause Applause Applause Applause
I Think Therefore I Am
Dia
#13 Posted : Thursday, June 09, 2011 12:20:18 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 3/30/2010
Posts: 176
bkismat wrote:
Are you sure Adam had only one wife?


God created only one wife for Adam. In fact, when considering creating her, He said ' let us create a helper', not helpers.
mukiha
#14 Posted : Thursday, June 09, 2011 12:23:08 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/27/2008
Posts: 4,114
Weak men who cannot stick to their chosen wife will always look for ways to explain away their weakness... mara it is unnatural to commit to one woman, mara it is not biblical, mara it is against human rights etc etc...

bottom line is this: a man who cannot commit to his one wife is a weakling! An embarrassment to huMANity
Nothing is real unless it can be named; nothing has value unless it can be sold; money is worthless unless you spend it.
jasonhill
#15 Posted : Thursday, June 09, 2011 12:32:28 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 1/22/2011
Posts: 322
Location: Chicago, IL, USA
mukiha wrote:
Weak men who cannot stick to their chosen wife will always look for ways to explain away their weakness... mara it is unnatural to commit to one woman, mara it is not biblical, mara it is against human rights etc etc...

bottom line is this: a man who cannot commit to his one wife is a weakling! An embarrassment to huMANity


A man who cannot love, cherish, honor and commit to women that he has sex with is weak; he should honor them all by making them honest (married), honorable and successful women, and building a loving home for the women and her children. Look at what Akuku Danger has built- a legacy. Schools, estates, farms, businesses, children, grandchildren- Doctors, Lawyers, Professionals, Farm-keepers- all over the world. His name, his legacy cannot be put asunder for his most important assets- his wifes- are the cornerstone and foundation of his house, even after his death.

Wifes are to be honored. Their wisdom and business capability (the bible says this), along with their loyalty to their family is better than any business partner or executive team. Who here can do it alone!? The team is unshakable. How does one family starve or go without when there are many wives able and willing to be the true executive that they are and work to keep the house strong, the shamba producing, the fields harvesting, the computers working, the accounting accurate, the legal intact, the sales team in line...

God isn't a fool and He does not lie, or let HIS WORD return unto Him void. He knew what He was doing when He made us and men and women. And if you are to let modern foolishness keep us poor and incapable, while we sit in awe of the West and wonder why we can't be as blessed, so be it- your choice. Imagine if everyone build such a legacy as Akuku Danger... would ANYONE be hungry?

A strong man doesn't sneak. He is proud of his family. He is fruitful. He multiplies. You have to decide to be MEN before our society collapses trying in vain to do what we think "West" is doing, while they are commanding us to do one thing, and actually doing another, and watching while we fight each other in a storm of confusion, doubt, and self-loathing. All while the scripture is clear and pure.

Best,

Hill
Tebes
#16 Posted : Thursday, June 09, 2011 12:39:31 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 11/26/2008
Posts: 2,097
Solomon had 700 official landing rights and another 300 for away matches. David saw it not to jump from the balcony but ordered Bethsheba, the wife of Uriah, be brought to him.
"Never regret, if its good, its wonderful. If its bad, its experience."
Dia
#17 Posted : Thursday, June 09, 2011 1:12:43 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 3/30/2010
Posts: 176
jasonhill wrote:
Dia wrote:
@jasonhill, a leader sets an example for the follwers to follow, right? Why would a deacon be required to have one wife if his followers can have as many as they wish?

Secondly, if monogamy is western culture and not God's plan, why did God create only one wife for Adam?




Deacons and Bishops are to have only one wife because they are not focused on building thier own homes and organizations. They have sacrificed that to build the house of Lord; they are called to do so. For us "non-levites", we are under no such restriction according to the bible; men are to have at least one.

The Lord God made first only Adam, them from Adam he made Eve. From there, mankind was capable of procreation. There was no need for multiple Eves as man's God-given instuction would create the generations. Had God intended monogamy for all He would have said so in His word. Yet his chosen Men were blessed with wives and the instruction to multiply was and should be fulfilled.

Best,

Hill


@Hill, using your argument, had God intended polygamy for all men, He would have said so in His word. He hasn't.

Secondly, both Adam and Eve received the instruction to multiply. How did you arrive at the conclusion that the instruction included multiplication of spouses and that the latter was only applicable to men?

Thirdly, we learn what to do and what not to do from the bible. Judas committed suicide. Are we then to go and do likewise? Abraham and Isaac lied about their wives being their sisters and Jacob lied to his father Isaac yet they were 'his chosen men'. Are we then to deduce that lying is acceptable since it was done by the chosen men of God?

Lastly, if monogamy is western culture and not God's plan, why did God create only one wife for Adam?



dossy7
#18 Posted : Thursday, June 09, 2011 1:32:53 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/9/2009
Posts: 1,491
Location: Nairobi
Tebes wrote:
Solomon had 700 official landing rights and another 300 for away matches. David saw it not to jump from the balcony but ordered Bethsheba, the wife of Uriah, be brought to him.

Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly
Kenya ni yetu sisi sote
Rahatupu
#19 Posted : Thursday, June 09, 2011 3:34:51 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 12/4/2009
Posts: 1,982
Location: matano manne
@Mukiha,@Dia check this out: We live in communities and societies from where we acquire our customs and beliefs. The Bible arrived in most of our African societies in the late 18th century. Prior to this there existed cultures and customs that our people cherished, they still exist. We swallowed the culture of the white man with his religion (which are not necessarily identical) in taking along Christianity. In the case of monogamy we took the line of the minority, it is estimated that less than 18% of all cultures in the world are not monogamous {Murdoch GP quoted from Wikipedia}.

.....This means that monogamy is not now and probably never was the predominate mating system among the hominid lineage{Murdock GP (1981) Atlas of world cultures. University of Pittsburgh Press.}. Monogamy as we know it today evolved from European experience with the industrial revolution this similar to pre-Christian Roman era thinking can be enforced by the ruling class as was the case of Augustus Caesar who encouraged marriage and reproduction to force the aristocracy to divide their wealth and power among multiple heirs, but the aristocrats kept their socially monogamous, legitimate children to a minimum to ensure their legacy while having many extra-pair copulations. Betzig L (1992) Roman Monogamy.

mukiha
#20 Posted : Thursday, June 09, 2011 3:51:44 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/27/2008
Posts: 4,114
mukiha wrote:
Weak men who cannot stick to their chosen wife will always look for ways to explain away their weakness... mara it is unnatural to commit to one woman, mara it is not biblical, mara it is against human rights etc etc...

bottom line is this: a man who cannot commit to his one wife is a weakling! An embarrassment to huMANity

@Rahatupu; you have added a new excuse... it is not in our pre-history
Nothing is real unless it can be named; nothing has value unless it can be sold; money is worthless unless you spend it.
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