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Roads and SG
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rasilio
#61 Posted : Thursday, January 20, 2011 10:39:20 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 6/23/2010
Posts: 153
Location: FU
Obi 1 Kanobi wrote:


@Rasilio, I am not a big fan of Paul Melly and his management style, but I can assure you the guy is razor sharp.


He could have fooled me....Seriously.

@newfarer that is a point to take up in the Roads board.

you can also argue why was the national park curved out. Or why was mukuru slum curved out. Why not put the road on top of South B? The fact is, the constitution allows your damn sacred SG HOUSE to be curved out. Ten times over!
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newfarer
#62 Posted : Thursday, January 20, 2011 10:44:42 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/19/2010
Posts: 3,504
Location: Uganda
MS Ras, thanks for cleverly evading my question, just like our politicians.
Question 2 who allowed the buildings to be constructed when they knew that the land would be used for road expansion?They say the plans were there since 2006
Do we have one government?
punda amecheka
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KulaRaha
#63 Posted : Thursday, January 20, 2011 11:14:13 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/26/2007
Posts: 6,514
newfarer wrote:
rasilio wrote:
@newfarer are you suggesting the jam is caused by Libra house?Understand that even if you built the house 30 years ago or yesterday, the law on compulsory acquisition does not affect that. They will be paid...to move.

But I propose that they know that they may have no legal rights on that land.

Remember that that land they are on was public land before another regime came up. They have to show in court to get paid that they legally owned that land. If I go to court today and challenge that, SG will lose everything.

The politics is on their side.

Any land or property or expensive building in Kenya can be acquired by gov't for the public good. That includes SG HEADQUATERS! That is the law, that is the constitution of Kenya. It is not an ODM PARTY POLICY!



NO roundabout

But why was Libra house cleverly curved out of the New Road ?


I dont care about KTN or Standard Group. Im no engineer either, but the way Libra House has been excluded...hmmmmmm......
Business opportunities are like buses,there's always another one coming
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Intelligentsia
#64 Posted : Thursday, January 20, 2011 11:30:48 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 10/1/2009
Posts: 2,436
alma wrote:
....not the "true" owner of the land and know you may never be compensated for land irregularly acquired.



SG reportedly bought its current HQ from one giddy m-oh-one (one of SG's directors or shareholders at the time never mind corporate governance or conflict of interest issues) for a princely sum. Knowing how this boy operated them days it is unlikely he had a clean title to the property.
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newfarer
#65 Posted : Thursday, January 20, 2011 11:35:10 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/19/2010
Posts: 3,504
Location: Uganda
Intelligentsia wrote:
alma wrote:
....not the "true" owner of the land and know you may never be compensated for land irregularly acquired.



SG reportedly bought its current HQ from one giddy m-oh-one (one of SG's directors or shareholders at the time never mind corporate governance or conflict of interest issues) for a princely sum. Knowing how this boy operated them days it is unlikely he had a clean title to the property.


We are not talking of SG only !!!!!!!!!!!its 2.5 km and Libra house has been curved out why not apply the acquisition powers equally?
punda amecheka
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Wendz
#66 Posted : Thursday, January 20, 2011 12:41:15 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/19/2008
Posts: 4,268
thuks wrote:
Magigi wrote:
...Sammeer park will go down?


This may not necessarily happen but the plot it stands on is affected by the gazette notice.
Facts as stated by Ministers:
1.The acquisition plan is an old one
2.When the plan was being conceptualized, many of the developments had not taken place
3.The cost of acquisition may necessarily influence the implementation of the plan hence the meeting called to take place in March for the affected persons to present their views

:Reason should prevail--


Where was this government when these developments were coming up? Si they should have told them this land has been earmarked for compulsory acquisition and you can not develop anything on them.... and if you defy, you develop and the building will be brought down when that time comes at your own costs.... was that too hard to say? why wait till they are all set and then start all this hullabaloo... kweli sisi wakenya tunaona hapa kwa mapua tu!!!
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bwenyenye
#67 Posted : Thursday, January 20, 2011 12:56:27 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 5/24/2007
Posts: 1,805
@Wendz,

I think it is more like. The govt earmarked the plots from 2006 when they were vacant plots. These guys got wind of it and rushed to build. They know if the govt had taken them as vacant plots, they would not make much, but if they built on them and rush to move in or have 10 year leases registered in them e.g sameer, then there is alot more money from gava. Hapana cheza ni hiyo watu walikuwa wamekaa hapo na tusuti... That is what I have been trying to say. This is a big game to make more from the gava. I think they must have been informed early....

Why did SG group rush to move to an incomplete building just after signing a long term lease with I&M house ..... then proceeded to sublet their former offices...

Wazua is a collection of great minds, we should be able to see through this easily.. hapana kaa hapa shouting each other down on the legality or illegality of the whole episode. Let the journalists do their job ... and I hope one of us is gaining here not just playing the Fantasey market hoping to be a billionaire from the NSE! Here is how Billions are made
I Think Therefore I Am
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Wendz
#68 Posted : Thursday, January 20, 2011 1:10:57 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/19/2008
Posts: 4,268
bwenyenye wrote:
@Wendz,

I think it is more like. The govt earmarked the plots from 2006 when they were vacant plots. These guys got wind of it and rushed to build. They know if the govt had taken them as vacant plots, they would not make much, but if they built on them and rush to move in or have 10 year leases registered in them e.g sameer, then there is alot more money from gava. Hapana cheza ni hiyo watu walikuwa wamekaa hapo na tusuti... That is what I have been trying to say. This is a big game to make more from the gava. I think they must have been informed early....

Why did SG group rush to move to an incomplete building just after signing a long term lease with I&M house ..... then proceeded to sublet their former offices...

Wazua is a collection of great minds, we should be able to see through this easily.. hapana kaa hapa shouting each other down on the legality or illegality of the whole episode. Let the journalists do their job ... and I hope one of us is gaining here not just playing the Fantasey market hoping to be a billionaire from the NSE! Here is how Billions are made


Very true... i see all this and more. My question is, this same government approved those building plans, the same ministers/government passed there every morning going to inspect other roads - like mombasa road when the construction was ongoing, the same goverment officials passed there when going to the airport (and they go many times in a week if not a day).... what did they do to stop all this construction in good time to avoid the huge payouts... They had the mandate to stop the construction when it started.... i doubt these guys were working on their own... me thinks, someone in government is also benefiting.
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thuks
#69 Posted : Thursday, January 20, 2011 5:56:54 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 10/8/2008
Posts: 1,575
J.O suggested there was a wikileaks on the projectsmile
Government processes are usually very slow. Let us try to imagine the typical processes involved in this road construction:
1. Problem- traffic jam along mombasa road and adjoining roads
2. A research is commissioned to find the possible causes and possible solutions recommended
3. A committee sits to agree on one of the feasible solutions and hurrah; expand the 2.5km of the road
4. Design the road considering all parameters
5. Identify plots of land to be affected and quantify possible amount required to compensate owners
6. Notify the land ministry to acquire the said plots on behalf of the MOW or roads or whichever authority
7. Lands gazettes the intended acqusittion and dust from hell is raised by the owners
etc etc - where and who would have notified the owners before this point? No one is given this responsibility by the law because ALL LAND IN KENYA BELONGS TO THE GOVERNMENT.
No one can stop you from putting up a highrise building on the plot even the day before this intention is gazetted.
None of the above steps is likely to take less than several months!
I care!
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